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careful, those manifold bolts are not meant to be too tight!
I won't toss them, but like all the other original stuff, I just keep boxing it in the event someone wants to convert it back to stock. Probably a waste of time for me as not too many people seem to care if a late model C3 is all original. I'll shoot a photo or two of the driver's side assuming there are any shields still on it.
I started to play with look at the job today, just to see see what might be in the way. One thing that's OK, given being on the kwik-lift with the rear still on the floor but the front on the stands, it appears the to of the fuel in the tank is below the bottom of the pump which is 30" above the garage floor right now. So I shouldn't have to deal with fuel running out.
And then the first hitch, the armor on the S-line to the carb is so thick I can barely get a line wrench to clear it. And then when I do it barely seems to get on the fitting. Question one, is the fitting 5/8". That's the wrench I can get on it.
Second question, should I heat the fitting to break it free - just kidding, though it might be appropriate for the 4th .
Real second question, before I pull the tire to access things better will turning the steering right or left get the linkage out more out of the way so I have any more freedom to get a wrench up in there and turn it?
I used for the pump extensions and flex socket but memory thinks you can get on bolts..it is easier with wheel off and come from top and or outside..
the s hose question i do not understand..the s rubber hose is from line to pump.
if your talking metal line to carb..i dont remember difficulty and what flare wrench. You may need to bend to fit new pump as it likely will be shorter..maybe remove rubber first? Get ready for gas in lines..
should be clear shot? Leave 90 on the pump just take off steel line…swap 90 on new pump on bench, note location..when assembling start lines while pump loose so it threads easier…I don’t remember but may have removed from carb too..
I used for the pump extensions and flex socket but memory thinks you can get on bolts..it is easier with wheel off and come from top and or outside..
the s hose question i do not understand..the s rubber hose is from line to pump.
if your talking metal line to carb..i dont remember difficulty and what flare wrench. You may need to bend to fit new pump as it likely will be shorter..maybe remove rubber first? Get ready for gas in lines..
should be clear shot? Leave 90 on the pump just take off steel line…swap 90 on new pump on bench, note location..when assembling start lines while pump loose so it threads easier…I don’t remember but may have removed from carb too..
Thanks, I used the wrong term - meant the carb line.
Last edited by vince vette 2; Jul 4, 2021 at 08:44 AM.
Couldn't get the pump to carb line to come out without twisting despite several days of penetrating oil, tapping, wiggling, etc. So, now need a new one. Recommendations on vendors whose lines actually fit or are reasonably close.
Couldn't get the pump to carb line to come out without twisting despite several days of penetrating oil, tapping, wiggling, etc. So, now need a new one. Recommendations on vendors whose lines actually fit or are reasonably close.
i would stay steel not stainless and use supporting vendor of choice.. look for the jacketed (spring like) covers too.. make sure brass 90 not bugared too... they sell those as well..
i would stay steel not stainless and use supporting vendor of choice.. look for the jacketed (spring like) covers too.. make sure brass 90 not bugared too... they sell those as well..
Thanks. After dealing with stainless brakelines, even after shipping them my originals so they could try a second time to bend them properly, I decided never again. Just too hard to get those small final tweaking bends to get the nuts to align. The original steel lines were still in decent shape after 90k miles and 35 years so in most cases I don't see the benefit of stainless. Meanwhile I have a whole set of SS fuel lines in a box in the basement. But they didn't come with the pump to carb line. .
Couldn't get the pump to carb line to come out without twisting despite several days of penetrating oil, tapping, wiggling, etc. So, now need a new one. Recommendations on vendors whose lines actually fit or are reasonably close.
Just a note for completeness to the thread. Before destroying the pump to carb line, I did run the the engine and poke around underneath with my stethoscope, aka siphon hose. On the cast part of the pump, i.e. section that bolts to the engine, the sound was loud and clear - repetitive knocking. And I do mean knocking. So, from what I read up on in order of best to worst scenarios:
Just a note for completeness to the thread. Before destroying the pump to carb line, I did run the the engine and poke around underneath with my stethoscope, aka siphon hose. On the cast part of the pump, i.e. section that bolts to the engine, the sound was loud and clear - repetitive knocking. And I do mean knocking. So, from what I read up on in order of best to worst scenarios:
worn out pivot on the actuator - replace pump
damaged push rod - replace pushrod and pump
damaged cam lobe - complete engine OH/upgrade
engine rod - complete engine OH/upgrade
pull rod and inspect ( i like to make sure the same side is back in) betting you will never find obvious reason even on pump inspection.. its the pump (hoping) with stethoscope you really know and will hear it on the actual fuel lines..
From: At my Bar drinking and wrenching in Lafayette Colorado
From a post I have done earlier:
Here is what you need to do:
Find the #1 plug wire on your distributor cap and make note of the position of the #1 tower.
Pop the distributor cap off and then "bump" the engine over (using the starter) until the rotor points to the #1 tower position.
Put the cap back on
Remove the old fuel pump
Remove the plug bolt from the front of the engine block for the fuel pump pushrod hole location. All small block Chevys have this bolt:
Using your fingers, needle nosed pliers, or a screwdriver, push the fuel pump pushrod upwards until it hits the camshaft eccentric. It should move upwards about an inch from its current "dropped-down" position. Hold it there.
Install a fully-threaded 2" long bolt into the hole that you pulled the plug bolt out of. Tighten the bolt until you feel it hitting and jamming the pushrod.
Install your new fuel pump and snug it down.
Remove the 2" long jam bolt and re-install the stock plug bolt.
I just replaced my fuel pump. I left the plate behind the pump in place and had no issues. I was also replacing my pushrod with a brass tipped one due to a new roller cam but I just pushed it in the hole and slipped the pump arm in front of it.. The whole job took about an hour including replacing the s shaped lines I did use the carter stock replacement. I guess we shall see how long it lasts. I put an AC delco one in there 8 years ago but the fuel line outlet was practically hitting the A arm support and the pressure was a bit higher (had to raise it on the regulator after the swap) So I decided to swap with the stock style. I did use black braided fuel hose with an connectors myself from the holley regulator to the pump. The filter is built into my fuel supply rail
Last edited by augiedoggy; Jul 9, 2021 at 11:02 AM.
Jebby - new carb to pump line from Inline will be here tomorrow.
Lars - Thanks for the step by step.
Auggie - how are things in N. Tonawanda? Maybe I noticed that was your location before. I don't recall. I grew up one town east of Batavia.
Current status on the job. I followed Lars's steps up to:
Using your fingers, needle nosed pliers, or a screwdriver, push the fuel pump pushrod upwards until it hits the camshaft eccentric. It should move upwards about an inch from its current "dropped-down" position. Hold it there.
I am finding it impossible to get hold of the pushrod and lift it. It seems that the front is buried in the bottom corner of the backer plate. I cannot push it up toward the cam to get some distance between it and the backer plate so I can pull the front up.
I double checked the distributor position and it is pointing at the post for #1 cylinder. Am I missing something here?
My other item is that now having the pump off I can see that the new one, an Airtex from Rock Auto, is about 1/2" longer than the old, i.e. the bottom extends lower on new than the old. Also, the clocking is a little different. I assume these issues will make it problematic to attache to a reproduction carb line. Any thoughts on one that might be closer to original?
clearly a different angle between the mount plate and line fitting.
As for any immediate sign of failure, nothing is obvious. I might try to sneak it into our CT X-ray for a look at it's innards.
Last edited by vince vette 2; Jul 11, 2021 at 09:15 PM.
You do plan on removing the brass elbow and reusing right? I searched High and low for mine since I had a different pump on mine (taller like you new pump but with the threaded fitting oriented differently.) and when I found it I found, with the AN fitting I had purchased including the 90degree fittings, that I didnt need it. If your planning on using a hardline to a quadrajet from the pump you will need modifications but if you plan on using a rubber line of some sort you should be ok.
Last edited by augiedoggy; Jul 11, 2021 at 10:15 PM.
You do plan on removing the brass elbow and reusing right? I searched High and low for mine since I had a different pump on mine (taller like you new pump but with the threaded fitting oriented differently.) and when I found it I found, with the AN fitting I had purchased including the 90degree fittings, that I didnt need it. If your planning on using a hardline to a quadrajet from the pump you will need modifications but if you plan on using a rubber line of some sort you should be ok.
Yes, I will remove. I want to mark its angle though for reference when I put in the new line. As for going to a rubber line, I'm trying to avoid another change, hence looking for a replacement pump that is actually a replacement.
I am finding it impossible to get hold of the pushrod and lift it. It seems that the front is buried in the bottom corner of the backer plate. I cannot push it up toward the cam to get some distance between it and the backer plate so I can pull the front up
.
Take the plate off, then push the rod up and put the holding bolt in. You can make a new gasket for the plate.
put some grease in there too around lever. i think one time i even used a tube of gasket maker. (or buy one)
when pump loosely installed screw in the lower with top loose.. there is some wiggle bend room and then make sure clearly aligned for carb connection...
put some grease in there too around lever. i think one time i even used a tube of gasket maker. (or buy one)
when pump loosely installed screw in the lower with top loose.. there is some wiggle bend room and then make sure clearly aligned for carb connection...
Yeah, I figured that would be the quickest route, pull the plate, at least the quickest to deal with the rod. But as for getting the bolts back in with the pump in the way ...
Original note: "Anyway, on that Carter unit you have, could you measure the bottom from the crimp ring to the base to see if the height is closer to the original pump which is 1-15/16" from the bottom of the crimp ring to the bottom of the reservoir."
Now: I don't think you need you to check. I'm pretty sure that despite coming in an Airtex box, the part Rock Auto sent me is a Carter pump as it had the Carter p/n on the part. These guys don't even bother putting their names on them anymore.
So now I guess I start driving from parts store to parts store until I find one that matches. On the bright side, the fuel line from Inline looks exact.
Last edited by vince vette 2; Jul 12, 2021 at 01:21 PM.
Yeah, I figured that would be the quickest route, pull the plate, at least the quickest to deal with the rod. But as for getting the bolts back in with the pump in the way ...
Original note: "Anyway, on that Carter unit you have, could you measure the bottom from the crimp ring to the base to see if the height is closer to the original pump which is 1-15/16" from the bottom of the crimp ring to the bottom of the reservoir."
Now: I don't think you need you to check. I'm pretty sure that despite coming in an Airtex box, the part Rock Auto sent me is a Carter pump as it had the Carter p/n on the part. These guys don't even bother putting their names on them anymore.
So now I guess I start driving from parts store to parts store until I find one that matches. On the bright side, the fuel line from Inline looks exact.
you seen my threads trying to find one…even an alarm on ebay…same ole crap
(hoping) with stethoscope you really know and will hear it on the actual fuel lines..
put some grease in there too around lever. i think one time i even used a tube of gasket maker. (or buy one)
