C4 Starter Motor Problem
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 28
Likes: 5
C4 Starter Motor Problem
Hi Guys,
I'm having an intermittent problem with my starter motor. Sometimes when I turn the key, there is a click and engagement of the solenoid but the engine does not crank over.
The battery is new and charged.
The starter is 1 year old
I have measured the voltage at the battery:
10.3 volts when cranking normally
7.3 volts when motor not turning (motor stalled and drawing a lot of current)
I suspect the following:
The starter motor is bad (hard to believe since 1 year old)
The ring gear is damaged and the starter is getting jammed
Does anyone have advice or experience with this type of problem?
Do C4 ring gears fail like this? (I only have 100k miles)
Thanks for any advice
I'm having an intermittent problem with my starter motor. Sometimes when I turn the key, there is a click and engagement of the solenoid but the engine does not crank over.
The battery is new and charged.
The starter is 1 year old
I have measured the voltage at the battery:
10.3 volts when cranking normally
7.3 volts when motor not turning (motor stalled and drawing a lot of current)
I suspect the following:
The starter motor is bad (hard to believe since 1 year old)
The ring gear is damaged and the starter is getting jammed
Does anyone have advice or experience with this type of problem?
Do C4 ring gears fail like this? (I only have 100k miles)
Thanks for any advice
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 19,294
Likes: 2,754
From: Charlotte NC
Hi Guys,
I'm having an intermittent problem with my starter motor. Sometimes when I turn the key, there is a click and engagement of the solenoid but the engine does not crank over.
The battery is new and charged.
The starter is 1 year old
I have measured the voltage at the battery:
10.3 volts when cranking normally
7.3 volts when motor not turning (motor stalled and drawing a lot of current)
I suspect the following:
The starter motor is bad (hard to believe since 1 year old)
The ring gear is damaged and the starter is getting jammed
Does anyone have advice or experience with this type of problem?
Do C4 ring gears fail like this? (I only have 100k miles)
Thanks for any advice
I'm having an intermittent problem with my starter motor. Sometimes when I turn the key, there is a click and engagement of the solenoid but the engine does not crank over.
The battery is new and charged.
The starter is 1 year old
I have measured the voltage at the battery:
10.3 volts when cranking normally
7.3 volts when motor not turning (motor stalled and drawing a lot of current)
I suspect the following:
The starter motor is bad (hard to believe since 1 year old)
The ring gear is damaged and the starter is getting jammed
Does anyone have advice or experience with this type of problem?
Do C4 ring gears fail like this? (I only have 100k miles)
Thanks for any advice
If when the engine is cranking it has 10.3 volts. It can NOT have 7.3 volts when not cranking. Are you sure you typed your information correctly???
If the bendix of the starter is getting hung up onto the ring gear...it needs to be shimmed ..or checked to make sure it is tight and properly supported as GM designed with the bracket at the end of the armature housing.
Check ALL cables. Those at the battery to make sure they are CLEAN and TIGHT...and that the positive battery cable at eh starter solenoid is tight...and that the stud that the positive cable attaches to is not loose. IF you remove or loosen the nut for the positive cable at the solenoid and the stud wiggles...remove the cable and tighten it.
DUB
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,082
Likes: 3
From: Conowingo Maryland
could be several things. On cases like this I would rather know how many apms you are pulling rather then voltage. It is tough going bu what you are saying. And sometimes there is nothing better then hearing it in person. Many of times when the drive is engauging and enguaging hard something could be holding the motor from turning over. Ie cooleeant in a cyl causing a hud effect. Iv see alt, air pumps ect lock up and not permit a motor to spin. Like DUB said check all connections first, If you can get an inductive amp meter see how many amps your starter is drawing. A load tester will give you a lot more information if you get borrow one it will give you a much better indication of your batteries stat of charge
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,065
Likes: 39
Do a load test on the battery. Then check to see if you have 12v at the B terminal of the starter, and 12v at the S terminal of the starter with someone else turning the key to start.
Check to see if you have good ground by measuring from the battery positive terminal to the metal part of the starter with a voltmeter, it should be 12v.
Before you replace it, you can try tapping on the motor itself with the back of a screw driver, and you can also try rotating the crankshaft clockwise with a 5/8 socket with the car in park or neutral, neutral if manual transmission. Then try starting it. What you are trying to do in this test is see if you have a jammed or broken tooth on the flywheel/flexplate. If these don't work replace the starter. If rotating the crankshaft works, replace the flywheel/flexplate.
I should also mention, if you cannot turn the crank by hand the motor is seized. Remember it has to be in neutral!
Before doing this, is the motor cranking over? If someone stands over the motor and you crank it, does the serpentine belt move? If so then you are dealing with a different problem.
Check to see if you have good ground by measuring from the battery positive terminal to the metal part of the starter with a voltmeter, it should be 12v.
Before you replace it, you can try tapping on the motor itself with the back of a screw driver, and you can also try rotating the crankshaft clockwise with a 5/8 socket with the car in park or neutral, neutral if manual transmission. Then try starting it. What you are trying to do in this test is see if you have a jammed or broken tooth on the flywheel/flexplate. If these don't work replace the starter. If rotating the crankshaft works, replace the flywheel/flexplate.
I should also mention, if you cannot turn the crank by hand the motor is seized. Remember it has to be in neutral!
Before doing this, is the motor cranking over? If someone stands over the motor and you crank it, does the serpentine belt move? If so then you are dealing with a different problem.
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Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 28
Likes: 5
could be several things. On cases like this I would rather know how many apms you are pulling rather then voltage. It is tough going bu what you are saying. And sometimes there is nothing better then hearing it in person. Many of times when the drive is engauging and enguaging hard something could be holding the motor from turning over. Ie cooleeant in a cyl causing a hud effect. Iv see alt, air pumps ect lock up and not permit a motor to spin. Like DUB said check all connections first, If you can get an inductive amp meter see how many amps your starter is drawing. A load tester will give you a lot more information if you get borrow one it will give you a much better indication of your batteries stat of charge
Other observations/comments in response to the other helpful replies:
- The Engine starts and runs fine when the starter is coaxed out of the "stuck" position. I unstick it by repeatedly engaging the starter with the key. Nothing else is hindering the crank turning.
- I have cleaned the terminals
- It cranks rapidly when not jammed
- I am interested to know about any adjustment or shimming to set the throw of the bendix
- I am horrified to think about replacing the ring gear.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 19,294
Likes: 2,754
From: Charlotte NC
There are two types of starter shims...one is for the bolts being side by side...and the other style is for the bolts being staggered. Start with a thin shim and go form there. You might be surprised that a thin shim will do the trick.
DUB
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 28
Likes: 5
Depending on the mounting bolt positions that hold the starter to your engine block will determine which type of starter shim you need to buy.
There are two types of starter shims...one is for the bolts being side by side...and the other style is for the bolts being staggered. Start with a thin shim and go form there. You might be surprised that a thin shim will do the trick.
DUB
There are two types of starter shims...one is for the bolts being side by side...and the other style is for the bolts being staggered. Start with a thin shim and go form there. You might be surprised that a thin shim will do the trick.
DUB
I hope the problem can be fixed by shimming. This does make sense based on the symptoms.