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How were you verifying that the Morel lifters took two minutes to get oil past them?
Jebby
Not sure what you mean. I just started the engine and two minutes later there is oil coming out at the rockers.
I have also done testing with a drill on the oil pump. With the Morels it takes forever and with the Comp I have oil through very fast.
Also tried installing a bigger oil pump. Cold it will peak the pressure gauge in the car with the drill.
Last edited by Danish Shark; Jan 27, 2021 at 10:59 AM.
With a mild low lift HR cam I have installed solid rollers before. I Had to use standard length push rods and I went from 145 pound seat springs to 200 pound seat springs. Because of the mild lobes on a comp cams extreme series hr 242/248 I was able to use .012 /.014 lash.
Your running hot oil pressure determines the weight of engine oil required. HRollers get noisy with thin oil and low pressure. The oil bleeds off so fast that the lifter never pumps up so the lash opens up.
A leak down tester will show if your HR lifters are over adjusted causing leaky valves. It's really easy to adjust h lifters. Just never put a bind on the push rod when adjusting, your can roll the push rod in your fingers at Zero lash hot
Yes, maybe I should just keep the excisting cam or get a better HR cam and use the solid lifters on that.
Not sure what a leak down test of lifters is?
Not sure what you mean. I just started the engine and two minutes later there is oil coming out at the rockers.
I have also done testing with a drill on the oil pump. With the Morels it takes forever and with the Comp I have oil through very fast.
Also tried installing a bigger oil pump. Cold it will peak the pressure gauge in the car with the drill.
That's what I meant......spinning a drill or starting the engine. I bet money you had the wrong lifters.....some are made for Merlin blocks that require a higher oiling hole and taller overall.
I would get that oil pump out of there too......pegging the pressure gauge even spinning a drill is too much.
Yes, maybe I should just keep the excisting cam or get a better HR cam and use the solid lifters on that.
Not sure what a leak down test of lifters is?
This is doing my 396 ci sbc leak down test. Screw into the spark plug hole. supply a regulated 100 psi and the second gauge shows the percentage of leak. like around the rings or around the valves you would hear air coming out of the intake manifold. This is about 3 percent which is a super healthy new engine. I think it has about 10,000 miles on it so it is amazingly low leak down. for 1.5 mm racing rings and 7500 rpm all the time
That's what I meant......spinning a drill or starting the engine. I bet money you had the wrong lifters.....some are made for Merlin blocks that require a higher oiling hole and taller overall.
I would get that oil pump out of there too......pegging the pressure gauge even spinning a drill is too much.
Jebby
According to the invoice they are supposed to be Morel #5373 ("street performance"?), but maybe he put the wrong ones in the box.
Yes, replacing the pump with the regular one I had in there originally is on the to-do list! Now I'm hoping someone will buy my fancy $400,- oil pump
This is doing my 396 ci sbc leak down test. Screw into the spark plug hole. supply a regulated 100 psi and the second gauge shows the percentage of leak. like around the rings or around the valves you would hear air coming out of the intake manifold. This is about 3 percent which is a super healthy new engine. I think it has about 10,000 miles on it so it is amazingly low leak down. for 1.5 mm racing rings and 7500 rpm all the time
Oh right, a cylinder leak test. I got that information twisted in my head and was thinking how do you make a leak test of a hydraulic lifter
I actually bought a leak down tester, but never go around to using it.
Do you have the Morels and the Comps to look at on a table?
Jebby
Unfortunately I can't get to them right now as I don't have the car at home.
I did compare them next to each other. The Comps are quite a bit shorter, but the grooved area for the oil channel is more or less at the same distance from the roller. The groove on the Comps is much deeper than in the Morels though.
Danish, the 5373 is a pair of the 5374. These street lifters are sensitive to duration and lift limitations. I would check all the exhaust ones because they maybe the issue. I would go with the 4603 as they are made for more lift and duration. They are not cheap though like the street version was.
if you wanted to go solids I think I saw a recent engine masters where they did that without issues.
Thank you everone for answering.
I will probably go with gkull's suggestion about retarding the camshaft and then see where that takes me. At least with the solids I know what I am dealing with when making adjustments.
Then maybe later change to one of the Schneider camshafts if I am still not happy.
Is it feasible that the cam has been ground incorrectly? - some of the lobes perhaps ground 'out of sync' with others? - is it possible to use a degree wheel and finger gauge of some kind to check the opening/closing/lift characteristics of each lobe in turn and compare? - just wondering?
Is it feasible that the cam has been ground incorrectly? - some of the lobes perhaps ground 'out of sync' with others? - is it possible to use a degree wheel and finger gauge of some kind to check the opening/closing/lift characteristics of each lobe in turn and compare? - just wondering?
If you saw how cams are made that's not a possibility. Only a few places make cam blanks. So the rough lobes are there and they get machined down to what ever vendors product.
Ive measured the timing of all my custom cam lobes before. There's always a margin of error, but ive seen variations of nearly 3 degrees between lobes. Like one was almost +2 degrees and another was just over-1 . You can see errors just degree in a cam
If you saw how cams are made that's not a possibility. Only a few places make cam blanks. So the rough lobes are there and they get machined down to what ever vendors product.
Ive measured the timing of all my custom cam lobes before. There's always a margin of error, but ive seen variations of nearly 3 degrees between lobes. Like one was almost +2 degrees and another was just over-1 . You can see errors just degree in a cam
You might want to consider looking into Redline, you won't find any variations.
I had a bbc Howard’s hyd roller that came with a tech sheet showing measured variation in 10/1000 of inch between lobes and base circle. Don’t know if they still do that or not but it was the only one I’ve ever seen.
Got working on it again after being out of commission for while after getting to close to someone with C19 (I didn't catch it but couldn't leave the house).
Intake gasket looked good and dry, no signs of oil being sucked in and a nice imprint of the intake all arround. I don't believe i've had any issue with vacuum leaks here.
