[Help]Car still won't start
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,740
Likes: 2
From: Minneapolis MN
[Help]Car still won't start
So far here has whats been checked, fixed.
Fuel Pressure OK
Compression OK
New Coil
New Opti
Spark seems fine, bright blue. Couldnt find the tester mentioned in my other thread anywhere.
Really feels as if its not getting gas but the plugs are wet. It was mentioned to pick up a noid light but I cant find one of those at the local parts store either.
Computer problem maybe? All gauges read fine when trying to start the car. Is their a different way to check the injectors. Both fuses are fine.
What could happen over night. Drove home from work fine, backing out next day and it kills. Starts bogs down, kills. Now Turns over dont start.
Forgot to mention its a 94.
Fuel Pressure OK
Compression OK
New Coil
New Opti
Spark seems fine, bright blue. Couldnt find the tester mentioned in my other thread anywhere.
Really feels as if its not getting gas but the plugs are wet. It was mentioned to pick up a noid light but I cant find one of those at the local parts store either.
Computer problem maybe? All gauges read fine when trying to start the car. Is their a different way to check the injectors. Both fuses are fine.
What could happen over night. Drove home from work fine, backing out next day and it kills. Starts bogs down, kills. Now Turns over dont start.
Forgot to mention its a 94.
Last edited by n1kki6; May 14, 2006 at 12:00 PM.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,740
Likes: 2
From: Minneapolis MN
How common would it be for the timing to jump a tooth. I didnt pull the hub to check it. But the fact that it started again after it killed makes me think it wouldnt be the timing.
Last edited by n1kki6; May 13, 2006 at 05:14 PM.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,740
Likes: 2
From: Minneapolis MN
Ok its a fuel problem. I just poured some gas down the intake and it started for a little while. So what could cause the injectors not to spray, or not to spray correctly.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,753
Likes: 9
From: Louisiana
Have you ohmed the injectors? If the plugs are wet this is a symptom of leaky injectors. You say that the SES light is on but no code given when grounded. You might have to scan it to get the code if this is the case.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,753
Likes: 9
From: Louisiana
Originally Posted by n1kki6
Ok its a fuel problem. I just poured some gas down the intake and it started for a little while. So what could cause the injectors not to spray, or not to spray correctly.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,740
Likes: 2
From: Minneapolis MN
Originally Posted by RRT vette
Failing pump, failing injector(s), clogged fuel filter. You say the pressure is good. Have you checked it after the engine is shut off, looking for a sudden steady drop?
Could it be something like a sensor and the injectors not spraying. Mass air flow or something. I am in past my working knowledge of the car at this point so just looking for suggestions.
Would one injector cause the car not to start. Like I said it ran long enough for me to back down the driveway thats why I am wondering if some sensor didnt go now causing the injectors not to spray.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,753
Likes: 9
From: Louisiana
The fuel system doesn't have any sensors operating it. The injectors get a pulse from the ECM according to the RPM and pulses from the distrubitor. I would use your FP guage and check pressure at idle, while driving various rpm, and after you turn the key off. You will be looking for a drop in pressure (like 10lb per sec or so). One leaky injector could cause this problem. Also you can disconnect each injector and use a ohm meter and test them. They should read about 16+/- ohms and not be more than 1 ohm apart. A drop in pressure could be injectors, fuel pressure reg, or check valve. If the SES light is on, this means the ECM has seen something outside of its limits and is warning of a problem.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,740
Likes: 2
From: Minneapolis MN
I cant check the pressure at idle or different rpms the car wont start. The injectors are pulsating we checked it with a light to make sure they are getting current so it just seems they are not spraying. Could one injector cause the engine not to start. Its not firing at all.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,753
Likes: 9
From: Louisiana
Originally Posted by n1kki6
Ok its a fuel problem. I just poured some gas down the intake and it started for a little while. So what could cause the injectors not to spray, or not to spray correctly.
. Timing comes to mind. Unless the ECM is not working properly. 
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,594
Likes: 0
From: CALGARY ab
Originally Posted by n1kki6
Also now the service engine soon light stays on but their is no codes on the display when I jump the 4 and 12.
to get codes from ecm jump A & B,,at the ALDL connector.. watch for service lite to blink 1-2, thre3 times start of codes,,,then the problem codes appears..EXAMPLE: 3 blinks pause, then 6 blinks pause, for 3 repeats.code then would code36, then to close, 1 blink, 2 blinks end of code.. any other codes would be read between the 1-2 blinks..
so what is yoour code? using this procedure?
Racer
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 327
Likes: 0
From: edgerton WI
To check if you are getting injector pulse you should use a noid light. when you turn key to start the light should flash.If it stays lit or dose not light there is aprob with that system. Car Quest, Napa or bumper to bumper store can order if they don't cary them. Auto Zone in my area dose not. I was also told by a mecanic not to use a standerd test light in place of a noid light. Sorry I don't have any better ideas. Maby change the plugs if they are wet they might not be fireing good enougf. Good luck.
Advanced
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 67
Likes: 0
From: Valencia PA
Originally Posted by n1kki6
How common would it be for the timing to jump a tooth. I didnt pull the hub to check it. But the fact that it started again after it killed makes me think it wouldnt be the timing.
I did read in the manual that if the ECM does not recieve the timing pulses from the distributor it will not continue to run the fuel pump. Some thing has to be shuting down all the injectors for it not to run at all. I would continue looking at fuel delivery myself. We had one with a clogged fuel rail and it acted the same. Good pressure and thought there was fuel cause the plugs were wet. We pulled the whole rail to see if the injectors were actually spraying. Turned out to be just barley working. We had another rail and injectors and just replaced the whole setup. Ran like a champ after that.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 54,124
Likes: 30
From: Cincinnati, Oh USA
You can check the timing while cranking with a timing light, but if your engine ran while dumping fuel into the MAF, it isn't timing. The injectors are clearly not injecting fuel and if they are being pulsed, then they must not have fuel pressure or most of the injectors are defective.
Make sure you have proper fuel pressure at the shraeder valve on the end of the fuel rail and you can test your injectors one at time by momentarily touching 12v to each injector and listening for the click sound that the pintle makes when the injector coil pulls it open.
Make sure you have proper fuel pressure at the shraeder valve on the end of the fuel rail and you can test your injectors one at time by momentarily touching 12v to each injector and listening for the click sound that the pintle makes when the injector coil pulls it open.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 5,789
Likes: 8
From: Myrtle Beach SC
St. Jude Donor '05-'06
Time to break out the FSM and follow the flow chart for your problem.If you plugs have gas on them the injectors are working.Never read in the manual about pouring fuel into the engine.You need to pull the codes if the SES light is on you WILL have some if you do it correctly.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 6,130
Likes: 2
From: seattle WA
Well, if you put gas in the intake and it started...you simply have a fuel delivery problem....10k or not, I'd change that filter.You may want to take a piece of wire, I use 12 guage and apply 12 volts to pin G..this will energize the Fuel pump..try that..but check your FSM. Don't think anyone addressed part of your question...with the fuel pressure guage attached to the schrader valve...turn key to on position, fuel pressure should go up to around 40#....turn key off....watch and see how long it takes and how far the fuel pressure drops, as an example mine reached 41#, it took 20 minutes for it to drop to 36-37#, that told me my injectors were not leaking, nor was the FP regulator or fuel pump.
Sounds like you've already checked with a noid light to see pulsation.
You can ohm the injectors like RRT said....that will tell the health of the injectors....I suspect something more simple...like FP, or fuel filter.
Sounds like you've already checked with a noid light to see pulsation.
You can ohm the injectors like RRT said....that will tell the health of the injectors....I suspect something more simple...like FP, or fuel filter.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,740
Likes: 2
From: Minneapolis MN
Originally Posted by korvette4u
What are you doing?
to get codes from ecm jump A & B,,at the ALDL connector.. watch for service lite to blink 1-2, thre3 times start of codes,,,then the problem codes appears..EXAMPLE: 3 blinks pause, then 6 blinks pause, for 3 repeats.code then would code36, then to close, 1 blink, 2 blinks end of code.. any other codes would be read between the 1-2 blinks..
so what is yoour code? using this procedure?
to get codes from ecm jump A & B,,at the ALDL connector.. watch for service lite to blink 1-2, thre3 times start of codes,,,then the problem codes appears..EXAMPLE: 3 blinks pause, then 6 blinks pause, for 3 repeats.code then would code36, then to close, 1 blink, 2 blinks end of code.. any other codes would be read between the 1-2 blinks..
so what is yoour code? using this procedure?
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,740
Likes: 2
From: Minneapolis MN
Originally Posted by rick lambert
Well, if you put gas in the intake and it started...you simply have a fuel delivery problem....10k or not, I'd change that filter.You may want to take a piece of wire, I use 12 guage and apply 12 volts to pin G..this will energize the Fuel pump..try that..but check your FSM. Don't think anyone addressed part of your question...with the fuel pressure guage attached to the schrader valve...turn key to on position, fuel pressure should go up to around 40#....turn key off....watch and see how long it takes and how far the fuel pressure drops, as an example mine reached 41#, it took 20 minutes for it to drop to 36-37#, that told me my injectors were not leaking, nor was the FP regulator or fuel pump.
Sounds like you've already checked with a noid light to see pulsation.
You can ohm the injectors like RRT said....that will tell the health of the injectors....I suspect something more simple...like FP, or fuel filter.
Sounds like you've already checked with a noid light to see pulsation.
You can ohm the injectors like RRT said....that will tell the health of the injectors....I suspect something more simple...like FP, or fuel filter.