Which head gasket?
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri
Which head gasket?
I'm going to be putting a 383 together in the near future, I've found a decent deal on the shortblock and I already have the AFR 195's with 65cc chambers. The deck height on the 383 is 0.010. So here are the head gaskets I'm considering and I need opinions.
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...2D1043&FROM=MG
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...2D1134&FROM=MG
With the Felpro I'll have about a 10.75-1 compression ratio and a quench area of 0.049
With the MR Gasket I'll have about a 11.0-1 compression ratio and a quench area of 0.038
With the Mr Gasket I have a nice tight quench area but is 11.0-1, do you think this is going to be too high of compression for a pump gas street motor?
Or will the results I'll get with the Felpro more desirable?
One other question listed in the Felpro description is
"For small chambered aluminum race heads, and some Vortec engines. Will not fit conventional OEM-type combustion chambers"
What does this mean, anyone know?
Just found these gaskets as well
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...2D5800&FROM=MG
They're from Mr Gasket as well and will give similar quench and CR as the Felpro ( .048 quench 10.74-1 CR) is there a logical reason to spend almost twice as much on the Felpro?
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...2D1043&FROM=MG
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...2D1134&FROM=MG
With the Felpro I'll have about a 10.75-1 compression ratio and a quench area of 0.049
With the MR Gasket I'll have about a 11.0-1 compression ratio and a quench area of 0.038
With the Mr Gasket I have a nice tight quench area but is 11.0-1, do you think this is going to be too high of compression for a pump gas street motor?
Or will the results I'll get with the Felpro more desirable?
One other question listed in the Felpro description is
"For small chambered aluminum race heads, and some Vortec engines. Will not fit conventional OEM-type combustion chambers"
What does this mean, anyone know?
Just found these gaskets as well
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...2D5800&FROM=MG
They're from Mr Gasket as well and will give similar quench and CR as the Felpro ( .048 quench 10.74-1 CR) is there a logical reason to spend almost twice as much on the Felpro?
Last edited by ultraviolet70; May 7, 2009 at 06:13 PM. Reason: Added gaskets
Racer
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 351
Likes: 1
From: Marysville OH
I would only consider FelPro or Cometic.
Keep looking through the FelPro catalog, there are tons of choices.
There are a bazillion thickness choices, one of them would dupilcate the MrGarbage gasket compressed thickness.
And no, I would have no problem with 11:1 in a street car running 93 octane w Al heads.
Hell, I am running 10.64:1 in a n/a 385 marine stroker w/ Al heads marine engine w/ no knock sensor (TBIV).....
Keep looking through the FelPro catalog, there are tons of choices.
There are a bazillion thickness choices, one of them would dupilcate the MrGarbage gasket compressed thickness.
And no, I would have no problem with 11:1 in a street car running 93 octane w Al heads.
Hell, I am running 10.64:1 in a n/a 385 marine stroker w/ Al heads marine engine w/ no knock sensor (TBIV).....
Last edited by bomar76; May 7, 2009 at 07:13 PM.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri
Problem is Cometic nor Felpro make any SBC Gen 1 gaskets with the right compressed thickness. Felpro I can get .015 than it jumps to .039 Cometics are .040 .015 is to thin and at .039 that puts my quench area at .049 which is a little more than I was wanting (my understanding is I want my quench area at about .040, is this correct?).
Anyone here have negative experience with the Mr Gasket head gaskets?
Anyone here have negative experience with the Mr Gasket head gaskets?
Racer
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 351
Likes: 1
From: Marysville OH
I cannot locate my FelPro master catalogue.
If you are relying on a search of Summit/Jegs sites for the gaskets, they only list a portion of what is available.
Call a vendor that has a master catalogue.
As for MrGarbage, the last time they sold anything that wasn't garbage was 1970.
Chineese crap.
If you are relying on a search of Summit/Jegs sites for the gaskets, they only list a portion of what is available.
Call a vendor that has a master catalogue.
As for MrGarbage, the last time they sold anything that wasn't garbage was 1970.
Chineese crap.
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,966
Likes: 4
From: Made In America
St. Jude Donor '10-'11
I would only consider FelPro or Cometic.
Keep looking through the FelPro catalog, there are tons of choices.
There are a bazillion thickness choices, one of them would dupilcate the MrGarbage gasket compressed thickness.
And no, I would have no problem with 11:1 in a street car running 93 octane w Al heads.
Hell, I am running 10.64:1 in a n/a 385 marine stroker w/ Al heads marine engine w/ no knock sensor (TBIV).....
Keep looking through the FelPro catalog, there are tons of choices.
There are a bazillion thickness choices, one of them would dupilcate the MrGarbage gasket compressed thickness.
And no, I would have no problem with 11:1 in a street car running 93 octane w Al heads.
Hell, I am running 10.64:1 in a n/a 385 marine stroker w/ Al heads marine engine w/ no knock sensor (TBIV).....
Mr. Garbage.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri
I cannot locate my FelPro master catalogue.
If you are relying on a search of Summit/Jegs sites for the gaskets, they only list a portion of what is available.
Call a vendor that has a master catalogue.
As for MrGarbage, the last time they sold anything that wasn't garbage was 1970.
Chineese crap.
If you are relying on a search of Summit/Jegs sites for the gaskets, they only list a portion of what is available.
Call a vendor that has a master catalogue.
As for MrGarbage, the last time they sold anything that wasn't garbage was 1970.
Chineese crap.
I just got off the phone with my local supplier I use and the only other available head gasket from Felpro with different measurements is .026 compressed and 4.100 bore this brings my compression to almost 11.25 which is definintely higher than I want.
Cometic catalog can be found on their site and they still only list .040 compressed thickness, of course they do offer custom made gaskets which I'm sure are out of my price range.
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Racer
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 387
Likes: 3
From: Indian Trail, NC
what about copper head gaskets? i've always heard good things about them and i know they're used on forced induction cars because they're less prone to blowout...especially if you're running really high boost. if memory serves, i had copper head gaskets on my Audi A4 turbo and was running 22lbs of boost on a T3/T4 50 trim... i was making about 350 - 400 crank hp with that setup on pump gas. now don't ask me who made the head gasket, because i had someone else build the car, so i don't know...
Racer
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 387
Likes: 3
From: Indian Trail, NC
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri
No it's really not.
Mill the heads and use a thicker gasket.
Here's hypothetical heads milled my pistons are still .010 below deck height, I step up to a .051 gasket and my compression is on ,but now my quench area is up to .061
What it sounds like is I'll use a Mr Garbage gaskets and cross my fingers.
Thanks for all the input guys
Mill the heads and use a thicker gasket.
Here's hypothetical heads milled my pistons are still .010 below deck height, I step up to a .051 gasket and my compression is on ,but now my quench area is up to .061
What it sounds like is I'll use a Mr Garbage gaskets and cross my fingers.
Thanks for all the input guys
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 431
From: Dale City VA
11.1 Static Compression Ratio (SCR) might be fine with pump gas and it might not be. It all depends on how big your camshaft is.
As long as your Dynamic Compression Ratio (DCR) is less that 9.1 you'll be ok on 92 octane. DCR is the BIG kicker on pump gas that most people don't even bother to calculate. The closer you start creeping the DCR to 9.1 the more attention you need to pay to the quench, having the right heat range plugs, and keeping cyl head temps down.
How close you can run the quench depends on piston alloy, bore clearance, rod type and the MAX RPM you plan to turn. A typical street engine turning less than 7000RPM, with a decent 4340 rods and 4032 alloy pistons can run the quench as tight as .036 before you start getting into problems.
As for the Mr Gasket head gaskets. Some are made by Victor Reinz and some are made by ROL. Both are very reputable gasket mfgrs and I'd run either in about anything without thinking twice.
Will
As long as your Dynamic Compression Ratio (DCR) is less that 9.1 you'll be ok on 92 octane. DCR is the BIG kicker on pump gas that most people don't even bother to calculate. The closer you start creeping the DCR to 9.1 the more attention you need to pay to the quench, having the right heat range plugs, and keeping cyl head temps down.
How close you can run the quench depends on piston alloy, bore clearance, rod type and the MAX RPM you plan to turn. A typical street engine turning less than 7000RPM, with a decent 4340 rods and 4032 alloy pistons can run the quench as tight as .036 before you start getting into problems.
As for the Mr Gasket head gaskets. Some are made by Victor Reinz and some are made by ROL. Both are very reputable gasket mfgrs and I'd run either in about anything without thinking twice.
Will
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri
11.1 Static Compression Ratio (SCR) might be fine with pump gas and it might not be. It all depends on how big your camshaft is.
As long as your Dynamic Compression Ratio (DCR) is less that 9.1 you'll be ok on 92 octane. DCR is the BIG kicker on pump gas that most people don't even bother to calculate. The closer you start creeping the DCR to 9.1 the more attention you need to pay to the quench, having the right heat range plugs, and keeping cyl head temps down.
How close you can run the quench depends on piston alloy, bore clearance, rod type and the MAX RPM you plan to turn. A typical street engine turning less than 7000RPM, with a decent 4340 rods and 4032 alloy pistons can run the quench as tight as .036 before you start getting into problems.
As for the Mr Gasket head gaskets. Some are made by Victor Reinz and some are made by ROL. Both are very reputable gasket mfgrs and I'd run either in about anything without thinking twice.
Will
As long as your Dynamic Compression Ratio (DCR) is less that 9.1 you'll be ok on 92 octane. DCR is the BIG kicker on pump gas that most people don't even bother to calculate. The closer you start creeping the DCR to 9.1 the more attention you need to pay to the quench, having the right heat range plugs, and keeping cyl head temps down.
How close you can run the quench depends on piston alloy, bore clearance, rod type and the MAX RPM you plan to turn. A typical street engine turning less than 7000RPM, with a decent 4340 rods and 4032 alloy pistons can run the quench as tight as .036 before you start getting into problems.
As for the Mr Gasket head gaskets. Some are made by Victor Reinz and some are made by ROL. Both are very reputable gasket mfgrs and I'd run either in about anything without thinking twice.
Will
Thanks for the detailed reply, here's a little more info. Let me know what you think knowing this.
With head gaskets providing 11-1 static calculator gives dynamic at 8.7-1
With head gaskets providing 10.75-1 static calculator gives dynamic at 8.5-1
My cam is a Comp cams 268xfi
http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/Ca...?csid=208&sb=0
The pistons are going to be KB Speed Pro Hypereautectic Pistons (I don't know if this is enough info on the pistons, but it's all I've got handy right now)
I don't imagine with my current intake I'll be turning much over 5500rpm
The rods are going to be 5140 Steel "SIR" Lightweight Connecting Rods
Knowing this would you suggest the .028 thick gaskets (.038 quench area) or .038 thick gaskets (.048 quench area)
Thanks again
Dane
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 431
From: Dale City VA
Hey Will
Thanks for the detailed reply, here's a little more info. Let me know what you think knowing this.
With head gaskets providing 11-1 static calculator gives dynamic at 8.7-1
With head gaskets providing 10.75-1 static calculator gives dynamic at 8.5-1
My cam is a Comp cams 268xfi
http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/Ca...?csid=208&sb=0
The pistons are going to be KB Speed Pro Hypereautectic Pistons (I don't know if this is enough info on the pistons, but it's all I've got handy right now)
I don't imagine with my current intake I'll be turning much over 5500rpm
The rods are going to be 5140 Steel "SIR" Lightweight Connecting Rods
Knowing this would you suggest the .028 thick gaskets (.038 quench area) or .038 thick gaskets (.048 quench area)
Thanks again
Dane
Thanks for the detailed reply, here's a little more info. Let me know what you think knowing this.
With head gaskets providing 11-1 static calculator gives dynamic at 8.7-1
With head gaskets providing 10.75-1 static calculator gives dynamic at 8.5-1
My cam is a Comp cams 268xfi
http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/Ca...?csid=208&sb=0
The pistons are going to be KB Speed Pro Hypereautectic Pistons (I don't know if this is enough info on the pistons, but it's all I've got handy right now)
I don't imagine with my current intake I'll be turning much over 5500rpm
The rods are going to be 5140 Steel "SIR" Lightweight Connecting Rods
Knowing this would you suggest the .028 thick gaskets (.038 quench area) or .038 thick gaskets (.048 quench area)
Thanks again
Dane
The Hyper pistons are low expansion and run pretty tight on the bore clearance so that means less rocking when the rod goes over TDC. They have some draw back thou. They are not very strong and require the top ring gap to be very wide. PLEASE make sure your top ring gap follows the included guidlines KB sends with their hyper pistons.... Your asking for trouble if you run it too tight.
The SIR rods are a bit better than stock so that is a plus considering your low RPM range.
Using my DCR calculator with a SCR of 11.0-1 and you cam installed on it's 109 ICL - gives me a DCR of 8.97-1
IMO I'd use the .028 head gasket and make sure my tune was dead on. Your tuner better know his business thou as theose hyper pistons won't stand much detonation before they fail (with spectacularly nasty results).
If your not so confident in your tuners ability to keep you car out of spark knock I'd go with the .038 gasket and give up the little bit of power.
Will
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri
Dane
The Hyper pistons are low expansion and run pretty tight on the bore clearance so that means less rocking when the rod goes over TDC. They have some draw back thou. They are not very strong and require the top ring gap to be very wide. PLEASE make sure your top ring gap follows the included guidlines KB sends with their hyper pistons.... Your asking for trouble if you run it too tight.
The SIR rods are a bit better than stock so that is a plus considering your low RPM range.
Using my DCR calculator with a SCR of 11.0-1 and you cam installed on it's 109 ICL - gives me a DCR of 8.97-1
IMO I'd use the .028 head gasket and make sure my tune was dead on. Your tuner better know his business thou as theose hyper pistons won't stand much detonation before they fail (with spectacularly nasty results).
If your not so confident in your tuners ability to keep you car out of spark knock I'd go with the .038 gasket and give up the little bit of power.
Will
The Hyper pistons are low expansion and run pretty tight on the bore clearance so that means less rocking when the rod goes over TDC. They have some draw back thou. They are not very strong and require the top ring gap to be very wide. PLEASE make sure your top ring gap follows the included guidlines KB sends with their hyper pistons.... Your asking for trouble if you run it too tight.
The SIR rods are a bit better than stock so that is a plus considering your low RPM range.
Using my DCR calculator with a SCR of 11.0-1 and you cam installed on it's 109 ICL - gives me a DCR of 8.97-1
IMO I'd use the .028 head gasket and make sure my tune was dead on. Your tuner better know his business thou as theose hyper pistons won't stand much detonation before they fail (with spectacularly nasty results).
If your not so confident in your tuners ability to keep you car out of spark knock I'd go with the .038 gasket and give up the little bit of power.
Will
Thanks
Dane
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,102
Likes: 1
From: Portsmouth Virginia 396LT4 435RWHP/400RWTQ Best so far 11.26 @ 123mph
Dane,
Just for info if you should want Cometic,thay can make various custom thickness head gaskets other than what is listed standard. Just had a set of .036" gaskets made by them from their website for the LT1 but you will pay alot more since it is custom made.
Rick
Just for info if you should want Cometic,thay can make various custom thickness head gaskets other than what is listed standard. Just had a set of .036" gaskets made by them from their website for the LT1 but you will pay alot more since it is custom made.
Rick
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri
I did notice on their site that they offered custom gaskets. I figured they were pretty pricey in comparison, out of curiousity approx. how much did you have to give?
Thanks
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 2
From: High Ridge Missouri