I didn't mean to create a big stir about this, though I supose the more publicity this gets, the more my point gets across. I have been on the forum for quite awhile and prior to the forum I was on the Vettenet mailing list (the email list to be on before the CF existed). After 8 years, sometimes I become bored with the forum seeing the same thing over and over. So that is where I am coming from.

My intention is not to have everyone stop posting, its just know what your knowledge and limitations are. I know almost everyone makes mistakes from time to time.

Here is an example of what I am talking about

I know a little about internal engine components. I know about compression ratio's, forged is better than cast, H beams are stronger than I beams, but I don't have any experience building motors and I don't really know much about the proper clearances, oil pumps, piston rings etc.

-If I see a post about if Forged pistons are needed or not, I might make a post.

-If I see a post about what bearings to use and what clearance are recommend for the application, I won't make a post even though I have read John Lingenfelters Small Block Chevy book and I sort of remember what the guy down the street told me he used in his 302 Ford. If I did look up what LPE used I would would mention that I don't know my butt from elbow in this stuff and that I am quoting from LPE's book.

Relax, I am not try to make the forum into place where everyone tip toes around asking for each other credentials. Back to your regular programing....



[Modified by dgoodhue, 2:25 PM 12/4/2002]

 

[QUOTE]
It's a shame that some people's lives might be so empty that they have to answer every question on the page in front of them so their username gets the recognition or their post count goes up. :(

You hit the nail on the head. If I ever do that please tell me. I especially like the ones that have an air foil, K&N Filter and flowmasters and are still in school that gives advise to someone on what cam they should use in a stroker LT4.

I'm wound up today. This post is right up my alley.



[Modified by 89vette, 12:51 PM 12/4/2002]

 

Dave

Consider me relaxed. I use the forum as a way to access people with a lot more information and experience than me.

You seem to have hit a nerve because alot of people are responding!

BTW Do you know of a web site that specializes in LT1s? I am thinking of doing some mods (port and polish heads,cam,header and exhaust) and I am looking for some proven combinations.

Thanks for putting up with a newbie!

Ray

 

Not exactly what I had in mind. I was thinking along the lines of a completely indexed database of specifications and technical data for all the C4 model years. I think this is where a lot repeat posts originate from, e.g., what are the cam specs, what are the torque specs, what is the wrench size, you get the idea. A technical how to repair/modify, etc. should certainly be included, but very often there’s more than one way to do something and it often comes down to personal preference.

If anybody wants to get going on this, I can provide details on the 89 model year for inclusion.

Thinking before I post :D

 

This thread reminds me of reading Hot Rodding magazine back in the 60's as a teen. They had a regular column written by Smokey somebody that was devoted to answering the ubitiquous "how do I install (blank engine) in a (black car)" querry.
Normally it was the most ridiculous engine/car/transmission "mating" imaginable...like a Chrysler Hemi in a 53 Chevrolet with a Olds Hydramatic. The typical instruction from Smokey would speak about varoius adapter plates and motor mounts and go off about "simply" cobbling dual exhausts where none was ever designed to go.
The instruction inevitably ended with, "then just bolt it in". Nothing could ever have been further from the truth of cource.
The same is true here. Lots of gratitutious advise is requested and is given. As the my attorney says, gratitious advise is normally worth what you paid for it.
I've received some great help on CF (for which I'm very grateful) and some bogus input too. I am often worried that some of the "simply bolt it in" advise given here is heeded to the later dismay of the mechanically naive poster who can't sort out the BS from fact. Cire96 :cheers:

 

just because somebody is in school doesnt mean they dont know jack about camshafts or other performance questions, ive read enough books on SBCs to give adequate advice on what makes power and what doesnt

I may not have the MONEY to modify my vette yet, but i know exactly what i want to do, and i know what everybody else on here has done and i dont like to see somebodys questions going unanswered when the people who might have direct experience never check on the board every day. I have many friends who own LT1 Camaros and they have taught me a few things about that engine and what it likes, and reading Nathan Plemons' answers has taught me alot also.

 

ive read enough books on SBCs to give adequate advice on what makes power and what doesnt

Ahhh, I think that statement supports my argument. I've read about brain surgery so if your in need then give me call. By the way, that link in your signature should be removed. I clicked it and couldn't get that crap off my screen. Its a common courtesy not to list links like that.


[Modified by 89vette, 11:14 AM 12/5/2002]

 

Whatever dude, if you dont like what i have to say, then TOO BAD.

and the link isnt to ****, so i doesnt violate any rules


[Modified by vader86, 12:21 PM 12/5/2002]

 

I've read many of the Superman comics (twice). If you need advice on being a Superhero, call me:

Jimmy Olsen

 

Not to single out vader86 but I definately agree here. There really isn't a substitute for direct experience. Certainly not reading other posts on the forum, where one must supposedly be able to "sort out the BS from the truth" :lol:

Yesterday I was on another forum, and someone asked if the water pump needs to come off to replace the opti. Another poster responded "no I don't think so". That's the type of misinformation that comes from doing a little reading but never doing the work.

Posting bad information does not benefit *anyone*. So while I agree that it's up to the reader to remember that not everything posted is 100% true, it doesn't mean that posters shouldn't strive to keep accuracy close to 100% as possible.

My .02

 

Amen! Hopefully that's what we're all here to promote. Reading about it and getting advice from fellow CF members is a great first step to being able to do things on your own. :thumbs:

 

I would like to voice my opinion on a few topic theis post talks about. First of all I agree that its annoying to see the exact same post/question asked every 5 days, ie. where can I buy a turbo kit for my C4. Look people, you can't! Any if you would look down the page, I guarantee threre is a post down page 1 asking the exact sme thing on the forced induction forum.
But we have to be carefull with not wanting people to post as much. Some BB's such as pirate4x4 disdain, mock and flame anybody generally who has asked a question hat has already been asked. It makes new people very nervous to ask questions, even after they have used search to look for answers. I for one certainly don't want it like that here, and from what I've read, it seems everyone likes the large volume of info (even it a lot of its useless/incorrect) that the corvetteforum posts every day.

Now as for what the last 3 or 4 posts have been talking about. I an going to have to take Vader's side on this. For options, ideas etc for building motors, I regularily turn to thirdgen.org because there is way more info there than over here on TPI motors. From there I found about modifiying an LT1 intake (and subsequently purchased one from John :cheers: ) found out what camshalfts should/will/have worked with it etc. etc. Now by using a fairly large generalization, the members over there are predominantly younger with many of them in school. They don't nessisarily have the experience building the motors, but they know what works when building motors. They have booksmarts not hands on experience, and thats fine, there not building your motor, their just suggesting what to use. You don't need to have built 20 SBC's to know that Y tolerance should be X amount. Or that this camshaft will work with that intake.

just my .02 cents :cheers: (if its even worth that)

 

How are you going to say your opinion is any better than someone elses? You get your information from where? MORE? Books? asking people? WERE YOU BORN WITH IT? Ive talked to Skip over at MORE several times about the combo i want to run in my car and i want them to do my car like they did yours 89vette. I know theres nothing like direct experience, but when all the people with direct experience dont chime in with answers before questions fall of the main page, what are the newbies supposed to do? what will they think about the people on CF tech? I know how to install a camshaft, i know how to pull heads, i know how to install a intake manifold, i know where to get and check most of the information i post on here. If i'm wrong, then i'm wrong, and ill be correct the next time somebody asks the exact same question.

As in dgoodhues other posts about the 86vs85 specs, I heard before from other 86 owners that our pistons werent forged, so i believed it and have told others the same, when dgoodhue didnt see the topic because he just wasnt on that day or didnt see it (not an attack against you dgoodhue). I also heard from 85 owners that the two cams were different, despite the same hp numbers, so i didnt dispute him and later found that they were the same cam. For that i'm sorry, because as many people, i dont tear my engine apart to check the specs just for fun.

I wasnt born with it, like you seem to think you were, and i take your posts as an insult to my intelligence. Where else is anybody going to get info on what cam to pick, when you yourself havent tried all the possible cams either? Are they just supposed to try all of them and then report back the results to us, and then we sit on them the next time somebody asks the exact same question? If somebody asks "what cam should i put in my LT1" what answer would you give? If youd been on here enough to read the millions of threads on the Hotcam, youd recommend the damn thing too. I know you either did your research with books or educated opinions from builders or other people on the forum and you didnt decide to do a 396 just for sh**s and giggles. So why are you pissing on me because i do the same.

 

Vader-

Who are mad at? I can't see a post where someone's making a dig at you. I don't think that was anybody's intention, but maybe I missed it. As far as I'm concerned, you always seem to give great advice.


[Modified by fullboogie, 3:56 PM 12/5/2002]

 

I didn't realize that I corrected you in that post, it wasn't meant to be to single you out or anone in particular. Trust me, it wasn't one or two post that prompted me to start this thread.

Why would it be, sometime I take breaks or I am on vacation or I am just too busy to read the forum.

 

Well, friend, maybe the reason I only have 9 posts is because I DONT waste my words on every crap topic that comes up the pike unlike some people I've observed. If the shoe fits,FRIEND! One more thing friend, in a perfect world the premise of this thread might be plausable, but since we're all human, IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN! So, my point, FRIEND, is stop your whining about something you will never change. . :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :thumbs: :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity :nopity


[Modified by jasonlives2, 8:22 PM 12/5/2002]


[Modified by jasonlives2, 8:29 PM 12/5/2002]

 

OR, you've been a member for 6 days. Hmmm, I'll go with the 6 days.

 

I'm not going to buy into the personal flames but it sometimes pays to be aware that some information sources are skewed by the author to favour a certain vendors products (remember those Corvette Fever articles on how to "wake up" your Vette using parts that were all sold by a certain vendor? They might have worked but only with a particular setup (ie: diff gears, big revs, etc) - the information may be "accurate" to acheive an objective or number in some cases but it may not be appropriate for the intended application.

I read alot on tech stuff myself and for someone that has to teach themself more often than not I rely on it fairly heavily before starting some projects. For the most part I think I have been lucky so far in filtering the junk, interpreting info and getting a setup that works for me on my terms.

People with some mechanical nouse can filter misinformation most of the times but I think the lower your mechanical understanding or mechanical abilities the more expensive & dangerous misinformation can be. Experience sometimes gives one the benefit of knowing the side effects to "setup a" that you don't read about in some of the books and websites.

I read ALOT before buying and installing my single mass flywheel (everything I could find, actually). Thing is, only a very small minority of sources mentioned part throttle noise from the gearbox that the single mass setup makes much it easier to hear (try one or maybe two sources...). BTW the single mass noise that most people didn't mention is LOUD. When I installed it and heard the noise I first wondered if something was seriously wrong. Now my passengers notice the noise and my Dad hates it but I am fortunate to be of the mindset that the noise is not an issue - if I was of a different mindset I would be very disppointed and alot poorer for having followed what I read. I didn't have a choice but to read about this and decide based on my readings before experiencing it firsthand as the only other car in the country with a SMF that I knew of was about nine hours away and I didn't have the guys last name or contact details. Now with the experience I've gained I try to tell anyone here who is considering a single mass to be very aware of the potential noise issues.

Just an example of why I think reading is good but experience is more valuable.

THIS IS NOT A PERSONAL ATTACK OR FLAME ON ANYONE... Just trying to voice my opinion that you may know your stuff based on reading and networking but experience is even better IMO. Where is the harm in declaring that you haven't actually used a mod or setup in your post to advise readers of your sources. Think footnoting, it gives the reader a chance to be aware of your sources and use them to judge the information that formed your opinions...

Oh well, I've given my opinion but I think at the end of the day the best we can reasonably hope for is that people will be a little more aware of what they post and the potential effects of their advice and a little more wary of what they read...

PS. If we don't drop the personal barbs me thinks this thread will be locked. :)


[Modified by Red 90 L98 Coupe, 1:54 PM 12/6/2002]


[Modified by Red 90 L98 Coupe, 1:59 PM 12/6/2002]

 

Take a look at my posts, and you'll see that I've been very positive about this whole thing, except for reprimanding you for being so negative.

If you're going to lurk around the CF and jump in to criticize people, go somewhere else. Nobody needs your crappy sarcasm. Judging by your very short track record, I can't imagine you ever adding anything worthwhile to these discussions.


[Modified by fullboogie, 4:34 PM 12/6/2002]

 

Boys, Boys!

I for one am very grateful for all the information here. I want to take this opportunity to thank everyone for their input. Having said that. I feel strongly that no one should be discouraged from posting what they know in this forum. If I am tearing motors down, I would certainly be more careful about the information than if I was repairing a door or changing plug wires. In other words, everyone should be intelligent enough to take this information "with a grain of salt".

As to the issue of multiple posts: You all must realize that we have literally thousands of members from all walks of life who read this at all hours of the day. New ones come on and old members leave constantly. The joy in membership here comes from passing knowledge from one member to another. Please don't discourage anyone from that.

For those who think they are never wrong, well, they've probably never been married.......

As for me, I thought I was right once, but I was mistaken! ;)