E85, PT91.5 mm , 1000 + setup
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,937
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From: My interests are mobile
So, in typical injector calc's using 1000bhp, 8 inj., 90%duty, .78bsfc your talking 105lb'ers or 1000cc'ers, maybe with a base pressure of 50 or so. I've idled 1600's solid with an injector driver though, so consider that possibility, though true standalone I assume could handle that.
Sounds fun, wish there was someone building a monster Vette near me...I'd be doing some sick fab on that b*tch to make it wicked.
(BSFC=Brake Specific Fuel Consumption for readers who are lost on that)
Last edited by RC000E; Mar 10, 2010 at 08:36 PM.
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 121
Likes: 0
I want to get a bigger intercooler to replace the procharger cooloer that is currently sitting on top of the radiator shorud. Believe it or not it works OK at my power level (estimated 400RWHP), but I want to step up boost and get a bigger intercooler as this one reportedly is robbing 3-4 pounds, so I may be able to get more boost just by replacing.
The biggest dilema is how/where to mount it on a C4.
I want to mount it forward of the radiator so each can get their own cold air path, just wondering about other ideas.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,937
Likes: 348
From: My interests are mobile
Doing a v mount will definitely take some fab and mod of the front end. I'm sure it could be done behind stock bodywork...just would take a good fab guy.
There are various and small difference in arrangements but this is the basic idea.
There are various and small difference in arrangements but this is the basic idea.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,284
Likes: 4
From: Canton MI
I had Precision build my intercooler.
mounts in front of Radiator.
4.5" core
1300HP rated.
BTW, I have my 434 out. heads off, found broken inner valve spring.
I am not very happy about this, I dont know how long I have been running it like this. Pistons look OK,
I got the Heads over at Morans he is going to go thru them, and set up new springs for tubo cam
I'm probably 2 months from Dyno, Its taken a while but getting there.
pair of 6252 Precision air to air into Miniram 434, on pump gas.
JW
mounts in front of Radiator.
4.5" core
1300HP rated.
BTW, I have my 434 out. heads off, found broken inner valve spring.
I am not very happy about this, I dont know how long I have been running it like this. Pistons look OK,
I got the Heads over at Morans he is going to go thru them, and set up new springs for tubo cam
I'm probably 2 months from Dyno, Its taken a while but getting there.
pair of 6252 Precision air to air into Miniram 434, on pump gas.
JW
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,284
Likes: 4
From: Canton MI
Yeah, your pretty dead on with that estimate. Under full load I was looking at about a 35% jump in volume max. BSFC with E85 varies due to mixture variations between the winter/summer mix which generally are E74 and E79, something quite annoying as a street driver. I ended up with two tunes, but asking the retard at the counter if summer mix was in yet was always a "HUH". Generally your talking about a BSFC multiplier of 1.3 or so. So, with typical gasoline/turbocharged motors you have a BSFC of 0.60, with E85 your talking 0.78.
So, in typical injector calc's using 1000bhp, 8 inj., 90%duty, .78bsfc your talking 105lb'ers or 1000cc'ers, maybe with a base pressure of 50 or so. I've idled 1600's solid with an injector driver though, so consider that possibility, though true standalone I assume could handle that.
Sounds fun, wish there was someone building a monster Vette near me...I'd be doing some sick fab on that b*tch to make it wicked.
(BSFC=Brake Specific Fuel Consumption for readers who are lost on that)
So, in typical injector calc's using 1000bhp, 8 inj., 90%duty, .78bsfc your talking 105lb'ers or 1000cc'ers, maybe with a base pressure of 50 or so. I've idled 1600's solid with an injector driver though, so consider that possibility, though true standalone I assume could handle that.
Sounds fun, wish there was someone building a monster Vette near me...I'd be doing some sick fab on that b*tch to make it wicked.
(BSFC=Brake Specific Fuel Consumption for readers who are lost on that)
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 121
Likes: 0
This is an intersting setup.
Have you seen how Procharger does their LT1 intercoolers?
My setup has the intercooler on top of the shroud and you cut a hole in the shroud and the air flows upward through the intercooler. The angle relative to the radiator is different in that the back slopes up rather than down as compared to the V setup you showed.
Since the corvette is a bottom feeder air flow, I do not think this would pose a disadvantage.
I will say that my car does NOT run hot. It will heatsoak in stop and go.
Maybe I will give a closer look on fitting a bigger cooler on top of the shroud rather than fabbing it into the nose and going through all of the fab and plumbing.
Have you seen how Procharger does their LT1 intercoolers?
My setup has the intercooler on top of the shroud and you cut a hole in the shroud and the air flows upward through the intercooler. The angle relative to the radiator is different in that the back slopes up rather than down as compared to the V setup you showed.
Since the corvette is a bottom feeder air flow, I do not think this would pose a disadvantage.
I will say that my car does NOT run hot. It will heatsoak in stop and go.
Maybe I will give a closer look on fitting a bigger cooler on top of the shroud rather than fabbing it into the nose and going through all of the fab and plumbing.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,022
Likes: 3
From: Chandler Arizona
This is an intersting setup.
Have you seen how Procharger does their LT1 intercoolers?
My setup has the intercooler on top of the shroud and you cut a hole in the shroud and the air flows upward through the intercooler. The angle relative to the radiator is different in that the back slopes up rather than down as compared to the V setup you showed.
Since the corvette is a bottom feeder air flow, I do not think this would pose a disadvantage.
I will say that my car does NOT run hot. It will heatsoak in stop and go.
Maybe I will give a closer look on fitting a bigger cooler on top of the shroud rather than fabbing it into the nose and going through all of the fab and plumbing.
Have you seen how Procharger does their LT1 intercoolers?
My setup has the intercooler on top of the shroud and you cut a hole in the shroud and the air flows upward through the intercooler. The angle relative to the radiator is different in that the back slopes up rather than down as compared to the V setup you showed.
Since the corvette is a bottom feeder air flow, I do not think this would pose a disadvantage.
I will say that my car does NOT run hot. It will heatsoak in stop and go.
Maybe I will give a closer look on fitting a bigger cooler on top of the shroud rather than fabbing it into the nose and going through all of the fab and plumbing.
I think the problem you (and I) will run into with an intercooler is retaining the stock creature comforts! once you get exotic with the layout, you run into custom fabrication (i.e. expensive) or all together eliminating certain items (i.e. air conditioning).
the meth injection certainly seems to be a reasonable choice for short bursts (like around open roads, or the 1/4 mile strip). it eliminates a lot of plumbing, added weight, and rearrangement of components.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,022
Likes: 3
From: Chandler Arizona
Although I do like the arrangement as it doesn't restrict flow to either radiator.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,937
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From: My interests are mobile
Well, I wouldn't say Vmounts are really restricted to any certain vehicles. FD's are just simple because rotaries are so small. It can be done in anything though, just depends on core sizes and fabricator ability. His car is full tube chassis, so I could do a v mount on that with my eyes half opened. With most unibody cars its generally just a matter of doing a tube chassis forward of the strut towers...eliminating the rad support and doing custom headlight mountings, etc.
I've never seen a V mount on a Corvette, but that's typically because there aren't many people doing anything extreme to these cars beyond bolt ons or on the opposite end like the OP's car...which isn't really a vette anymore.
Like I said...I wish there were some Corvette builders near me...me and my TIG would provide proof of concept.
Personally, I'm not certain with what approach I'm going to take on my car. I need to really look at the logistics of the front end area to make an assessment of how I'd proceed. I'm not familiar with these cars so I can't speculate. Based on the front end shape though, I feel its totally possible while retaining stock bodywork. You just can't be afraid to radically alter the structure beneath.
I've never seen a V mount on a Corvette, but that's typically because there aren't many people doing anything extreme to these cars beyond bolt ons or on the opposite end like the OP's car...which isn't really a vette anymore.
Like I said...I wish there were some Corvette builders near me...me and my TIG would provide proof of concept.
Personally, I'm not certain with what approach I'm going to take on my car. I need to really look at the logistics of the front end area to make an assessment of how I'd proceed. I'm not familiar with these cars so I can't speculate. Based on the front end shape though, I feel its totally possible while retaining stock bodywork. You just can't be afraid to radically alter the structure beneath.
Last edited by RC000E; Mar 12, 2010 at 01:18 PM.
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 121
Likes: 0
RC /MNSTRLT1,
Give this link a try.
http://www.aacorvette.com/supercharg...roducts_id=158
Its A&A corvette and they do a C5 ram air system that mounts the intercooler about 6 inches in front of the radiator with its own air path.
I am looking to fab this into my C4,
The other approach since you showed me the V arrangement, is to jkeep the procharger setup and see how large of an intercooler can be put on top of the shroud, as it is today.
Give this link a try.
http://www.aacorvette.com/supercharg...roducts_id=158
Its A&A corvette and they do a C5 ram air system that mounts the intercooler about 6 inches in front of the radiator with its own air path.
I am looking to fab this into my C4,
The other approach since you showed me the V arrangement, is to jkeep the procharger setup and see how large of an intercooler can be put on top of the shroud, as it is today.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,937
Likes: 348
From: My interests are mobile
Yeah, a spacing arrangement is how its generally done. That's how I've fabbed countless setups. Vmount is generally necessary for racing applications where heat soak must be battled in every way possible.
The example above doesn't really seem groundbreaking to me aside from the shape of the core and some ducting. Your still bleeding hot air over the entire rad. V mount avoids that entirely. Hot air=less dense, more knock prone...add in high coolant temps and your knock threshold is reduced further. Non vmounts are fine for most applications in my experience, as long as the cooling system is efficient enough given the forced induction setup and working properly.
The example above doesn't really seem groundbreaking to me aside from the shape of the core and some ducting. Your still bleeding hot air over the entire rad. V mount avoids that entirely. Hot air=less dense, more knock prone...add in high coolant temps and your knock threshold is reduced further. Non vmounts are fine for most applications in my experience, as long as the cooling system is efficient enough given the forced induction setup and working properly.
Last edited by RC000E; Mar 12, 2010 at 02:00 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,937
Likes: 348
From: My interests are mobile
By the way, in this more "closed" area of the forum I must tell you something mnstrLT1. I've concluded, that based on pricing, there is literally no wheel out there I can find that appeals to me as much as your "lipped" ZR1's for the price. I'm gonna have to go that route until I can fund the wheels I'm having made. I just don't have a choice. 900 bucks is too cheap to pass. So, guess there'll be two of us rockin'em.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,022
Likes: 3
From: Chandler Arizona
By the way, in this more "closed" area of the forum I must tell you something mnstrLT1. I've concluded, that based on pricing, there is literally no wheel out there I can find that appeals to me as much as your "lipped" ZR1's for the price. I'm gonna have to go that route until I can fund the wheels I'm having made. I just don't have a choice. 900 bucks is too cheap to pass. So, guess there'll be two of us rockin'em.
Drop me a PM, I actually paid LESS THAN $500 dollars for the set NEW and SHIPPED! Of course, I can't promise that you'll get them at the same price I did, but on average they advertise them for like $515 shipped.... the nitto 555 DR's are also VERY cheap- I've got an awesome connection on them as well (or any tire of your choice).
btw- I appreciate the complement on the car.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,022
Likes: 3
From: Chandler Arizona
RC /MNSTRLT1,
Give this link a try.
http://www.aacorvette.com/supercharg...roducts_id=158
Its A&A corvette and they do a C5 ram air system that mounts the intercooler about 6 inches in front of the radiator with its own air path.
I am looking to fab this into my C4,
The other approach since you showed me the V arrangement, is to jkeep the procharger setup and see how large of an intercooler can be put on top of the shroud, as it is today.
Give this link a try.
http://www.aacorvette.com/supercharg...roducts_id=158
Its A&A corvette and they do a C5 ram air system that mounts the intercooler about 6 inches in front of the radiator with its own air path.
I am looking to fab this into my C4,
The other approach since you showed me the V arrangement, is to jkeep the procharger setup and see how large of an intercooler can be put on top of the shroud, as it is today.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,937
Likes: 348
From: My interests are mobile
He stated he's goin EFI up above...you must've missed it.
I can vouch though, as I've attempted to tune two carb'd turbo setups. Despite having tuned countless boosted EFI cars, the carb'd ones ran and didn't blow up....but give me fuel injection any day please. Granted this is a drag queen, so tuning for WOT only is far easier, but for a street vehicle...hah....NEVER again.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,937
Likes: 348
From: My interests are mobile
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,284
Likes: 4
From: Canton MI
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 758
Likes: 1
From: Cumming GA
I hope to have bowtie8 up to Milan around July.
Probably be its first pass with the turbos after the dyno
Moran is most likely going to dyno tune my car as I am covered up at work these days. I used to do everything myself, now its a comprimise
JW
Probably be its first pass with the turbos after the dyno
Moran is most likely going to dyno tune my car as I am covered up at work these days. I used to do everything myself, now its a comprimise
JW
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 758
Likes: 1
From: Cumming GA
Not planning on 4th gear in quarter as I tried this last year with 4.86 rear gear, the 60ft was 1.3 but the mph fell off bad in 4th to get thru the traps.
What gear do you plan on running. for me I simply anticipated the power and mph and peak rpm to come up with 3.45
just curious as the center section isnt out yet
Your running a 28" ET Street or slick right?
JW