Well Guys,
The AFRs are in and all I can say is WOW!!!!!!!! :crazy: These things are a work of art. I wish I had a digital camera so I could post the pics. This sure did make my Christmas! Going to put the cam and timing stuff in tomorrow. I will let you know how it goes. Thanks. :cheers:

 

Guys,
I have been planning on getting some Hooker Headers part #16720 for my setup. I was reading about them on Summits Website and it stated that they would not work with AFR heads that have angled plugs...I have that setup. What else can I do? I am a bit depressed over this and would appreciate some insite or advice on what other options I have. Why would they not fit on the AFRs? Guess I will wait to hear the reasons. Thanks guys. :confused:

 

I don't know! BTW, #16720 is the y-pipe that goes with either the 2149 or 2151 headers. I'm using the 2151s (no A.I.R. fittings) on GM Fastburn heads which have angled plugs and they fit really well - good plug clearance. In fact, I don't think they would work at all with straight plug heads.
Check out the last pic at http:\\home.austin.rr.com\dancurrie\Proj ectVette.htm for a pic of the 2151 on the engine.

I just got the 16720 y-pipe today and it's a really well made piece. It's 3" diameter and bolts straight to the header flanges - no reducers required. Very nice.

I don't know if that helps, but that's all I can tell you.
Dan

 

Can anyone veryify that these will not work. I hate to spend another 300 for lingenfelter or TPS headers that I hear don't always fit. I just need some confirmation that the Hookers will not work. I can't for the life of me think why they would work on the stock heads but not on the AFRs. Maybe if you did not have the AFRs milled to the stock cc perhaps, but that is only acouple of .001s My plan was to get the headers and slide them down in were they need to be before I put the heads on. There is tons of room to get them in there now and would probably save some messing around later. If I was out at our dealership doing this work I could have just lifted it on the one of the lifts and had much more access. But I don't have it there and will have to make due now. Till I get confirmation on the headers I am at a standstill. :confused: Anyone with a similiar setup please let me know what headers you are running or confirm that the headers will work. Thanks a million.

 

I am going to start begging for help soon on the above problem :cry I am kinda stuck. THanks in advance for the help.

 

I went to the Summit site and looked up the 2149 Hookers. Indeed, it DOES say that they don't fit AFR's with angled plugs. AFR isn't the only head maker putting out angled plug heads. Why only AFR's? If it were me, I'd get on the phone to Hooker (Holley) and ask some questions. These are the headers I anticipate using, and I would be interested in what you find out. Since I started writing this, I looked up the listings for the Corvette headers in the Hooker catalog. The 2149's have the 212 footnote that says they don't fit the AFR angled plug heads. The 2151's DON'T have footnote 212. Catalog wise, the 2151's are not ceramic coated and do not have the bungs welded in for the AIR tubes for the pump or the bung for the O2 senser. Except for the footnote 212 they look like they should be the same. The primary tubes are the same diameter and length. That footnote isn't there for no reason. Call Hooker and let us all know. Good luck.

 

I looked at all this too before I ordered Hooker headers. I can't imagine either why or how the 2149s would be different than the 2151s except for the emissions stuff. Yet now that I have the 2151s bolted on my engine I can't see how they would ever work with straight plug heads, and if the 2149s with the emissions fittings are designed to fit the L98, even with iron straight plugs heads, they may be different in the routing of the tubes. I dont' know.

BTW, you can get tht 2151s with metalic ceramic coating; just order 2151-1. Even though Hooker doesn't explicitly list this in their online catalog, this is what I ordered and got from Summit (more $ of course). I'm going to put the O2 sensor in the y-pipe just behind the collector.

Dan

 

Dan.

Footnote #117 for the 2151's lists part numbers for collectors with the O2 bung welded in. It might be something to consider if you want to keep the O2 closer to the engine.

I don't understand the fitment differences betwee the two part numbers, myself. I can only guess that there is something unique about the AFR angled plug heads. If I were in Ski's shoes, I'd be talking to Hooker.

 

Yep, I agree. :yesnod:

 

Hey thanks guys,
I will have to call hooker to get this straightened out. I thought that some of you guys could shed some light on the subject. I sold my old heads so I can't set them side by side and see the differences (if any in fits). There is obviously differences in performance but I can't really see anything that is majorly different. I guess I will have to wait till after the Holidays to get ahold of hooker. I'm sure they will be able to help. Do you guys think I should do away with the EGR crap or not? I would like to eliminate the emmission stuff as the air pump is already deleted. I just wonder what kinds of problems might crop up. Would like to hear what others have done (Ralph, ect.) Thanks.

 

Ski
The AFR heads can be made with 3 plug designs: straight, L98 angle or AFR Angle. The L98 used a slightly angled plug design, while the AFR angle is moved allot more. Give me the part number of the heads you have and I can tell you what you got. I'm sure the Hookers will fit with the L98 angle plug design.
I have the Lingenfelter 1 5/8 headers with ceramic coating for $630 with Y-pipe. Our '89 vettes came with a mini starter from the factory, no problems getting it in/out. I did put a heat shield on it from summit part# THE-14150. Also had to move the brake lines and oil cooler lines and insulate them with part# THE-14015 also from summit. These headers are a work of art, just like the AFR heads.
Be sure to use the FelPro gaskets that AFR recommends, and buy a set of ARP head bolts (not studs) with the special ARP thread sealer and moly lube. Torque to 75 FtLbs.
I put a little K&N breather in the valve cover to keep all the oil out of my manifold and combustion chambers. I also block off the EGR by placing some flat shim stock between the EGR tube and the header. Both are quickly replaced for yearly emissions inspection. The combination of oil vapors and hot EGR leads to buildup of crap in the intake.

Good luck and Merry Christmas!
Roger
:chevy
http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/Hob...r4/default.htm


[Modified by Corvette_Z51, 12:50 AM 12/24/2001]

 

Corvette_Z51,
Thanks for the advise. When I ordered them I told the guy there to make them just like to L98 heads....Sensors, plugs, ect. I guess what you are saying then is the headers should work. I will call Hooker just to double check. I am going to wait till I have the headers before putting the heads on. That way I can just assemble them on a bench and check plugs for clearance. I know the headers for the chevelle did not fit for a crap. They interfered with the steering linkage BAD! Nothing a hammer could not take care of :smash: I just hate to have to go through that again. :cry Boy I wish I had my old heads to compare angles...Oh well. Do you think I should eliminate the EGR? I do not have smog police. Thanks and please advise

 

With no AIR pump or concern for smog hook ups, why not consider the 2151 Hookers? They do NOT have the footnote 212, (do not fit AFR angled plug heads) listed for them. I would still check out your heads. This is the first I'VE heard of more than one type of angled plug heads. And once armed with the head info, call Hooker and triple check that one (2151 & 2149 ) or the other will work for you. Good information, here. Let us know how it all comes out.

 

"This is the first I'VE heard of more than one type of angled plug heads."

Check out the AFR website: http://www.airflowresearch.com/chev190.html
For example:
Competition Package CNC Ported Heads
Description Part Number
190cc Street Heads, Angle Plug, 74cc 1032
190cc Street Heads, Straight Plug, 74cc 1085
190cc Street Heads, L98 Angle Plug, 74cc 1088

When I purchased my AFR heads from AFR they explained it all to me over the phone.

Happy holidays!
Roger
:chevy


[Modified by Corvette_Z51, 2:45 PM 1/12/2002]

 

Roger,

Thanks for the url. Like I said in my last post, "Good information here". I never considered that all "angled" plug heads weren't created equal (anglewise). That answers PART of the question. I still wonder why the 2149's have the 212 footnote and the 2151's don't. Hopefully, Ski will report his findings. I have to remember, "It's what you learn AFTER you know it all, that counts". Thanks again.


[Modified by CFI-EFI, 1:54 PM 12/24/2001]

 

Guys,
Little update here for ya. No news on the headers yet, but as soon as I get to work on Wednesday I will call then post outcome. I am sure this post will help many others overcome other obsticles at my expense! :D Oh well I will take one for the team I guess. :lol:
The update is as follows:
1. Cam installed no problem but remeber I had to jack the drivers side of the engine up which required me to take that sides engine mount bolt.
2. Cloyes true double roller installed.
3. Oil pan back up tight, just loosened it enough to lower the front. Kinda a pain putting back together but some teamwork between Dad and I made it easier.
4. Roller Lifters back in respective locations and hold down bolted to secure all.
5. Lastly a few coors light gone!

What a way to spend christmas eve. Now I have to do the family thing. Thanks for all your help so far with the headers and all. I will post Wednesday the results of the call to Hooker. Merry Christmas All.

 

I must concur with Z51, they do make the three types of heads. I ran my old AFR 190RR with several different brands of headers with no difficulties. I am now running the AFR210CP heads with the TPIS 1-3/4" long tubes. Make sure you get the L-98 angle plugs heads, this makes a difference.

Regarding the breather, I run one side to the header with a -12AN line and a welded bung. The other side still is hard lined to the MR.

Best of Luck,
Aaron

 

Hey guys,
I have a few quick questions for you all:
1. Will the stock injectors be alright for the setup I am going to be running. I thought they would be alright as long as I did not go with a larger displacement engine, i.e 383. Just curious. THanks
2. Upon cleaning up my valve covers I destroyed the push in rubber grommets. Were can these be had at? THanks again.
P.S. I will post the call to Hooker tomorrow. Thanks.

 

Well I'm screwed! I just got off the phone with Hedman and they said that neither the 2149 or the 2151 will fit the AFR angle plugs. I do have one last hope. That when I said to AFR I needed the angled plugs and to make them just like to stock heads, ect that they put the L-98 angle instead of their angle plug holes. I tried to call AFR to verify but they are off till 1/3/01. I can't wait that long. Maybe I will just order a set from Summit and see if they clear? You other guys (Ralph, ect) what headers are you running? This really sucks...man I wish I would have known beforehand about this. Oh well. Hope to hear from you all. Thanks.

 

I ordered the headers. They will be here by Friday and I will let you all know how I make out. Keep your fingers crossed. I decided to go with no EGR stuff...Don't know if that is a wise desicion or not. Guess we will see. I wonder if the O2 sensor hole will be in there? Guess I can have it welded in if not. I am fairly confident that they will fit. ;) If not I will be :cuss at myself. I will let you all know when they get here! Thanks for the help.

By the way they are 468.95 through summit, and a 90 return if problems (that might come in handy) shhhhhhh! :D


[Modified by ski_dwn_it, 9:31 AM 12/26/2001]