C4 Tech/Performance L98 Corvette and LT1 Corvette Technical Info, Internal Engine, External Engine

Dyno numbers talk

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Mar 11, 2016 | 08:05 AM
  #21  
bjankuski's Avatar
bjankuski
Safety Car
20 Year Member
Photogenic
Liked
Top Answer: 1
 
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,153
Likes: 553
From: Glenbeulah Wi
Default

Originally Posted by vader86
Then we'll agree to disagree, I believe the transmissions and differentials and suspension tech to get the power to the wheel are more efficient because of tighter manufacturing standards and lighter/smaller parts that reduce the inertia, and special coatings to reduce the simple coefficients of friction between parts irrespective of fluid choices. I have seen numerous articles over the years discussing it.
I tend to disagree with this statement and this is why. Years ago cars were only making 300 HP and the rear ends and drivetrain parts needed to support that level of power were small. Look at the Dana 36 or the 7-5/8 rear end in the 4th gen Camaro, they were small and light duty. The power to drive these rear ends was low and the frictional losses from these rear ends due to oil drag and bearing friction was low. Step up to todays 650 HP cars and take a look at the E-Differential in vette. That is one impressive piece but it is large to handle all the power those cars put out. Large gears, large bearings, heavy duty half shafts, all good things to have but there will be more frictional losses with these items when compared to older smaller rear ends.

I have done a few back to back dyno tests of the small 7-5/8 ring gear in the 4-gen Camaro when compared to aftermarket rear ends like the strange S60 or the chevy 12 bolt and in those cases depending on the power output of the car I have seen the larger rear ends with the same gear ratio drop 12 to 15 HP with no other changes. It takes power to spin the larger larger rear ends, more losses from frictional drag of the oil and frictional drag from the bearings.
Reply
Old Mar 11, 2016 | 01:21 PM
  #22  
cv67's Avatar
cv67
Team Owner
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 81,241
Likes: 3,063
From: altered state
St. Jude Donor '05
Default

WAT R UR MoD5


Last edited by cv67; Mar 11, 2016 at 01:23 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 12, 2016 | 11:17 AM
  #23  
pologreen1's Avatar
pologreen1
Thread Starter
Team Owner
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 20,974
Likes: 261
Default

So all these posts make me wonder who or how the new cars get dynoded from the factory. I know viper does their own. I wonder If they need really good tuners or what they look for in a standard for a tune, since they can be improved after purchase.
Reply
Old Mar 12, 2016 | 11:30 AM
  #24  
five7kid's Avatar
five7kid
Racer
 
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 324
Likes: 7
From: Littleton Colorado
Default

Originally Posted by pologreen1
So all these posts make me wonder who or how the new cars get dynoded from the factory. I know viper does their own. I wonder If they need really good tuners or what they look for in a standard for a tune, since they can be improved after purchase.
For sure the factory doesn't dyno every car. They dyno the engine during development when the production design is finalized. They dyno at the flywheel, with the engine set up like it will be in the car with everything installed - air intake, exhaust, accessories (AC not operating, as you might have guessed), emissions equipment. This is known as "net flywheel HP", which all manufacturers are required to use when advertising power numbers.

Not that they don't do chassis dyno testing. A former co-worker went to work for the GM Proving Grounds in Michigan back in the early 90's and sent us a picture of him standing next to NASCAR #3 on the chassis dyno - his comment: "This one was loud."
Reply
Old Mar 12, 2016 | 01:10 PM
  #25  
MatthewMiller's Avatar
MatthewMiller
Le Mans Master
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
Top Answer: 1
 
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,090
Likes: 1,972
From: St. Charles MO
Default

Originally Posted by pologreen1
So all these posts make me wonder who or how the new cars get dynoded from the factory. I know viper does their own. I wonder If they need really good tuners or what they look for in a standard for a tune, since they can be improved after purchase.
There are margins built in for production tolerances, but not nearly as much as there used to be. These days, onboard ECMs are sophisticated and fast, so they are programmed to sense knock and stay just inside the safe zone, for example. There aren't big gains to be had on a new car, and those that get some gains are flirting with the safety margins. The days of safely picking up 30hp with just a tune or chip are gone.

ETA: That is not to say that if you make mechanical mods, such as long-tube headers, on a new car there isn't power to be picked up from reprogramming. That's a different story.

Last edited by MatthewMiller; Mar 12, 2016 at 01:11 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 13, 2016 | 08:20 AM
  #26  
cv67's Avatar
cv67
Team Owner
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 81,241
Likes: 3,063
From: altered state
St. Jude Donor '05
Default

The days of safely picking up 30hp with just a tune or chip are gone.


Many an amateur has found out the hard way with these and others (S/C stangs esp) that its just best to leave them alone
Reply




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:06 AM.

story-0
Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!

Slideshow: The 10 most explosive Corvettes ever built based on power-to-weight ratio.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-20 07:23:03


VIEW MORE
story-1
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter

Slideshow: From C1 to C8 we compare every Corvette generation by the numbers.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-12 16:54:12


VIEW MORE
story-2
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time

Slideshow: Some Corvette pace cars became collectible legends, while others perfectly captured the look and attitude of their era.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-11 09:50:51


VIEW MORE
story-3
Top 10 Corvette Engines RANKED by Peak Torque (70+ Years of Muscle!)

Slideshow: Ranking the top 10 Corvette engines by torque output.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-05 11:58:09


VIEW MORE
story-4
Corvette ZR1X Will Be Pacing the Indy 500, And Could Probably Race, Too!

Slideshow: A Corvette pace car nearly matching IndyCar speeds sounds exaggerated, until you look at the numbers.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-04 20:03:36


VIEW MORE
story-5
Top 10 Corvettes Coming to Mecum Indy 2026!

Among a rather large group of them.

By Brett Foote | 2026-05-04 13:56:44


VIEW MORE
story-6
Top 10 C9 Corvette MUST-HAVES to Fix These C8 Generation Flaws!

Slideshow: the top 10 things Corvette owners want in the C9 Corvette

By Michael S. Palmer | 2026-04-30 12:41:15


VIEW MORE
story-7
10 Revolutionary 'Corvette Firsts' Most People Don't Know

Slideshow: 10 Important Corvette 'firsts' that every fan should know.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-04-29 17:02:16


VIEW MORE
story-8
5 Reasons to Upgrade to an LS6-Powered Corvette; 5 Reasons to Stay LT2

Slideshow: Should you buy a 2020-2026 Corvette or wait for 2027?

By Michael S. Palmer | 2026-04-22 10:08:58


VIEW MORE
story-9
2027 Corvette vs The World: Every C8 vs Its Closest Competitor

Slideshow: 2027 Corvette lineup vs the world.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-04-24 16:12:42


VIEW MORE