2004R install in late C3
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,793
Likes: 937
From: Arizona
I'm curious why you'd want a 2000 RPM stall. The stock low-stall converter made my 79 an absolute dog, and that was with 3.55 gears. With your 3.07 rear, you may want to read some testimonials on this Forum about swapping to a higher-stall TC (but not from me, I no longer have any cars with automatic transmissions).
I get mixed feedback but again don't want to install the 2600 to try it out.
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,510
Likes: 498
I'm curious why you'd want a 2000 RPM stall. The stock low-stall converter made my 79 an absolute dog, and that was with 3.55 gears. With your 3.07 rear, you may want to read some testimonials on this Forum about swapping to a higher-stall TC (but not from me, I no longer have any cars with automatic transmissions).
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2022
Posts: 176
Likes: 44
I'm curious why you'd want a 2000 RPM stall. The stock low-stall converter made my 79 an absolute dog, and that was with 3.55 gears. With your 3.07 rear, you may want to read some testimonials on this Forum about swapping to a higher-stall TC (but not from me, I no longer have any cars with automatic transmissions).
With the 2k stall converter it'll be significantly better than the 1600 stall the trans is coming with.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 11,953
Likes: 4,510
From: Virginia
Stock 79 L48 (with a Lars-style tune, which helped a LOT), true dual exhaust, 3.55 rear, TH-350, 2.52 1st gear, stock converter, 1650 RPM stall = Dogshit
The car only woke up at about 3000 RPM, and then fell flat by 4500 RPM. YMMV with a better engine, or the ability to select gears*
For the OPs case, (3.55/3.08) * (1650/2000) = 0.95 Dogshit (95%, +Overdrive)
Perhaps a 5% improvement? Every testimonial I had read started at 2500 RPM for the TC, some over 3K. The guy who bought my TH-350 has a 3500 RPM TC to put on.
Again, don't take my word for it, there are lots of threads on this Forum and elsewhere.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...ll-or-not.html
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...e-build-2.html
*(what has the ability to select gears, and has lockup in all 4, 5, or 6 gears, with no electronics?)
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 5,029
Likes: 1,120
From: North tonawanda NY
I also have a 2004r and a 2000-2200rpm stall converter as recommended by the friend that built the trans for me. I have a 3.55 rear end to swap in because well thats what I found a deal on..
I have read quite a few threads on this swap and everything I read stated the TH400 was the same length as the 2004r and the th350 swap to a 2004r required a new driveshaft as the length was different.
I see the comment above stating the 350 is the same length as the 2004r and I question that because it does not align with what others who have done the swap say.. I have the th400 in my 74 so I had to source the correct yoke for the 2004r and have acquired the other bits and pieces.. I just need something to change in my life to allow me the free time to get this done.
and the 1st gear in the 2004r is lower than both the 350 or 400. From what ive read it should still be better with the 3.08 or in my case 3.55 than stock..
I have read quite a few threads on this swap and everything I read stated the TH400 was the same length as the 2004r and the th350 swap to a 2004r required a new driveshaft as the length was different.
I see the comment above stating the 350 is the same length as the 2004r and I question that because it does not align with what others who have done the swap say.. I have the th400 in my 74 so I had to source the correct yoke for the 2004r and have acquired the other bits and pieces.. I just need something to change in my life to allow me the free time to get this done.
and the 1st gear in the 2004r is lower than both the 350 or 400. From what ive read it should still be better with the 3.08 or in my case 3.55 than stock..
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,793
Likes: 937
From: Arizona
Hello again all, I have stuck with the 2000-2200 stall converter decision at the advice of almost every trans shop I talked with as well as Bowtie Overdrives with my stock L48, without the experience with the higher stall (2600) I don't want to just "try it" as I've stated this is not for performance but making it a little more drivable and I will be using the B&M controller.
I have been consistently told that I may get a little frustrated with the 2600 stall for normal driving with my set up as well as generate more heat and don't want that here in AZ.
the th350 and 2004R are about 2-3 millimeters difference in length (except long shaft th350) and the only difference is mounting location is several inches further back on the 2004R... I have a crossmember coming from Bowtie Overdrives, I have the new TV cable and bracket as well so gonna tackle it when I return from vacation.
I have been consistently told that I may get a little frustrated with the 2600 stall for normal driving with my set up as well as generate more heat and don't want that here in AZ.
the th350 and 2004R are about 2-3 millimeters difference in length (except long shaft th350) and the only difference is mounting location is several inches further back on the 2004R... I have a crossmember coming from Bowtie Overdrives, I have the new TV cable and bracket as well so gonna tackle it when I return from vacation.
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 5,029
Likes: 1,120
From: North tonawanda NY
Hello again all, I have stuck with the 2000-2200 stall converter decision at the advice of almost every trans shop I talked with as well as Bowtie Overdrives with my stock L48, without the experience with the higher stall (2600) I don't want to just "try it" as I've stated this is not for performance but making it a little more drivable and I will be using the B&M controller.
I have been consistently told that I may get a little frustrated with the 2600 stall for normal driving with my set up as well as generate more heat and don't want that here in AZ.
the th350 and 2004R are about 2-3 millimeters difference in length (except long shaft th350) and the only difference is mounting location is several inches further back on the 2004R... I have a crossmember coming from Bowtie Overdrives, I have the new TV cable and bracket as well so gonna tackle it when I return from vacation.
I have been consistently told that I may get a little frustrated with the 2600 stall for normal driving with my set up as well as generate more heat and don't want that here in AZ.
the th350 and 2004R are about 2-3 millimeters difference in length (except long shaft th350) and the only difference is mounting location is several inches further back on the 2004R... I have a crossmember coming from Bowtie Overdrives, I have the new TV cable and bracket as well so gonna tackle it when I return from vacation.
I was told the same thing in regards to a 2600rpm stall generating wasted energy as heat. My c3 is also a street cruiser so launches are not my priority... If they were id keep the stronger th400
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 11,953
Likes: 4,510
From: Virginia
Hello again all, I have stuck with the 2000-2200 stall converter decision at the advice of almost every trans shop I talked with as well as Bowtie Overdrives with my stock L48, without the experience with the higher stall (2600) I don't want to just "try it" as I've stated this is not for performance but making it a little more drivable and I will be using the B&M controller.
I have been consistently told that I may get a little frustrated with the 2600 stall for normal driving with my set up as well as generate more heat and don't want that here in AZ.
the th350 and 2004R are about 2-3 millimeters difference in length (except long shaft th350) and the only difference is mounting location is several inches further back on the 2004R... I have a crossmember coming from Bowtie Overdrives, I have the new TV cable and bracket as well so gonna tackle it when I return from vacation.
I have been consistently told that I may get a little frustrated with the 2600 stall for normal driving with my set up as well as generate more heat and don't want that here in AZ.
the th350 and 2004R are about 2-3 millimeters difference in length (except long shaft th350) and the only difference is mounting location is several inches further back on the 2004R... I have a crossmember coming from Bowtie Overdrives, I have the new TV cable and bracket as well so gonna tackle it when I return from vacation.
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Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,793
Likes: 937
From: Arizona
It seems I was wrong about the length difference of the 350vs 400 and was confusing my info with the longer 700r4 many use instead. its been a few years since I researched all this and started collecting parts. The fact that the th400 crossmember works fine for the 2004r had me mixed up further..
I was told the same thing in regards to a 2600rpm stall generating wasted energy as heat. My c3 is also a street cruiser so launches are not my priority... If they were id keep the stronger th400
I was told the same thing in regards to a 2600rpm stall generating wasted energy as heat. My c3 is also a street cruiser so launches are not my priority... If they were id keep the stronger th400
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,793
Likes: 937
From: Arizona
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,989
Likes: 198
From: Meriden CT
I also have a 2004r and a 2000-2200rpm stall converter as recommended by the friend that built the trans for me. I have a 3.55 rear end to swap in because well thats what I found a deal on..
I have read quite a few threads on this swap and everything I read stated the TH400 was the same length as the 2004r and the th350 swap to a 2004r required a new driveshaft as the length was different.
I see the comment above stating the 350 is the same length as the 2004r and I question that because it does not align with what others who have done the swap say.. I have the th400 in my 74 so I had to source the correct yoke for the 2004r and have acquired the other bits and pieces.. I just need something to change in my life to allow me the free time to get this done.
and the 1st gear in the 2004r is lower than both the 350 or 400. From what ive read it should still be better with the 3.08 or in my case 3.55 than stock..
I have read quite a few threads on this swap and everything I read stated the TH400 was the same length as the 2004r and the th350 swap to a 2004r required a new driveshaft as the length was different.
I see the comment above stating the 350 is the same length as the 2004r and I question that because it does not align with what others who have done the swap say.. I have the th400 in my 74 so I had to source the correct yoke for the 2004r and have acquired the other bits and pieces.. I just need something to change in my life to allow me the free time to get this done.
and the 1st gear in the 2004r is lower than both the 350 or 400. From what ive read it should still be better with the 3.08 or in my case 3.55 than stock..
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2022
Posts: 176
Likes: 44
I get that, and I don't really have a dog in this fight (no pun intended). But my one data point is this:
Stock 79 L48 (with a Lars-style tune, which helped a LOT), true dual exhaust, 3.55 rear, TH-350, 2.52 1st gear, stock converter, 1650 RPM stall = Dogshit
The car only woke up at about 3000 RPM, and then fell flat by 4500 RPM. YMMV with a better engine, or the ability to select gears*
For the OPs case, (3.55/3.08) * (1650/2000) = 0.95 Dogshit (95%, +Overdrive)
Perhaps a 5% improvement? Every testimonial I had read started at 2500 RPM for the TC, some over 3K. The guy who bought my TH-350 has a 3500 RPM TC to put on.
Again, don't take my word for it, there are lots of threads on this Forum and elsewhere.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...ll-or-not.html
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...e-build-2.html
*(what has the ability to select gears, and has lockup in all 4, 5, or 6 gears, with no electronics?)
Stock 79 L48 (with a Lars-style tune, which helped a LOT), true dual exhaust, 3.55 rear, TH-350, 2.52 1st gear, stock converter, 1650 RPM stall = Dogshit
The car only woke up at about 3000 RPM, and then fell flat by 4500 RPM. YMMV with a better engine, or the ability to select gears*
For the OPs case, (3.55/3.08) * (1650/2000) = 0.95 Dogshit (95%, +Overdrive)
Perhaps a 5% improvement? Every testimonial I had read started at 2500 RPM for the TC, some over 3K. The guy who bought my TH-350 has a 3500 RPM TC to put on.
Again, don't take my word for it, there are lots of threads on this Forum and elsewhere.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...ll-or-not.html
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...e-build-2.html
*(what has the ability to select gears, and has lockup in all 4, 5, or 6 gears, with no electronics?)
For the weight of the car, and the cam specs I'm running with, and the rear gear (3.55) it made sense. Years ago we did a 460 BBF in a 4500lb Torino, and we needed at least a 3000rpm stall, but it was a strange car to drive. The vette is fairly light, and with a 1600 stall it would probably buck at stop lights.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,383
Likes: 385
From: Leland , North Carolina
My problem is the exhaust. Unless there is a way to make the current crossmember work with the 200 for now the problem is getting someone to build me a non emissions dual exhaust.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,793
Likes: 937
From: Arizona
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,809
Likes: 441
From: Denver CO
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,383
Likes: 385
From: Leland , North Carolina
It will work,drivers side is tight .Since I have long tubes and duals straight back I went w/ www.bowtieoverdrives.com crossmember
My question is can the BowTie cross member or the other be used in place of the stock crossmember for now for the sake of getting a new 3"dual exhaust fabricated first or should I just stick with the exhaust I have for now and if so will it have any clearance issues with the new setup?
I don't want to do the swap and then have no exhaust to bolt on.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,383
Likes: 385
From: Leland , North Carolina
Yep , no computer needed your car already has the TCC vacuum switch mounted on the fire wall between the brake booster and wiper motor with a harness that goes to your T350C transmission and the correct brake switch that releases the TCC and stops cruise control with a tap of the brakes , all you have to do is change the wires to the 200R4 connector at the transmission
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,510
Likes: 498
The muffler shop can always install a couple Magna Flow universal catalytic converters if you are in an emission state . This hobby just keeps getting more expensive when ever you change a major component