Tire Pressure
Team Owner
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,057
Likes: 1,265
From: Virginia
St. Jude Donor '11
It seems what E-T is advocating is that we adjust the tire pressures every time we pull our Vettes out of our driveways, to account for the effect the ambient temp, and by extension the temp of the pavement, will have on the tire pressure when HOT. Yeah, like that's realistic! 
Maybe in a road race but not in everyday driving.
Maybe in a road race but not in everyday driving. 
omg...outrageous statement
...the whole idea of correct tire pressure IS for everyday driving ......so the tires wear evenly and you get the most contact with the road by using correct tire pressure.......
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,643
Likes: 167
Bill didn't call any engineer an idiot...are you on drugs?
He has said a thousand times+++ that the sticker on the door was just generic...don't you get that point? I have been following Bill's advice on tire pressures for the past 3 years and he tells nothing but the truth about the correct tire pressure to use...it works for me and many other Corvette owners...36 psi is still way too much for these tires...don't you get it? Try reading some of his many many posts on this subject and maybe you will understand what is going on...;his explainations are perfectly understandable and fantastically correct...
The correct cold pressure is determined by what the tire is running HOT!...adjust your cold pressure,seasonally, etc.,so your tires will reach 30-31 HOT...that means depending on conditioins(ambient temp, road conditions/aspahlt ETC.,) ...so that really means you need to put anywhere from 27 to whatever will give you 30-31 hot...Get it now?.......(sweet mother of God I hope so )
Forgive me Bill....:o
...are you on drugs? He has said a thousand times+++ that the sticker on the door was just generic...don't you get that point? I have been following Bill's advice on tire pressures for the past 3 years and he tells nothing but the truth about the correct tire pressure to use...it works for me and many other Corvette owners...36 psi is still way too much for these tires...don't you get it? Try reading some of his many many posts on this subject and maybe you will understand what is going on...;his explainations are perfectly understandable and fantastically correct...The correct cold pressure is determined by what the tire is running HOT!...adjust your cold pressure,seasonally, etc.,so your tires will reach 30-31 HOT...that means depending on conditioins(ambient temp, road conditions/aspahlt ETC.,) ...so that really means you need to put anywhere from 27 to whatever will give you 30-31 hot...Get it now?.......(sweet mother of God I hope so )
Forgive me Bill....:o
I know you're in E-T's corner, but at least you're not as arrogant as he is. Just as wrong, but not as arrogant.
Last edited by thisMSGgood4me; Sep 18, 2010 at 10:58 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,057
Likes: 1,265
From: Virginia
St. Jude Donor '11
You see Randy and Kenny why I don't post in these threads anymore.. when I say 60 % it means that the down force has been diminished because the center of the tire is seeing most of the down force and while the outside of the tire is in contact with the ground.. simple pressure transducers are actually used to test the actual footprint. the whole contact patch should see the same down force, but if the tire is over inflated, the center sees most of the down force and is the reason the centers wear out before the outside.. and nobody could see any daylight through those tires either.. so your logic hold about as much crap as the diapers you must wear.
So take your load of crap and wipe your *** with it.. I am done in this thread.. See what I mean about all the idiots.. and their unsupported knowledge, and can you see why we had to put that idiot proof sticker on the car.
The Old ET
So take your load of crap and wipe your *** with it.. I am done in this thread.. See what I mean about all the idiots.. and their unsupported knowledge, and can you see why we had to put that idiot proof sticker on the car.
The Old ET
...Yes Bill...now I see why...I wouldn't have believed it except seeing it with my own eyes...yes I do see why you don't waste your time in this kind of thread trying to give factual knowledge to "some" morons...they just don't get it or want to get it...they just want to argue right or wrong...just like some of the aholes of past yearsI am also out of this rediculous thread...Best wishes and cudos to ET for once again sharing his knowledge and putting up with idiots...
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,643
Likes: 167
Actually, it was kind of said in jest, but hardly an outrageous statement. Just a poke at E-T for being an *** before.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,643
Likes: 167
...Yes Bill...now I see why...I wouldn't have believed it except seeing it with my own eyes...yes I do see why you don't waste your time in this kind of thread trying to give factual knowledge to "some" morons...they just don't get it or want to get it...they just want to argue right or wrong...just like some of the aholes of past yearsI am also out of this rediculous thread...Best wishes and cudos to ET for once again sharing his knowledge and putting up with idiots...I find it hilarious that neither one of you responded to Atok's excellent post (#38), but you can call people "idiots" and "morons." You guys are a class act, let me tell ya.
Last edited by thisMSGgood4me; Sep 19, 2010 at 12:36 AM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,736
Likes: 7
From: Redding CA
You're as full of crap as E-T. 100% of a tire's treadwidth should be in contact with the pavement. And the only daylight you should see is between the treads themselves, in the grooves of the tire. I don't know why you bring up that "high G situation" because that's not the case with 99.9% of everyday driving.
If you were trying to be funny with that crap you posted, let me tell you it wasn't.
If you were trying to be funny with that crap you posted, let me tell you it wasn't.
you're just wrong man sorry but go ahead and run your tires at whatever pressure you want
ya know what? give me a couple days and check back here...I've got some pictures buried where I can prove to you that a tire is NOT in 100 percent contact with the road under a turning situation.
I have a great picture where you can see an inside of one and outside of the other front tire very obviously not touching the ground at all.
and you keep saying "ET's opinion"... or "our opinion" these are FACTS not opinion.
It's your opinion that a tire "should be" flat in contact across the entire tread width but the FACT is that the outer edge of your drivers side front tire will come off of the ground ever so slightly when you make a right hand turn. IF IT DIDN'T YOUR CAR WOULD HANDLE LIKE CRAP
Last edited by 00Corvette; Sep 19, 2010 at 12:34 AM.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 593
Likes: 2
From: Sub-Tropical Retirement Zone
Bill didn't call any engineer an idiot...are you on drugs? He has said a thousand times+++ that the sticker on the door was just generic...don't you get that point? I have been following Bill's advice on tire pressures for the past 3 years and he tells nothing but the truth about the correct tire pressure to use...it works for me and many other Corvette owners...36 psi is still way too much for these tires...don't you get it? Try reading some of his many many posts on this subject and maybe you will understand what is going on...;his explainations are perfectly understandable and fantastically correct...
The correct cold pressure is determined by what the tire is running HOT!...adjust your cold pressure,seasonally, etc.,so your tires will reach 30-31 HOT...that means depending on conditioins(ambient temp, road conditions/aspahlt ETC.,) ...so that really means you need to put anywhere from 27 to whatever will give you 30-31 hot...Get it now?.......(sweet mother of God I hope so )
Forgive me Bill....:o
...are you on drugs? He has said a thousand times+++ that the sticker on the door was just generic...don't you get that point? I have been following Bill's advice on tire pressures for the past 3 years and he tells nothing but the truth about the correct tire pressure to use...it works for me and many other Corvette owners...36 psi is still way too much for these tires...don't you get it? Try reading some of his many many posts on this subject and maybe you will understand what is going on...;his explainations are perfectly understandable and fantastically correct...The correct cold pressure is determined by what the tire is running HOT!...adjust your cold pressure,seasonally, etc.,so your tires will reach 30-31 HOT...that means depending on conditioins(ambient temp, road conditions/aspahlt ETC.,) ...so that really means you need to put anywhere from 27 to whatever will give you 30-31 hot...Get it now?.......(sweet mother of God I hope so )
Forgive me Bill....:o
This is the first encounter I’ve ever had in my life with “experts” on the subject of proper vehicular tire inflation. I continue to be amazed and enlightened.
But you know, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. That’s what makes this country great.
Huurraah!
Bob
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,643
Likes: 167
should be?? well it isn't.. Is this just your opinion or do you have factual proof? .it doesn't have to be a high G turn...ANY TURN rolls the tire over
you're just wrong man sorry but go ahead and run your tires at whatever pressure you want
ya know what? give me a couple days and check back here...I've got some pictures buried where I can prove to you that a tire is NOT in 100 percent contact with the road under a turning situation.
I have a great picture where you can see an inside of one and outside of the other front tire very obviously not touching the ground at all.
and you keep saying "ET's opinion"... or "our opinion" these are FACTS not opinion.
It's your opinion that a tire "should be" flat in contact across the entire tread width but the FACT is that the outer edge of your drivers side front tire will come off of the ground ever so slightly when you make a right hand turn. IF IT DIDN'T YOUR CAR WOULD HANDLE LIKE CRAP
you're just wrong man sorry but go ahead and run your tires at whatever pressure you want
ya know what? give me a couple days and check back here...I've got some pictures buried where I can prove to you that a tire is NOT in 100 percent contact with the road under a turning situation.
I have a great picture where you can see an inside of one and outside of the other front tire very obviously not touching the ground at all.
and you keep saying "ET's opinion"... or "our opinion" these are FACTS not opinion.
It's your opinion that a tire "should be" flat in contact across the entire tread width but the FACT is that the outer edge of your drivers side front tire will come off of the ground ever so slightly when you make a right hand turn. IF IT DIDN'T YOUR CAR WOULD HANDLE LIKE CRAP
As to your last comment that a tire "will come off of the ground ever so slightly when you make a right hand turn," actually that's not true, the front wheels and tires rotate on their vertical axis in the direction of the turn in order to make that turn. I can't help but say this, you have no idea what you're talking about (do you even have a driver's license? if you do, maybe you shouldn't). And I also have to say you are good at showing how stupid you are. Every time you post.
By the way, I never used the words "ET's opinion"... or "our opinion" anywhere in this thread. Another example of you not knowing what you're talking about. Good job.
Last edited by thisMSGgood4me; Sep 19, 2010 at 01:07 AM.
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,736
Likes: 7
From: Redding CA
You know, what you're saying would be funny, if it wasn't so ridiculous. How much time during your everyday driving do you do high G turns? Are they safe to do on public streets? The FACT is that under normal everyday driving conditions (which pretty much all of us do 99.9% of the time), the entire width of a tire's tread is fully in contact with the pavement.
As to your last comment that a tire "will come off of the ground ever so slightly when you make a right hand turn," actually that's not true, the front wheels and tires rotate on their vertical axis in the direction of the turn in order to make that turn. I can't help but say this, you have no idea what you're talking about (do you even have a driver's license? if you do, maybe you shouldn't). And I also have to say you are good at showing how stupid you are. Every time you post.
By the way, I never used the words "ET's opinion"... or "our opinion" anywhere in this thread. Another example of you not knowing what you're talking about. Good job.
As to your last comment that a tire "will come off of the ground ever so slightly when you make a right hand turn," actually that's not true, the front wheels and tires rotate on their vertical axis in the direction of the turn in order to make that turn. I can't help but say this, you have no idea what you're talking about (do you even have a driver's license? if you do, maybe you shouldn't). And I also have to say you are good at showing how stupid you are. Every time you post.
By the way, I never used the words "ET's opinion"... or "our opinion" anywhere in this thread. Another example of you not knowing what you're talking about. Good job.
I'm sorry but tire pressure and contact patch are just two of those things that are over your head poor guy do you really need to resort to personal insults to prove your point? You may want to read some of my past posts in another thread besides this one before you make bogus claims based on one freaking tire pressure disagreement. I try and sit here for hours sometimes helping people out, you see it one way..I see it another. If you want to call me "stupid"...please shoot me a PM and if you're ever in Northern CA area..I'll be sure and meet up with ya
you think vocabulary such as "vertical axis" makes you sound like you're in the know..
What does my posting have to do with me having a driver license or whether I should? Do you realize how immature that sounds? How old are you? 19? 20?
take care and good luck getting help from anyone who tried to teach you something here..
I guess 5+ years at a tire store means I don't know what I'm talking about and ET's helping design the car means nothing either.
Last edited by 00Corvette; Sep 19, 2010 at 04:29 AM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,736
Likes: 7
From: Redding CA
Bill, I don't doubt your experience in most subjects on this forum with the exception of your discourse on proper tire inflation.
I guess the six months I attended Goodyear's Tire Instruction Course didn't amount to too much, huh?
I guess Goodyear's instructors and engineers with decades in the business of tire construction and longevity were way off, huh?
Bill, it is not my intention to cause you any distress but my, according to you, "misguided opinion" has been shared with most motorheads and track guys I've been associated with for the past fourty years.
Good luck to you,
Semper Fi!
Huurraah!
Bob
I guess the six months I attended Goodyear's Tire Instruction Course didn't amount to too much, huh?
I guess Goodyear's instructors and engineers with decades in the business of tire construction and longevity were way off, huh?
Bill, it is not my intention to cause you any distress but my, according to you, "misguided opinion" has been shared with most motorheads and track guys I've been associated with for the past fourty years.
Good luck to you,
Semper Fi!
Huurraah!
Bob
talk to a real racer and ask him if he uses "recommended" tire pressure or what works best for his time slip
Melting Slicks
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,736
Likes: 7
From: Redding CA
I guess 30 isn't "perfect" then...30 is better described as fool proof for those that must run exactly what it says on the side of the door.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,150
Likes: 6
From: NS
Please don't pull me into this thread. The thread is a waste of time. Too many "experts". The OP should be able to dig through the BS and find his answer.
Last edited by Atok; Sep 19, 2010 at 08:07 AM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,857
Likes: 2
From: pawleys island sc
But, I must admit the real reason I'm a tire pressure nut is I'm a cheap bastard - $1000 for a new full set of tires seems like a lot of money to me ( I'm also an OLD bastard who thinks all tires should cost $75) so if I can do somethiong that will extend the life of my car's tires I will.
With regard and respect to Evil's post, I just put my 3rd set of tires on the car (85xxx miles) and sold the tires I took off - the old fronts had 5/32 and the rears had 6/32nds tread. Not bad, eh??
But, of course its your car and so long as you are happy with what you're doing that's super with me.
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,434
Likes: 2
From: Harrisburg Pa.
i couldn't resist my $.02. i haven't seen anybody give an explanation as to why gm puts 30psi Cold on the sticker. if, in a perfect world, it is best to run lets say 33 psi as an operating pressure on these cars, if you run 30cold, the amount of time you spend driving in the heat at lets say 36 psi, and running in the cool or colder temps at 30 psi,you are averaging 33 psi. i don't see that the sticker tells you what the optimum running pressure is, just what the cold pressure should be to be averaging the optimum pressure over the life of the tire. of course if you only drive in the heat, your tires will wear in the middle. if you only drive in the cool you will wear the outside edges. both those cases should deviate from the reccomendation.
and don't analize my figures to death, it is a speculatory answer as to why 30 psi cold is on the sticker. you also build some heat when it's cool due simply to friction, i know that. i truly believe the 30 psi is to be a reasonable compromise to having to change the pressure whenever the weather or driving situation changes.
so in a sense i see merit in both sides of this discussion, not just the extreme of saying this or that is the only true way.
and don't analize my figures to death, it is a speculatory answer as to why 30 psi cold is on the sticker. you also build some heat when it's cool due simply to friction, i know that. i truly believe the 30 psi is to be a reasonable compromise to having to change the pressure whenever the weather or driving situation changes.
so in a sense i see merit in both sides of this discussion, not just the extreme of saying this or that is the only true way.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 593
Likes: 2
From: Sub-Tropical Retirement Zone
so all your track guys run what it says on the door for best traction and wear? this makes even less sense when you consider the cars that you've probably been around in the last 40 years track and street.
talk to a real racer and ask him if he uses "recommended" tire pressure or what works best for his time slip
talk to a real racer and ask him if he uses "recommended" tire pressure or what works best for his time slip
Hey, Don, you're escalating there guy.
You just don't know what you're talking about. When I ran SCCA Solo we usually shared our tires PSI rates with new guys and they adjusted from there. And it was enough to get them around the course a little quicker. Of course, they were always higher than the recommended tire loading labels on the vehicles.Cold PSI equates to no run time... no heat build up... with all four tires in the shade (or the vehicle in the garage) as opposed to one side in the shade and one side in the sun or your PSI readings won't be accurate.
A tire will LOOSE 1 PSI with every 10°F of temperature drop.
The same tire will INFLATE 1 PSI with every 10°F of temperature rise.
Adjust your PSI according to your general climate conditions. A vehicle with a cold inflated 30 PSI in say NY with a current average of 40°F that if driven to say FL with an average climate area of 90°F would find that their tires would be around 35 PSI in the morning.
I have never professed to be an expert but these are simple well known facts every car guy / gal should digest.
But you know everyone has their favorite way of inflating their tires... so, by all means, do whatever works for you.
Semper Fi!
Huurraah!
Bob
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,384
Likes: 87
From: Horncastle Lincolnshire, England
2023 C5 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
Not wanting to get into the rights and wrongs but my figure is actual useage and wear. I ran about 7k in Vegas and the rest on rural roads in UK; not highway mileage. I cant say the AS ZPs are going to be the longest wearing tires I ever owned and the rears need replacing soon (3mm tread depth left) but 25k or so is a reasonable life for me.
Last edited by DeeGee; Sep 19, 2010 at 12:00 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,643
Likes: 167
That is not a fact. I'm sorry but tire pressure and contact patch are just two of those things that are over your head poor guy
do you really need to resort to personal insults to prove your point? You may want to read some of my past posts in another thread besides this one before you make bogus claims based on one freaking tire pressure disagreement. I try and sit here for hours sometimes helping people out, you see it one way..I see it another. If you want to call me "stupid"...please shoot me a PM and if you're ever in Northern CA area..I'll be sure and meet up with ya
you think vocabulary such as "vertical axis" makes you sound like you're in the know..
What does my posting have to do with me having a driver license or whether I should? Do you realize how immature that sounds? How old are you? 19? 20?
take care and good luck getting help from anyone who tried to teach you something here..
I guess 5+ years at a tire store means I don't know what I'm talking about and ET's helping design the car means nothing either.
I'm sorry but tire pressure and contact patch are just two of those things that are over your head poor guy do you really need to resort to personal insults to prove your point? You may want to read some of my past posts in another thread besides this one before you make bogus claims based on one freaking tire pressure disagreement. I try and sit here for hours sometimes helping people out, you see it one way..I see it another. If you want to call me "stupid"...please shoot me a PM and if you're ever in Northern CA area..I'll be sure and meet up with ya
you think vocabulary such as "vertical axis" makes you sound like you're in the know..
What does my posting have to do with me having a driver license or whether I should? Do you realize how immature that sounds? How old are you? 19? 20?
take care and good luck getting help from anyone who tried to teach you something here..
I guess 5+ years at a tire store means I don't know what I'm talking about and ET's helping design the car means nothing either.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 593
Likes: 2
From: Sub-Tropical Retirement Zone
I've always followed E-Ts advice and I run my AS ZPs at 30 hot (plus about 2 to 3 degrees over cold). In UK that translates into about 28 cold. My wear has been even over the tread over 22k miles and 5 years since they were fitted.
Not wanting to get into the rights and wrongs but my figure is actual useage and wear. I ran about 7k in Vegas and the rest on rural roads in UK; not highway mileage. I cant say the AS ZPs are going to be the longest wearing tires I ever owned and the rears need replacing soon (3mm tread depth left) but 25k or so is a reasonable life for me.
Not wanting to get into the rights and wrongs but my figure is actual useage and wear. I ran about 7k in Vegas and the rest on rural roads in UK; not highway mileage. I cant say the AS ZPs are going to be the longest wearing tires I ever owned and the rears need replacing soon (3mm tread depth left) but 25k or so is a reasonable life for me.
The suggested 30-PSI is what I'm going to start with and then at 15k, 20k miles I should have a good indication with tire wear about where I should go with my C5's inflation pressures while running the AS Zps.
I might have to adjust up or down 1 or 2 PSI... I won't know until I run completely through this set's tire life. But usually the manufacturer's suggested tire inflation rate is a good starting indicator. I'll remember that 28 PSI in the AS ZPs has worked well for you.
The Brits were top shelf in 'Nam. You’re welcome to visit southeast Florida any day and we’ll hoist a cold one to the men who didn’t come home.
This is without a doubt the most hilarious discussion I've ever read on tire inflation.
Semper FI!
Bob
Melting Slicks
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,736
Likes: 7
From: Redding CA
Pull you into this thread? You posted, just don't post if you don't want to be involved in the thread.