t56 and ls swap.
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 14
Likes: 4
t56 and ls swap.
hello all!
I went to school out of state for a few years and when I got back my father gave me his 1979 corvette, he loved his old 454 manual and cant stand how low power his current one (chevy 350) is, he thought I could do more with it. He wants to put a 5.3l l33 ls in it as well as a t56 transmission.
this is what I have planned so far:o L33 ($1500) 100k miles (over estimate)
o Intake manifold (430) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-226122)o Swap kit ($3600) (https://www.brphotrods.com/p/ls-engine-swap-kits.html) (no a/c)
o Bottom end rebuild kit ($800) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/f...make/chevrolet) (with main bearings)
o High lift cam cam ($150) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12638427) (higher lift = more power)
o Valve springs (allow us to run .550 inch lift on cam) ($160) (allow use for higher lift cam)
o Rocker arm upgrade (required for higher lift and heavier springs) ($165) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-141560)
o Efi kit (https://fitechefi.com/product/ultima...tandalone-ecu/) ($1000)
o Cylinder heads ($1300) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...s#applications)
o Oil pan ($211) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...make/chevrolet)
i was also going to take the l33 to a machine shop and have the cylinder bored and honed .03 over. ($250)
this is all fine and dandy... but I'm completely clueless how to swap the automatic transmission to a manual t56.
there are kits but they run over $8k.
if I have the parts i can probably build the legos, but I don't even know what parts I would need. I would hate to part it out then need to spend another $3000 on a bell housing or whatever.
I went to school out of state for a few years and when I got back my father gave me his 1979 corvette, he loved his old 454 manual and cant stand how low power his current one (chevy 350) is, he thought I could do more with it. He wants to put a 5.3l l33 ls in it as well as a t56 transmission.
this is what I have planned so far:o L33 ($1500) 100k miles (over estimate)
o Intake manifold (430) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-226122)o Swap kit ($3600) (https://www.brphotrods.com/p/ls-engine-swap-kits.html) (no a/c)
o Bottom end rebuild kit ($800) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/f...make/chevrolet) (with main bearings)
o High lift cam cam ($150) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12638427) (higher lift = more power)
o Valve springs (allow us to run .550 inch lift on cam) ($160) (allow use for higher lift cam)
o Rocker arm upgrade (required for higher lift and heavier springs) ($165) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-141560)
o Efi kit (https://fitechefi.com/product/ultima...tandalone-ecu/) ($1000)
o Cylinder heads ($1300) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...s#applications)
o Oil pan ($211) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...make/chevrolet)
i was also going to take the l33 to a machine shop and have the cylinder bored and honed .03 over. ($250)
this is all fine and dandy... but I'm completely clueless how to swap the automatic transmission to a manual t56.
there are kits but they run over $8k.
if I have the parts i can probably build the legos, but I don't even know what parts I would need. I would hate to part it out then need to spend another $3000 on a bell housing or whatever.
Last edited by noboi4; May 26, 2023 at 09:50 AM. Reason: grammar.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,989
Likes: 198
From: Meriden CT
You can modify the existing trans xmember, and shorten the existing driveshaft. I did this with a T56 from a LT1 Camaro, I know there are differences from the LS cars. I used the clutch and hydraulics from the Camaro, but I needed a "swap" flywheel that was friggin expensive. One thing I didn't like about it was I didn't get the pedal ratio right. It was about 4:1 and needs to be about 6:1 to be comfortable, and not put ALOT of pressure on the firewall. Another was I had the trans all the way up in the tunnel as high as I could without hitting to try and get the driveshaft angle right. It was not within a "good" spec, but I never got any vibration from it even at 120 MPH. Personally I'd go with a good running used motor and leave it alone internally, but it sounds like the budget is not a priority for you, good for you!
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 11,944
Likes: 4,506
From: Virginia
This may have been lost in the intro, but the 79 has an L48 Auto, presumably? Please post some photos!
Yes, you can save a few bucks by assembling a manual swap kit yourself. However, the SST kit is complete, and can be used on an LS, with the appropriate flywheel and bellhousing. If you go with a used 4-speed, for example, you can get on the road faster and cheaper, then save for a 5 or 6 speed if you think you need it. Keep your eye out for someone selling the pedals on this Forum, or eBay.
Do you already have the L33? You might just want to do the swap first, before you get hung up on throwing thousands at hopping it up. With your build list, you are already approaching the price of an LS3 crate engine.
Yes, you can save a few bucks by assembling a manual swap kit yourself. However, the SST kit is complete, and can be used on an LS, with the appropriate flywheel and bellhousing. If you go with a used 4-speed, for example, you can get on the road faster and cheaper, then save for a 5 or 6 speed if you think you need it. Keep your eye out for someone selling the pedals on this Forum, or eBay.
Do you already have the L33? You might just want to do the swap first, before you get hung up on throwing thousands at hopping it up. With your build list, you are already approaching the price of an LS3 crate engine.
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 14
Likes: 4
You can modify the existing trans xmember, and shorten the existing driveshaft. I did this with a T56 from a LT1 Camaro, I know there are differences from the LS cars. I used the clutch and hydraulics from the Camaro, but I needed a "swap" flywheel that was friggin expensive. One thing I didn't like about it was I didn't get the pedal ratio right. It was about 4:1 and needs to be about 6:1 to be comfortable, and not put ALOT of pressure on the firewall. Another was I had the trans all the way up in the tunnel as high as I could without hitting to try and get the driveshaft angle right. It was not within a "good" spec, but I never got any vibration from it even at 120 MPH. Personally I'd go with a good running used motor and leave it alone internally, but it sounds like the budget is not a priority for you, good for you!
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 14
Likes: 4
This may have been lost in the intro, but the 79 has an L48 Auto, presumably? Please post some photos!
Yes, you can save a few bucks by assembling a manual swap kit yourself. However, the SST kit is complete, and can be used on an LS, with the appropriate flywheel and bellhousing. If you go with a used 4-speed, for example, you can get on the road faster and cheaper, then save for a 5 or 6 speed if you think you need it. Keep your eye out for someone selling the pedals on this Forum, or eBay.
Do you already have the L33? You might just want to do the swap first, before you get hung up on throwing thousands at hopping it up. With your build list, you are already approaching the price of an LS3 crate engine.
Yes, you can save a few bucks by assembling a manual swap kit yourself. However, the SST kit is complete, and can be used on an LS, with the appropriate flywheel and bellhousing. If you go with a used 4-speed, for example, you can get on the road faster and cheaper, then save for a 5 or 6 speed if you think you need it. Keep your eye out for someone selling the pedals on this Forum, or eBay.
Do you already have the L33? You might just want to do the swap first, before you get hung up on throwing thousands at hopping it up. With your build list, you are already approaching the price of an LS3 crate engine.
I dont have the l33 yet, I was going to go to the junkyard this weekend (the day after tomorrow) what ls3 crate engine can I get for that price? The chevy performance one is $10k and the blue print engines is $7k and they would both need more parts to put in the corvette.
Yes it has the stock automatic transmission. I dont want to swap it so much for the sake of better fuel milage or anything, I just prefer driving manual.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 11,944
Likes: 4,506
From: Virginia
I dont have the l33 yet, I was going to go to the junkyard this weekend (the day after tomorrow) what ls3 crate engine can I get for that price? The chevy performance one is $10k and the blue print engines is $7k and they would both need more parts to put in the corvette.
Yes it has the stock automatic transmission. I dont want to swap it so much for the sake of better fuel milage or anything, I just prefer driving manual.
Yes it has the stock automatic transmission. I dont want to swap it so much for the sake of better fuel milage or anything, I just prefer driving manual.
https://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stor...0002&langId=-1
You'll still need an ECM, intake, and all of the fuel stuff, but you can use truck spacing accessories, that you can get at the junkyard.
I picked up an LS6 long block, and am following the suggestions in this thread for making everything fit.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...completed.html
The manual is the key. You might even want to do that first. It is a night and day difference in how much fun the car is to drive.
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Verdad Gallardo
Pro
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 704
Likes: 503
From: Temple, TX
That LS9 cam you chose is a poor choice for a naturally aspirated combination like what you are assembling. The LS9 cam was intended to be used with a positive displacement blower (like the Eaton that came on the C6 ZR1) to make up for the soggy bottom end that cam would produce on an N/A engine. If you want to stick with a "factory" LS cam, use the LS6 cam or a copy of it. The LS6 cam was one of the more aggressive cams to come in a N/A LS and still has OEM stock-levels of driveability and idle quality. There are of course lots of options other than factory cams if you want a power bump but want to keep lift moderate (.550" range) and keep driveability and idle quality tame. Those options will also most likely be cheaper than a factory cam.
Will the LS9 cam make more top end than an LM7 cam? Sure! But its gonna kill torque and power below 4500rpm and you'll have to really wring it out up to to see that power benefit.
LS6 Cam: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12565308
LS9 cam on a 5.3L:
Will the LS9 cam make more top end than an LM7 cam? Sure! But its gonna kill torque and power below 4500rpm and you'll have to really wring it out up to to see that power benefit.
LS6 Cam: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12565308
LS9 cam on a 5.3L:
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 961
Likes: 275
From: Frederick MD
Personally I would do some work to the 350 and get it where you would want it HP wise and then look into the transmission. With that said if you’re still dead set on a LS swap you don’t have to fuel inject it.
You can actually run a mechanical fuel pump and old school dizzy with a carb on one of these with this conversion piece. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/n...yABEgIBlfD_BwE
To some the point of a swap is to gain the fuel injection component but figured I’d throw that out there.
You can actually run a mechanical fuel pump and old school dizzy with a carb on one of these with this conversion piece. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/n...yABEgIBlfD_BwE
To some the point of a swap is to gain the fuel injection component but figured I’d throw that out there.
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 14
Likes: 4
That LS9 cam you chose is a poor choice for a naturally aspirated combination like what you are assembling. The LS9 cam was intended to be used with a positive displacement blower (like the Eaton that came on the C6 ZR1) to make up for the soggy bottom end that cam would produce on an N/A engine. If you want to stick with a "factory" LS cam, use the LS6 cam or a copy of it. The LS6 cam was one of the more aggressive cams to come in a N/A LS and still has OEM stock-levels of driveability and idle quality. There are of course lots of options other than factory cams if you want a power bump but want to keep lift moderate (.550" range) and keep driveability and idle quality tame. Those options will also most likely be cheaper than a factory cam.
Will the LS9 cam make more top end than an LM7 cam? Sure! But its gonna kill torque and power below 4500rpm and you'll have to really wring it out up to to see that power benefit.
LS6 Cam: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12565308
LS9 cam on a 5.3L: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIzOQlURVjA
Will the LS9 cam make more top end than an LM7 cam? Sure! But its gonna kill torque and power below 4500rpm and you'll have to really wring it out up to to see that power benefit.
LS6 Cam: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12565308
LS9 cam on a 5.3L: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIzOQlURVjA
Extremely helpful! I was following a guide on upgrading a 5.3ls from summit racing and that was one of the links. Thank you much!
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: May 2023
Posts: 14
Likes: 4
Personally I would do some work to the 350 and get it where you would want it HP wise and then look into the transmission. With that said if you’re still dead set on a LS swap you don’t have to fuel inject it.
You can actually run a mechanical fuel pump and old school dizzy with a carb on one of these with this conversion piece. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/n...yABEgIBlfD_BwE
To some the point of a swap is to gain the fuel injection component but figured I’d throw that out there.
You can actually run a mechanical fuel pump and old school dizzy with a carb on one of these with this conversion piece. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/n...yABEgIBlfD_BwE
To some the point of a swap is to gain the fuel injection component but figured I’d throw that out there.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 3,116
Likes: 598
hello all!
I went to school out of state for a few years and when I got back my father gave me his 1979 corvette, he loved his old 454 manual and cant stand how low power his current one (chevy 350) is, he thought I could do more with it. He wants to put a 5.3l l33 ls in it as well as a t56 transmission.
this is what I have planned so far:o L33 ($1500) 100k miles (over estimate)
o Intake manifold (430) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-226122)o Swap kit ($3600) (https://www.brphotrods.com/p/ls-engine-swap-kits.html) (no a/c)
o Bottom end rebuild kit ($800) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/f...make/chevrolet) (with main bearings)
o High lift cam cam ($150) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12638427) (higher lift = more power)
o Valve springs (allow us to run .550 inch lift on cam) ($160) (allow use for higher lift cam)
o Rocker arm upgrade (required for higher lift and heavier springs) ($165) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-141560)
o Efi kit (https://fitechefi.com/product/ultima...tandalone-ecu/) ($1000)
o Cylinder heads ($1300) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...s#applications)
o Oil pan ($211) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...make/chevrolet)
i was also going to take the l33 to a machine shop and have the cylinder bored and honed .03 over. ($250)
this is all fine and dandy... but I'm completely clueless how to swap the automatic transmission to a manual t56.
there are kits but they run over $8k.
if I have the parts i can probably build the legos, but I don't even know what parts I would need. I would hate to part it out then need to spend another $3000 on a bell housing or whatever.
I went to school out of state for a few years and when I got back my father gave me his 1979 corvette, he loved his old 454 manual and cant stand how low power his current one (chevy 350) is, he thought I could do more with it. He wants to put a 5.3l l33 ls in it as well as a t56 transmission.
this is what I have planned so far:o L33 ($1500) 100k miles (over estimate)
o Intake manifold (430) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-226122)o Swap kit ($3600) (https://www.brphotrods.com/p/ls-engine-swap-kits.html) (no a/c)
o Bottom end rebuild kit ($800) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/f...make/chevrolet) (with main bearings)
o High lift cam cam ($150) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-12638427) (higher lift = more power)
o Valve springs (allow us to run .550 inch lift on cam) ($160) (allow use for higher lift cam)
o Rocker arm upgrade (required for higher lift and heavier springs) ($165) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-141560)
o Efi kit (https://fitechefi.com/product/ultima...tandalone-ecu/) ($1000)
o Cylinder heads ($1300) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...s#applications)
o Oil pan ($211) (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...make/chevrolet)
i was also going to take the l33 to a machine shop and have the cylinder bored and honed .03 over. ($250)
this is all fine and dandy... but I'm completely clueless how to swap the automatic transmission to a manual t56.
there are kits but they run over $8k.
if I have the parts i can probably build the legos, but I don't even know what parts I would need. I would hate to part it out then need to spend another $3000 on a bell housing or whatever.
or disable module's.
This will give you an idea of what to expect for parts / issue's to consider.
T56 Magnum Install 78 Corvette. - CorvetteForum - Chevrolet Corvette Forum Discussion
1978 LS3 Swap Completed. - CorvetteForum - Chevrolet Corvette Forum Discussion
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 11,152
Likes: 890
From: South Western Ontario
LS9 cam is a poor choice. Use something aftermarket.
If you're OK with a 4-speed then you can swap that in. It's not too hard. I just did it. C5 LS1/LS6 clutch and flywheel, Ram hydraulic throw-out bearing 78125HD, American Powertrain BHCV-10004 bellhousing and a GM 12557583 pilot bearing. I installed a TKX but it works the same as any GM 4-speed. You need the extended pin for the RAM bearing 78134S and a spacer 78331 or more shims 78330.
This setup doesn't engage the splines on the transmission fully into the clutch disk splines but I didn't find anyone having a problem with that and lots of TKO/TKX transmissions are running around behind LS engines installed this way. What I don't understand is why American Powertrain would make the bellhousing for LS applications that is small/big block depth and 0.4" too deep for LS applications. There is a bellhousing that is the correct depth, but it's around $800-1k from what I recall. If you use it, you don't need the extended length pin or spacer/extra shims.
You can check the pilot bearing needed here;
https://americanpowertrain.com/gm-ls...ing-tech-info/
I've got the LS1 to swap into a C10 all setup and it uses all LS1 parts except for the pan, oil pickup and dipstick. Makes it easier to get replacement parts.
If you're OK with a 4-speed then you can swap that in. It's not too hard. I just did it. C5 LS1/LS6 clutch and flywheel, Ram hydraulic throw-out bearing 78125HD, American Powertrain BHCV-10004 bellhousing and a GM 12557583 pilot bearing. I installed a TKX but it works the same as any GM 4-speed. You need the extended pin for the RAM bearing 78134S and a spacer 78331 or more shims 78330.
This setup doesn't engage the splines on the transmission fully into the clutch disk splines but I didn't find anyone having a problem with that and lots of TKO/TKX transmissions are running around behind LS engines installed this way. What I don't understand is why American Powertrain would make the bellhousing for LS applications that is small/big block depth and 0.4" too deep for LS applications. There is a bellhousing that is the correct depth, but it's around $800-1k from what I recall. If you use it, you don't need the extended length pin or spacer/extra shims.
You can check the pilot bearing needed here;
https://americanpowertrain.com/gm-ls...ing-tech-info/
I've got the LS1 to swap into a C10 all setup and it uses all LS1 parts except for the pan, oil pickup and dipstick. Makes it easier to get replacement parts.