Oil Change Time
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2004
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From: Park City Utah
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
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BTW, quantify "many."
if any of what you're saying was true, I would think the car manufacturers would have been pumping technical service bulletins out the yin-yang. not one manufacture has addressed anything on additional zinc requirements for their engines.
all we're sayings is you just need to follow the manufacturers recommendations on weight or viscosity, and change at the recommended intervals and you're good to go. the oil companies formulate, and API spec the oil (currently SN, which is backward compatible), to meet current engine requirements.
PROVE ME WRONG!!!
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 21,543
Likes: 3,216
From: Park City Utah
B/c in the other thread that I linked, someone said, recent camshaft failures is unprecedented.
I believe the word "epidemic" was used as well.
That is not specific either...but Come on. Those words imply a much larger problem than there is; there is no epidemic, there is no "unprecedented" failures. Although not as severe, I wonder what you mean by "many" too. B/c in all my personal...and all my fleet experience, I've seen zero "old flat tappet cam motors were grinding lobes". It isn't happening. Oil today is way better than good enough.
.
Last edited by Tom400CFI; Jul 10, 2017 at 07:30 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,451
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From: Greater Cincinnati Area.
There's two instances now, both dealing with performance appications specifically, and they call for a particular brand, and grade, of motor oil?
What, it's like magic? Blessed by a Voodoo Oil Priest or something?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,451
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From: Greater Cincinnati Area.
Or some other brand?
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2006
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From: Ashland, OH
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,008
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From: Ashland, OH
I knew someone who had that "brilliant" idea. They knew it would work way better than GM's recommendation and provide better wear protection. One cold winter day, he fired up his Silverado after work, went back in to let it warm up. Came out 10 min later and it wasn't running -engine was seized. Oil was so thick it broke the oil pump drive shaft. Good idea...huh. Meanwhile, MY Silverado (same truck) cruises right on by 300k towing boats through the rockies, cold winters, hot SLC summers all on M1 5w-30. And it still performs like new (engine wise, at least!). How can that be??? 
There are other reasons why diesel oil isn't the OEM's recommended fill. You can do it...but I certainly wouldn't be going around make that "recommendation" to people, that's for sure.
.
There are other reasons why diesel oil isn't the OEM's recommended fill. You can do it...but I certainly wouldn't be going around make that "recommendation" to people, that's for sure.
.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,451
Likes: 336
From: Greater Cincinnati Area.
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,451
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From: Greater Cincinnati Area.
Hemmings has an article that says the exact opposite of what I read here?
I read one study, it says this.. Another says that?
I dunno? Why is there such confusion on this subject? I don't get it?
I read one study, it says this.. Another says that?
I dunno? Why is there such confusion on this subject? I don't get it?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,451
Likes: 336
From: Greater Cincinnati Area.
HERE!! Hemmings says everyone is FOS.
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2012/1...comments-block
But the next study says THEY'RE FOS!
And, it just leaves me confused?
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2012/1...comments-block
But the next study says THEY'RE FOS!
And, it just leaves me confused?
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,470
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well, I guess we could go on here forever, so my bottom line - i'm just going to keep doing what I've been doing with my 85 since the mid 90's. pretty much follow the owners manual for oil and change intervals. nothing fancy, no additives, everything pretty much by the book. the only thing lately I've been done different was switching to M1 high mileage synthetic (10W30). i'm driving about 5K per year with this car. at that rate, it's going to take another 20 years to hit the 250K mark. hopefully both me and the 85 will make it. so, i'm pretty much done here. folks can do what they want - honestly, I could care less - 
& 
&
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,561
Likes: 946
From: Communist Colorado
Guys, debate is healthy... no need to get frustrated... People really don't know certain things and are interested in real information. Stop arguing... ask and get answers... comment when you have a good piece of experience or information. Telling one person they're an idiot because you don't agree with them, makes you the idiot!!!
Some of us are older with more knowledge to share with the younger guys... that's Awesome!! Think of how many people just lurk here and may need a real answer for their own use.
So.... that brings me to another question I thought of....
Is today's conventional oil formulated with the same levels of ZDDP as when it was prescribed for the vehicle when it was made?
Some of us are older with more knowledge to share with the younger guys... that's Awesome!! Think of how many people just lurk here and may need a real answer for their own use.
So.... that brings me to another question I thought of....
Is today's conventional oil formulated with the same levels of ZDDP as when it was prescribed for the vehicle when it was made?
Pro
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 583
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From: Wisconsin
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,008
Likes: 1,487
From: Ashland, OH
Guys, debate is healthy... no need to get frustrated... People really don't know certain things and are interested in real information. Stop arguing... ask and get answers... comment when you have a good piece of experience or information. Telling one person they're an idiot because you don't agree with them, makes you the idiot!!!
Some of us are older with more knowledge to share with the younger guys... that's Awesome!! Think of how many people just lurk here and may need a real answer for their own use.
So.... that brings me to another question I thought of....
Is today's conventional oil formulated with the same levels of ZDDP as when it was prescribed for the vehicle when it was made?
Some of us are older with more knowledge to share with the younger guys... that's Awesome!! Think of how many people just lurk here and may need a real answer for their own use.
So.... that brings me to another question I thought of....
Is today's conventional oil formulated with the same levels of ZDDP as when it was prescribed for the vehicle when it was made?
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 21,543
Likes: 3,216
From: Park City Utah
Someone who thinks that they're a "Master Lube Brewer".
Which based on this thread, could be ~50% of the people. Everyone has some "brilliant" idea...this guy's idea was diesel oil. You've got your own version....and I have mine; use the OEM recommended oil, change it when due and enjoy engine life so long that the car falls apart around the engine.
Which based on this thread, could be ~50% of the people. Everyone has some "brilliant" idea...this guy's idea was diesel oil. You've got your own version....and I have mine; use the OEM recommended oil, change it when due and enjoy engine life so long that the car falls apart around the engine.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 21,543
Likes: 3,216
From: Park City Utah
Np. This subject really interests me.
And ALL I find when reading about it is conflicting data?
I just want to know the truth.. FTW?!>!@>!>
Hemmings has an article that says the exact opposite of what I read here?
I read one study, it says this.. Another says that?
I dunno? Why is there such confusion on this subject? I don't get it?
HERE!! Hemmings says everyone is FOS.
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2012/1...comments-block
But the next study says THEY'RE FOS!
And, it just leaves me confused?
And ALL I find when reading about it is conflicting data?
I just want to know the truth.. FTW?!>!@>!>
Hemmings has an article that says the exact opposite of what I read here?
I read one study, it says this.. Another says that?
I dunno? Why is there such confusion on this subject? I don't get it?
HERE!! Hemmings says everyone is FOS.
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2012/1...comments-block
But the next study says THEY'RE FOS!
And, it just leaves me confused?
And still...you wouldn't get any clarity. So KISS, knowing that all brand name oils are way better than good enough, use the one that you fancy and do...this:
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 20,179
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From: Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction.
St. Jude '03 thru '24
You can't. 
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 21,543
Likes: 3,216
From: Park City Utah
Today's oils are the best we've ever had and way, WAY...better than good enough.
.
Last edited by Tom400CFI; Jul 11, 2017 at 01:21 AM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,451
Likes: 336
From: Greater Cincinnati Area.
*screams*
*opens the cabin door and jumps out*
I've been using Mobil1 high mileage. It seems fine? It's a brand I recognize. It is affordable. It has high levels of these additives, but not so high they reach into the area where some folks claim they are dangerous.
I'm just going to keep using that till I learn otherwise.. Or see empirical evidence to the contrary.
*opens the cabin door and jumps out*
I've been using Mobil1 high mileage. It seems fine? It's a brand I recognize. It is affordable. It has high levels of these additives, but not so high they reach into the area where some folks claim they are dangerous.
I'm just going to keep using that till I learn otherwise.. Or see empirical evidence to the contrary.
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,470
Likes: 763
- another spin master. way to put a spin on the topic at hand, in this case my previous post. you failed to add anything positive here. you stated -
when ZZP concentrations were reduced, many old flat tappet cam motors were grinding lobes.
. again, nice spin. you state you can provide plenty of info to support zinc and flat tappet cams, but fail to provide that info, and then again, spin it back to me to prove the opposite. again, you've failed to provide anything positive here, so in a way, you're right, nobody wins. have a good one... 