Speedo Rolled back
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 327
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From: Island Heights N.J
Speedo Rolled back
I just boughta 1996 Grand Sport conv I think the mileage was turned back . Can this be done even though it is digital .If so how is it done i need to know for when i go to court .Thanks for your help 
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,692
Likes: 5
From: Hayward CA
The mileage is kept in one of the computers.....I think the PCM....or ECM.....or BCM.......(oh heck it's one of them). If the original owner changed the computer then it'll reflect less than actual mileage.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
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From: San Pedro CA
the mileage is still stored in the CCM. It has to be flashed within 100 miles of installation by someone with a Tech II.
I would be 100% sure it wasn't a typo by DMV. That is not unheard of.
I would be 100% sure it wasn't a typo by DMV. That is not unheard of.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,036
Likes: 13
From: Edmonton AB
If you have any idea where the car was last operated, you could check
for instances of service performed at a local dealer.
It may even be possible to have any dealer check for history using the
VIN. This will help zero in on where it has been operated (if you don't
know or suspect bad info) and if the car had recall work or something
like this done, then you'll get a sense of the accuracy of the mileage.
Plus, you'll have third-party evidence.
Same opportunity exists with work performed by non-dealer shops. If
there are mods and you know who did these, get in touch and ask them
to pull up any history they have.
Of course, you've gone to CarFax already.
.
for instances of service performed at a local dealer.
It may even be possible to have any dealer check for history using the
VIN. This will help zero in on where it has been operated (if you don't
know or suspect bad info) and if the car had recall work or something
like this done, then you'll get a sense of the accuracy of the mileage.
Plus, you'll have third-party evidence.
Same opportunity exists with work performed by non-dealer shops. If
there are mods and you know who did these, get in touch and ask them
to pull up any history they have.
Of course, you've gone to CarFax already.
.
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 4,532
Likes: 7
From: Lahaina Hi
I see you have a 94 vert, I know their was a factory recall on the parking break cable,you might check the dlr that had to do that and see what the milage was then.The cable had to be relocated inside the x brace at the drivers rear.
Team Owner
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 26,196
Likes: 0
From: Orlando FL
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
Originally Posted by Redeasysport
And just what does carfax have to say on this car?Why do you think it was rolled back?
That's what I was going to ask. Have you checked CarFax?
Also, many of the GS's were garage kept, weekend driven only, or raced. While there were quite a few people that daily drove them, I think it's quite possible that you may just have a low milage car.
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Team Owner
Joined: Dec 1999
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From: Lacey WA RVN 68-69
NCM Sinkhole Donor
When a car is sold and the title transferred, the mileage is recorded on the title. Not too sure, but I think this is Federal law and applies to cars 10 years old or less. If you bought the car from somebody in your state, your DMV should have title and mileage history.
If the car was bought from somebody in another state, then that state's DMV should have the information. CARFAX gets their info from state DMV records and for the most part, they are pretty accurate but errors can happen.
As mentioned, the CCM (located in the center of the dash above and in front of the A/C controls) holds the odometer information. A new CCM would have to have the correct mileage programmed into it within 100 miles of driving or it will lock out any attempts at input after that. Also, the VIN and certain option information (FX3 and C68 electronic A/C system) has to be programmed into the CCM so any dealer or shop with a GM Tech II or OBDII reader can display that information for you.
If the car was bought from somebody in another state, then that state's DMV should have the information. CARFAX gets their info from state DMV records and for the most part, they are pretty accurate but errors can happen.
As mentioned, the CCM (located in the center of the dash above and in front of the A/C controls) holds the odometer information. A new CCM would have to have the correct mileage programmed into it within 100 miles of driving or it will lock out any attempts at input after that. Also, the VIN and certain option information (FX3 and C68 electronic A/C system) has to be programmed into the CCM so any dealer or shop with a GM Tech II or OBDII reader can display that information for you.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 393
Likes: 1
From: tx
Originally Posted by American Muscle
I just boughta 1996 Grand Sport conv I think the mileage was turned back . Can this be done even though it is digital .If so how is it done i need to know for when i go to court .Thanks for your help
Are you asking for an exact step-by-step procedure on “how to roll back a digital odometer”?
Why do you think that this has happened to your car?
Safety Car
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 3,504
Likes: 4
From: Mexico Beach FL
As stated above by others, the odometer reading and the VIN were in the original CCM -- along with other things like option content (ASR, C68, etc.).
By just plugging in a CCM with a lower odometer reading would "roll-back" the odometer -- but, the VIN (which can be read with a Vetronix scan-tool and the appropriate software) would not match the vehicle. So, this is easy to prove someone changed the CCM.
If someone got a new/refurbished CCM (a dealer, etc.), the odometer reading would be zero and the VIN would not be correct until someone (within 100 miles) programmed in the correct values with a Vetronix Tech-1, Tech-1A, MasterTech, or possibly the Tech-2 that had the appropriate software. So, it would be easy for a not-so-nice dealer to do the dirty deed and cover his tracks.
In the beginning, Vetronix would not supply the general public with the software to program the CCM -- this was done to prevent odometer tampering. I'm not sure if that continued -- I've heard of some that got the software somehow.
Tom Piper
By just plugging in a CCM with a lower odometer reading would "roll-back" the odometer -- but, the VIN (which can be read with a Vetronix scan-tool and the appropriate software) would not match the vehicle. So, this is easy to prove someone changed the CCM.
If someone got a new/refurbished CCM (a dealer, etc.), the odometer reading would be zero and the VIN would not be correct until someone (within 100 miles) programmed in the correct values with a Vetronix Tech-1, Tech-1A, MasterTech, or possibly the Tech-2 that had the appropriate software. So, it would be easy for a not-so-nice dealer to do the dirty deed and cover his tracks.
In the beginning, Vetronix would not supply the general public with the software to program the CCM -- this was done to prevent odometer tampering. I'm not sure if that continued -- I've heard of some that got the software somehow.
Tom Piper
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,276
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From: Why are there squished peanut butter cups in my underware?
Originally Posted by American Muscle
I just boughta 1996 Grand Sport conv I think the mileage was turned back.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 327
Likes: 0
From: Island Heights N.J
When you buy a car with 15,000 miles on it , do you think the seats should have been replaced with cheap vinyl .how about the rugs should they be replaced to ,should the front balljoints need replacement I never had this problem with any of my other Vettes My 94 has 50,000 miles it still has the original seats and carpet .I dont know where some of you people get the nerve from to accuse me of a scam.For everybody else thanks for your help .
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
Originally Posted by Redeasysport
OK so now we have told him how to roll back his odometer and he has not even had the courtesy to tell us what carfax had to say.I am begining to wonder if he is planning a scam himself?
He asked a question.
Besides, that process is hard to pull off without the right equipment, that is either too expensive or hard to acquire.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
Originally Posted by American Muscle
When you buy a car with 15,000 miles on it , do you think the seats should have been replaced with cheap vinyl .how about the rugs should they be replaced to ,should the front balljoints need replacement I never had this problem with any of my other Vettes My 94 has 50,000 miles it still has the original seats and carpet .I dont know where some of you people get the nerve from to accuse me of a scam.For everybody else thanks for your help .
what does CarFax say?
What did the dealer say?
Ignore the accusations.... I would agree, something ain't right.
Team Owner
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 46,295
Likes: 2,596
From: Northern, VA
St. Jude Donor '15
"In honor of jpee"
AM: ok you've asked the questions and heard some answers, some you didn't want to hear. You told us the problems you encountered. Where are the answers to the questions posed here by other posters?
Not accusing you of anything. Just want to know if you did prior to purchase or since, a carfax; talked to a dealer; did a vin ck to see if any mileage records in GM computers; etc.
Peace, out.
Not accusing you of anything. Just want to know if you did prior to purchase or since, a carfax; talked to a dealer; did a vin ck to see if any mileage records in GM computers; etc.
Peace, out.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
I guess the question I have is this: Is it a GS? or does it simply say "GS" on the throttle body (meaning, it's an LT4).
A real GS will have a unique vin, the last 6 digits are between 000001 an 001000.
A real GS will have a unique vin, the last 6 digits are between 000001 an 001000.