My 87 has heads/cam/headers/big base andrunners. I sniped a new mini ram off ebay yesterday. How much difference will the tune be. between the tpi and the mini. I plan on running it and datalogging before I order a new chip. How far off can it be ?

 

interesting question. and relevant.

no doubt you'll need gassed up especially in the lower fuel table. likely some in the upper ve table as well, though probably not as much as the factory tune runs a bit leaner up there......guesses only on my behalf.

who are you ordering the custom re-tune from?

congratulations by the way, prepare to off to the races with your much improved intake. the tune "highway star" comes to mind, classic deep purple

 

you have to consider the egr and cold start.

how rad is the cam - if you know the specs Alvin can give you a base tune to get you started and fine tune from there, he has some options with his tune purchase that can benefit you - consider getting an adapter from moates so you can tune without "burning"

 

The fuel question is exactly my concern. I was wondering what to expect on start up. Will it burn meyes at idle or be lean. Never saw any specific discussion on this here. Datalog will tell. I have a chip from Alvin and one from Ski right now.

 

I think the egr is turned off in the chip I have. If not, I think I can trick it into seeing it as working. The cold start injector has not worked in 3 years. I found out yesterday, one terminal pushed back out of the connector last time. Just takes a little more cranking to start.
Good idea on the Moates adaptor. I have been considering the do it yourself approach. Have Tunerpro RT. I just dont know if I can put the neccessary time into it.

I just played back an old datalog. EGR duty cycle stayed at 0.0. That will not be a problem.

 

spank, i think you're set to get a great base tune from alvin, he'll get you there the 1rst time with only minor tweaks once your miniram is in.......i'll bet one or two datalogs (& attendant tweaks to the tune) will get you right there.

i would ask alvin how much of a jump in fueling, and possibly some timing adjustments that would be required in a "base" re-tune.

by the way, i meant in my earlier post that your upper table would very likely need more extensive changes to the tune thats there now -- as well as the lower table.

 

I am really curious.as to what it will do. I probably wont get it till the end of the week. I would love to get it done Saturday but sometimes life gets in the way.I remember about 2 years ago Beachbum , took off his SuperRam, put the Mini on and went to the strip. Only slowed down abou .2, if I remember right. That was with NO tuning.

 

there's going to be a sizeable difference in volumetric efficiencies between a SR and your stock-like intake. i'm not sure if i would go from your current tune and simply swap out to the MR and run with it...... but then again, you've got an '87 which means MAF, so obviously there's good "headroom" there in relation to the fuel-air hardwire tuning to the chip. if i went from SR to MR in my '90, id be very uneasy about it, without another re-tune first.

at any rate, i would contact alvin and get another base tune mailed to you, meanwhile.......pop that baby in with the MR install and datalog from there.

but i know i haven't said a thing you already didn't know without a doubt.

 

I always like to get ideas from others. Every bit of info helps. Every one has a different point of view and that helps too. The car will not leave the garage without a laptop hooked up. Not taking chances. I finally replaced the 4 broken pistons.(remember my thread last summer ) put in a nice set of flat tops, PM rods, ARP bolts. Cylinders were not even hurt, after 10k miles like that. Honed out real nice.

 

When you whack the throttle, the Mini Ram is going to introduce a lot more airflow than your current set up. My guess is, you may need a little more acceleration enrichment tuning to get rid of any lean spikes.

Depending on the cam specs, you may also experience a little reversion at idle, due to the very short runner length of the Mini Ram. If this happens, the lower MAF tables may also need to be adjusted to compensate.

Overall fueling should be fine, though.

 

Its a ZZ4 cam, pretty mild. Current chip is conservative. A little rich, not a lot of advance.

 

The info I read from TPiS indicates bumping the fuel pressure a bit will compensate for the increase in air flow.
Did you buy the mis-cast Mini Ram that TPiS had on eBay?

 

Yes I did. saved about $100. Of course I bought the rail kit s, in reality I spent nearly 1200.

 

I have a hot cam and lt4 intake. It was drivable with the stock chip, but was real rich at idle. Didn't stall but it would shake hard under 1500rpms. Ran OK over 1500.

 

I just did a tune for a friends 87, 383, mini, etc. and the tune needed help as it was pretty rich, w/your lap top you will know for sure and is always the best. Congrats on the new intake you'll like it !
.

 

Thanks for the input. I was thinking maybe it will go rich because the mini will cause the air speed to slow down. Hopefully I can tune a little with FP and timing to compensate, till I get a new chip.

Mseven can you post or email a pic of your motor ?? Mine will never look that nice, but I'd like to see what you did with the injector wiring.

RWDSmoke, looks like you have already dealt with the problem, I am expecting. I appreciate it, as I will be there soon.

 

No problem, Thanks for the words but I think you can make it look just as good. The only thing I did special was take my time and plot were everything was going ("fiddling" with it some). On the 90 I did have to take apart the wiring harness for a couple injector wires to reach. But the 87 of my friends needed no wiring adjust.
Things to look for: I remember at the back of the block I changed the "hex" alluminum sender extension to a regular threaded tube ext. to gain room at the back of the intake (did not want to notch the intake) for clearance. (do a mock up before laying down the sealer/gaskets)
4 ports for vac was good (needed 5)but I did not want to "tee" into the brake with pcv, and I wanted map., and FPR (fpr comes off of cruise vac line) direct so I used a relocate for the MAP.
Linkage bracket may need some tweaks, I redrilled the holes (in bracket further back)so that the bracket could go further forward. This alotted for cruise, TV, to not be at their max. on the cable.
If you haven't already, you will need to do a TB delete to clear the water neck (used an earls 90 and a earl's barbed comnnecter to the hose (this allows hose to go through the AC bracket and allows easy disconnect at the 90, so that the 90 stays on the intake). I just blocked the original hose off the reservoir that goes to EGR.
As to FP, I think being a little rich is fine (safer place to start), if you take down the FP to low to comp., spray pattern can change as well as atomazation. (MO, personally would not go below 42ish and would start at 45). On the 87 I did (mini, 383, mild cam, etc) I started with a stock bin. I was seeing rich off idle(blm 118) through rpm staying in the 40-70ish load range. Leaned once entering the 90-112 load (lower rpm, flow), for the most part car felt bogged/sluggish until I made tweaks in the tune (now it's pretty much an animal). Sorry for long post, if I can help further and or you need additional pics./info, feel free to PM or email me.



my TB delete: airfoil ?? lol

 

Mseven those are great pics and so is the info. Pics save on my laptop. The molded hoses on the vac line are a nice detail. I had made a alluminum tube to run the driver side under the runner to clean that up. I just dont want it hacked up.
Mine will not stay that clean but I can try and make it as neat. I drive through a couple construction zones daily. My intake bas was nearly civered with sand. Below is getting replaced.

 

Last fall I installed a Mini-Ram II on my 86 which was running a TPI setup and a daughterboard burned by Alvin for the TPI..

Engine fired instantly and ran extremely well. No negatives at all from start up to shut down. Although I didn't go WOT because I was aware I needed a re-tune, I drove on the Interstate and was VERY pleased with the performance difference.

A few days later the car was hit by an 18-wheeler and I never got around to getting a re-burn.

Jake

 

I recall you having much time and labor in that car. Damn shame what happened. I hope you have better luck when the new LTx motor is done.