I am a nice guy ....

I replied several times in this post very nicely, but I loose my patience when it is clear that you're either

A) unable to read

B) unable to comprehend

So let's try this again ...

I'm gonna one more time give you the benefit of the doubt, and believe that you are confusing Traction Control with Torque Management. Read my posts above that explain what traction control is and how it works. The tuner is taking your money if he's charging you to "eliminate" torqe management as IT DOES NOT APPLY TO THE Z06.

HTH

 

What about rpm limiter, nock retard , speed sensors etc..... Does this have an effect on a Zo6's torque management. I would tend to say yes, and it would limit the amount of actual torque you car puts out.

 

There are many functions built into the software of the PCM, the EBCM, and even the BCM, that can effect engine starting, engine speed, and engine performance. Each function has a SPECIFIC name that helps identify its function.

Torque Management is a SPECIFIC function that the PCM has built into it. Knock Retard is another SPECIFIC function, and the RPM limiter is another SPECIFIC function.

The point is that if you alter the program for, say, the RPM limit (raising it from 6500 to 6800), that has a direct effect on how the engine is managed. Changing the Torgue Management algorithm on a manual tranny car HAS ZERO IMPACT, as it is an unused function. If a "tuner" is charging ya money to "tune" functions that don't make a difference, either he's stupid, or ripping you off.

Maybe another way to see the difference is with this example:

Torque Management is a function the PCM decides for itself. If a driver with an automatic revs the engine in neutral to 5000 RPM and then slides the gear selector to DRIVE, the PCM will use TM to lessen the chance of Powertrain damage.

Traction Control can also effect engine power, but it is the EBCM that is in control by commanding the PCM to a certain power level. The PCM has no choice but to follow the EBCM commands, it is not deciding the engine power level itself.

HTH

 

Then you're not looking hard enough

 

I can't see you being worried about your dyno numbers and then wanting to enable a program that possibly reduces engine power. The best way to get better numbers from your car is to learn to drive it. I spin way less with traction control on but my times are negatively affected and although it seems you should run quicker by spinning less the brief loss of power really affects your end results.

 

OK, since you seem to know some "secret" here ....

1) Care to explain how Torque Management in the PCM works on a car with a MANUAL transmission ?

2) Care to explain why you would want this (assuming such a thing works) when the car is equipped with Traction Control ?

Thank you,

 

You are a funny guy. I like messing with people that can't let things go.

 

You can play games all ya want ... I've provided FACTS .....

Where are yours ya little ????????????

 

The funny part is tires have the most traction just at the moment they start to slide and spin. Leave it to some softwere committee to protect us just when the car is at it's safest.

Turn it off and be safe.

 

There might be another source of some of this confusion. Black, would you agree that in its' normal function (in a Z) the PCM reads torque output and "adjusts" other engine control functions to prevent driveline damage or at least keep output within cetain limits under certain conditions?

 

Yes, I would agree with your conclusion that this is a "normal" function ... except ...

Turn OFF Traction Control, rev the engine to, say, 2500 RPM, and dump the clutch in first gear.... do you feel the PCM stepping in ??? No way, the PCM allows you to abuse the driveline as much as you want ... you can do a MASSIVE burnout with a Z06 if you're willing to torture the driveline that much ... it is YOUR decision, not the PCM, that determines how badly you drive the car. YOU get to decide when to shift, YOU get to decide the throttle setting on an upshift ... give me ONE example (other than when Traction Control has stepped in) of when the PCM has stepped in and limited your ability to "abuse" the car. Many Z06 owners have complained of "wheel hop" on some launches ... that can't happen if the PCM is managing your launch ... the fact is the PCM lets you control torque with your right foot if Traction Control is turned OFF.

Don't believe me ??? Go out and try it .....

Then tell me the PCM is invoking "Torque Management" ....

 

Hey oman_8282,

I'm "calling you out" ....

Where's your "data" or "information" to support what you claim ????

Please reply to my question above in post #26, or forever be known as a

Thank you

 

time to let dead dogs lie down

 

those are dogs?

 

Maybe so, but those dead horses have not yet had enouph of a beating!

 

My reply has nothing to do with Torque Management...

However, you are clearly wrong about the PCM not knowing what gear you are currently in. Even though there are no gear position sensors, the PCM knows what gear you are in based on engine rpm and vehicle speed. That is why tuners can change the rev limiter for each gear with tuning software. I can show you the rev limit tables if you doubt this.

Hammer

 

on a manual transmission? maybe an automatic but not a manual....

 

Maybe you still misunderstand, there is no tq management on the Z06. Your likely dealing with traction control. I ran 665rwtq on the last dyno, the pcm does nothing to torque, and your traction control should be off for launching.
Robert

 

they don't understand!!!!!! when the computer is off the computer is OFF!

 

I agree that there is a rev limit table for each gear (I've seen it too) ... but I wonder if/how the PCM uses it. Two examples:

* I'm driving down the freeway at 60 MPH in 6th gear (approx 1500 RPM in my car) and I see traffic slowing ahead. I slide the gearshift to neutral and let the engine revs fall to about 800 RPM while the car is still rolling at 55 to 60... what gear does the PCM think I'm in now ??? Am I in neutral, or do I have 5th selected and have just not let the clutch engage yet?? What RPM limit should the PCM assume in this case ( the PCM does not know clutch pedal state - only time status is checked is at engine start when the pedal has to be all the way to the floor to override the starter interlock) if I suddenly floor the accelerator pedal, the 5th gear limit, or the 6th gear limit, ???

* I've got Autotap, and every time I've asked it to display "gear selected" for my manual box, it shows 3rd, regardless of the actual gear the car is in. Maybe that's a fault in my version of the Autotap software, but I have yet to see the PCM actually "know" what gear I'm in. My bet is, though, 3rd is the PCM default that it lives by.

I'd think that it is just pointless in a manual car for the PCM to worry about what gear the car is in. Heck, if I'm doing 80 MPH and downshift to 1st gear, there is not a thing the PCM can do to protect the engine ... it can't change gears, disengage the clutch, or even ask the EBCM to brake fast enough to stop an over-rev. Also, I've always wondered why the PCM has that table for a manual car, as what would be the point of setting, say, a 4000 RPM limit for 2nd gear and a 6000 RPM limit for 3rd gear ?? I suspect the table is there for automatic vehicles, and the fact it has 6 gears defined was a software decision to support up to 6 even though the C5 automatics only have 4. Saves re-writing software (and managing multiple versions in different cars) if a later switch is made to a 5 or 6 speed automatic gearbox.

I agree the PCM could (and based on the RPM limit table) should, be figuring out what gear the car is in, but I have yet to see an example of the PCM actually doing this. If it was important for the PCM to know what gear was selected, a sensor would make a whole lot more sense than "guestimating" what gear is .. or might be ... selected.