ATI set up (with a good bracket/intercooler vs the crap they made you deal with) is a good setup. I had a D-1SC & an F-1R.

That said - the Novi 2000 comes on sooner and pulls harder. My experience with driving supercharged cars tell me that and the track numbers back it up.

Its not a reason to trash your ATI set up if you have it and like it. But for a new setup - I wouldn't go backwards unless you decide to do a budget build on a used supercharger from all the cars dumping their ATI .

I don't have experience with a Vortech.

Who else has experience with the various setups.

 

What happened to this thread

We covered differences between kits several times, Almost all the kits out are good for a stock car. But it seems to almost always work out that the owner wants more power a year or two down the line. Or even if the individaul was going to sell his/her Vette every two years to upgrade, it would give them a larger market to sell their car to with a more expandable kit. I know one thing for sure, we profit less per kit than any of the other kits out there since we use or make our parts with the best products you can find. This provides the customer with the strongest, most reliable kit you can install. I could break down every piece of our kit compaired to "stock" kits and show how we generally spend double on the same part. I.E. every kit Ive seen uses steel ducting, we use aluminum to act as a partial intercooler. Thats 3-4 times the expence. We offer the largest intercooler on the market, thats double (intercoolers are expensive). Custom tensioner with a spring made just for our purpose at the pressure we requested. (triple or more since most kits retain the stock tensioner). I could literally go on and on and cover every piece of the kit.
Even when we where in the middle of the fiasco with our former head unit provider, I never once said they were a bad product. But the dyno and track numbers dont lie. It is almost gotten effortless to make crazy power, the Paxton Novi2000 has proven several times now that it is far more efficiant than the other. I'm sure the Vortech is as well but I have not spent any time using them. Why would I, we are lovin' the Novi's.

For guys interested in stock track numbers, we had a customer come to one of the ECS Corvette challanges at E-town a month or two ago with a stock A4 coupe. The customer reciently retaired and wanted this car to last as is for a long time, so we set the shift points at 5900-6000, and a very concervative tune. It wound up running an 11.2 on the tires he drove there on. He couldn't be happier except now he has tp get a cage if he wants to continue drag racing it.

Hope this helps

 

Doug, it all sounds good.
How long does it take to get one?

 

yours is in route to ya

 

Cut from my prior written excerpt.

Head units & Brackets, change with the times as do all parts. Technology is moving very quick and the power levels throughout the entire rpm range are moving significantly up every year.

EG. I have a 130k in my ride today. I could change 80%+ percent of the parts on my car out and make it faster or better. Does this mean it is a bad car, no. It is very fast. I could do the same with a C6 Z06. Trust me, I could easily take open/closed wheel technology out my brain and put 250k+ in it fast.

There are just better things out now and sometimes they cost more money, sometimes much less. Does it mean, I should throw out my Callies crank because there might be better one, absolutely not. My rate of return, would be minimal. Sometimes, the rate of return is fantastic for just a few bucks.

I can however think of many things I am personally changing next month alone.

I would suggest that the P1 head unit is just fine, however there are others that are better. Synergy has gotten 701 rwhp on a P1 with a small intercooler on a generic forged 346 on 91, small cam, no alky, 12lbs...

Synergy just changed out a Procharger D1SC, for a F1. This is on a very fast soon to be nine second car. There is no less than half dozen different types of FI cars in the shop at all times from various makers.

Synergy is doing a change over on another kit this week, to the ECS bracketry. There is absolutely zero comparision, imo. Synergy will be doing another one very soon.

The differences between the ECS Centrifigul Kit and large majority of the centrifigul kits out there.

Fully CNC brackets that are thicker.
More belt wrap on the head unit pulley
Stronger tensioner.
No need to remove any brackets to change belts
All metal bearings, not plastic
Fixed idler kit
Larger and more efficient intercooler
Custom lower radiator supports made with intercooler supports welded on.
Top shroud made of black aluminum instead of plastic.
All duct work is polished
Customers choice of Black, red or blue ducting.
Stainless T-bolt clamps
Kits include Motron 60 pound injectors
Includes a Racetronix fuel system or a boost a pump depend

 

Right, I'm just a little lost as to why everyone swore by A&A's and ECS's procharger kits just a little while ago, and now they are just ok, or a "step backwards". I guess to notice the difference you pretty much have to be pushing 800rwhp+? What I'm basically saying is it seems like it was a pretty big change to happen so suddenly. I thought there might be some big noticeable difference.

 

By positioning and rotating the head unit, A&A kits offer the most clearance to the hood. To ensure repeatability, all critical parts are cad designed and then CNC machined from 6061 T6 aluminum.



A&A makes the best kit on the market today, hands down. Moreover, to answer the reliability question; with many hundreds trouble free units working every day (daily drivers) our reliability, quality, performance and dependability are proven to be beyond reproach and second to none.

@ All mounting plates CNC machined from oversize 6061 T6 aluminum, guaranteeing parallelism and perpendicularity.

@ The maximum belt wrap in the industry is virtually guaranteed by our innovative adjustable tensioner. Again, CNC machined from 6061 T6.

@ Quick, simple and efficient belt & pulley changes while maintaining maximum strength against deflection and slippage.

@ All pulleys, idlers, & tensioners (where applicable) use steel, double sealed ABEC 3 ball bearings.

@ Both fixed and adjustable idlers are used to ensure minimum belt slip and long life.

@ Custom manufactured, oversized intercoolers that provide the maximum in efficiency and provide years of trouble free operation.

@ All mounts, shrouds, tubing, clamps, etc. are included and optimized to ensure installer simplification, maximize performance and guarantee a turn-key kit.

@ All hardware is included and is of premium build quality. i.e., Grade 8 bolts, washers, nuts, etc.

@ All fuels system components are provided to match the horsepower levels being achieved and are selected based on sound engineering criteria that puts injector duty cycles ~ 80% and provides for reliable and repeatable fuel delivery.


In closing - our products are innovative and fully supported with customer satisfaction guaranteed. Please consider us for your future supercharging needs as well as any Corvette related purchase.

 

To us, our ATI Procharger kit was great, until Procharger decided to not sell head units without constraints.

Consequently, ATI's marketing strategy forced us look at alternative head units and the upshot is that we found the Vortech unit to be superior in delivery of torque and horsepower.

Further, the re-design of our kit and bracketry allowed bringing to market a better mousetrap ( I say the best in the business) at an attractive price!

 

As stated before....

Quote:

You can't go wrong with the A&A kit or the ECS kit, both are quality products.

 

I would say it definatly would be easier to notice in the upper ranges, but look at stock graphs from a former kit to the new Novi kit and you will see a graph that ramps up much faster then before. Stock or all out there is a noticable increase in the mid range.

I was only compairing our kit to the "name brand" kit out there, I see no reason to go back with forth with others when our kit has been street and more importantly track proven to be the best. Anything else is just personall preferance or opinoun. Which is fine by all means. The key is if the owner of the vehicle is happy and thats all that matters!

 

BOTH the A&A and the ECS SC kits are great systems. There's no point in people bashing each other or certain kits, they're both nice kits. Anyone who claims one is so much more superior (and the same goes for the head-units), likely has an agenda or is a leg-humper to one of the above tuners!

Let's just say both A&A and ECS both make a very nice product and that all three head-units are more than capable of getting the job done.

 

Well said!!

 

As Doug, other's and I have stated very clearly over and over and over. We have not put down anyone’s product.

We are however marketing the ECS Centrifigul Supercharger system as we think it is the best Centrifigul product on the market today, bar none. We do not think of other systems as being competitors. There what they are, this product is what it is.

Synergymotorsports.net lets its customers make their own informed decisions about what they wish to use based on their budget, requirements and application.

I am not concerned about some else’s product, unless we have to service it, fix it or make it better. Synergy does this constantly. Synergy markets, what it markets, because it’s the best for our customers and peers here we know. Synergy’s primary concern, is making the best product available for the benefit of the consumer (you) and letting the consumer (you) decide what is best for themselves.

Last time I checked, this was allowed by the Constitution within guidelines set forth by Supreme Court; Regulated and enforced by the FTC for free trade; Open Corvette forum and not for one specific vendor, etc., etc., etc.

The decision is yours. Do your own due diligence and I think you will find that this is a great way to go.

Regards,


Brent

 

 

I agree, Chris we will be going to the track this Wed if the weatear holds and get in fun

 

I will be there

 

I don't think anyone is bashing anything here. I think people are just highlighting some of the differences between the kits.

A&A is known to build street cars and ECS is known to build race cars.

When I was trying to decide on a kit I chose ECS because I wanted something that was proved on the race track. I reasoned that if it could withstand the drag strip it could withstand street duty.

Obviously, the only fair way to settle this is to call Synergy and ask what they think. <kidding>

Cheers,

Mark

 

 

How did this turn into an ECS vs A&A thread? I was just wondering if everyone was ditching procharger for a technical reason or just because of their marketing screwup.

 

A&A did not come in here to bash anyone, especially ECS. However, we did feel a necessity to vocalize our perspective to SC market - in particular, what we offer and why we believe it to be the best kit for street or racing.


As I stated above, ATI forced us to pursue alternatives due to their marketing and sales strategy. At the time it was an impediment but ultimately it turned out to be a blessing.

Charlie