[Z06] Camshaft help
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
From: Dallas Tx
Camshaft help
I've read a few threads on here about camshafts and have been to my local shop 21 century muscle in Addison tx also talked to Texas speed this past week. Basically I'm looking to hit 450 hp daily driver 21st said go with a 232/236 112lsa tsp said that it wouldn't be good to drive every day and use their 228r cam I know each place is going to pitch their product but what do u guys think. I want it to start when it's cold and have no issues at low Rpms. any suggestions?
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 15,449
Likes: 1,716
From: Everywhere and Nowhere at all
21st does a great job... I am running LG's G5X2, ported heads (milled .59), Ported FAST 92, supporting bolt on's.. I am right at the HP you are looking for and my car is very driveable. there are several other local guys if you would like to hear our cars.. go for a ride. We meet every Sunday @ 6pm at the Twin Peaks in Plano.. Come on over.. We have several different combo's to chose from. I have Sean from True Street in Mckinney build my car. PM me if interested as you will get all kinds of different recommendations here.
Cruising
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
You might want to talk with Patrick at Quality Motor Sports in Lewisville, they do quailty work and is always busy, they did a stage 1 with a custom cam and tuned it in my 02Z, and it runs great, always starts right up and its got that old school loop at idle.
Intermediate
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 43
Likes: 0
From: Worcester ma
You can get 450 with that cam and the right heads etc but you should realize that the car will not drive, sound, or smell like stock. Thats a pretty wild cam for the street, will require a lot of finesse especially in cold starts, and will stink like fuel. To some people its not an issue. To others it is.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,355
Likes: 113
From: Los Angeles
I've read a few threads on here about camshafts and have been to my local shop 21 century muscle in Addison tx also talked to Texas speed this past week. Basically I'm looking to hit 450 hp daily driver 21st said go with a 232/236 112lsa tsp said that it wouldn't be good to drive every day and use their 228r cam I know each place is going to pitch their product but what do u guys think. I want it to start when it's cold and have no issues at low Rpms. any suggestions?
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 15,449
Likes: 1,716
From: Everywhere and Nowhere at all
Not all the way true... I don't smell like fuel when i get out of my car..
I do agree with the tune though.. Very important. Mine does not surge, buck @ all.... Idles right @ 850-900 rpm's... I will say that on hot starts my car "sometimes" shoots up to 12-1500 rpms and gradually idles down... The valvetrain also sounds like a sewing machine. I have 3 cars so i can live with it.. the Z is not my DD...
Keep us posted.
I do agree with the tune though.. Very important. Mine does not surge, buck @ all.... Idles right @ 850-900 rpm's... I will say that on hot starts my car "sometimes" shoots up to 12-1500 rpms and gradually idles down... The valvetrain also sounds like a sewing machine. I have 3 cars so i can live with it.. the Z is not my DD...Keep us posted.
You can get 450 with that cam and the right heads etc but you should realize that the car will not drive, sound, or smell like stock. Thats a pretty wild cam for the street, will require a lot of finesse especially in cold starts, and will stink like fuel. To some people its not an issue. To others it is.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 688
Likes: 0
From: las Vegas N.V.
I have the TSP 233/239 112 cam. With T/F 215 heads and a Fast 102 it made 450 through 410 gears. It was a bitch to tune. It drives pretty good.
Doesn't stall but rpm's sometimes wonder when comming to a stop.
Doesn't stall but rpm's sometimes wonder when comming to a stop.
Drifting
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,419
Likes: 6
From: Alamosa CO
When I had the LS6 in my car I did an H/C package with a Comp 232/236 .595/.601 XE-R on a 114+4 LSA with Ported/milled 243 heads running 11.5 to 1 SCR. Cam had a nice lope, made 450/400 to the tires and driveability was great. Idled at 900 and no bucking or surging due to an excellent tune. If you do go with a cam in that duration/lift area get it on a 114 lobe, you won't regret it and will love the power.
What I have now is a totally different animal and most on here wouldn't like its driveability, but for an old muscle car driver like me, it's just right!
Jimbo
What I have now is a totally different animal and most on here wouldn't like its driveability, but for an old muscle car driver like me, it's just right!
Jimbo
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Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
From: Dallas Tx
I've actually used them before awesome guys very helpful just getting some ideals right now
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,396
Likes: 52
From: Sicamous BC
My dead & gone 346 was cammed 228/228 113*, bit of hot rod idle, near stock like manners with some tuning. I agree that for a DD this cam is the line in the sand.
With a lot of time & money spent on the rest of the package it was 500 RW, with new AFR 210's & Trick Flow 215's you would easily exceed your 450 RW goal.
With a lot of time & money spent on the rest of the package it was 500 RW, with new AFR 210's & Trick Flow 215's you would easily exceed your 450 RW goal.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 5,245
Likes: 25
From: Blue Ridge Georgia
I have the Texas Speed 228R and I really, really love it. I've had very radical cams in the past and the more radical you go the more driveability you lose. IMHO the 228R is all the cam I want in my Z. Car runs great and with the Borla exhaust it sounds badass. There's a ton of info on the web and many utube videos to look at. good Luck.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 43,084
Likes: 33
From: Raleigh / Rolesville NC
I've read a few threads on here about camshafts and have been to my local shop 21 century muscle in Addison tx also talked to Texas speed this past week. Basically I'm looking to hit 450 hp daily driver 21st said go with a 232/236 112lsa tsp said that it wouldn't be good to drive every day and use their 228r cam I know each place is going to pitch their product but what do u guys think. I want it to start when it's cold and have no issues at low Rpms. any suggestions?
One or the other.
Smaller cam for cold starts, no low rpm issues and DD. IMO even the 228r maybe too big for that.
Even my 224/224 581/581 112+4 needs to sit for 5 min on a cold morning, but then again I run 15-w50 oil too
But 450 needs good ported heads, CAI, LTs UD, plus other things and a great tune
Race Director
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 12,364
Likes: 2,899
From: Fort Worth, Texas
Our V4 cam is in that range and works well with PRC heads, you will easily hit 450rwhp even on our not so generous dyno. PM me your e-mail and I can shoot you over a quote, the tune plays a huge part in a cams civility.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 976
Likes: 53
From: smyrna de
cams are all about finding a balance. everyone has different opinion on what is considered streetable on a day to day basis. i always see people refer to the LSA when talking about idle and driving caracteristics, when in actuallity its the overlap.. the over lap is determined by the LSA and the duration of the intake and exhaust lobes together.
example: a stock ls6 cam has = -24 deg of overlap
a 228/228 112 LSA = 4 deg of overlap
a 236/242 112 LSA = 15 deg of overlap
the amount of overlap is what causes the rough idle and the awefull raw fuel smell. i am currently running a 230/234 .612/.600 112+4 cam. this cam is not a dyno queen, has 8 deg of overlap, but maintains a great torque curve from 2500-6500 with very good partial throttle driving, but still has a nice choppy idle we all want.. some people consider a 228r a good street cam, some consider a ms4/Trak/whiplash/ etc a good street cam.. it all comes down to opinion..
example: a stock ls6 cam has = -24 deg of overlap
a 228/228 112 LSA = 4 deg of overlap
a 236/242 112 LSA = 15 deg of overlap
the amount of overlap is what causes the rough idle and the awefull raw fuel smell. i am currently running a 230/234 .612/.600 112+4 cam. this cam is not a dyno queen, has 8 deg of overlap, but maintains a great torque curve from 2500-6500 with very good partial throttle driving, but still has a nice choppy idle we all want.. some people consider a 228r a good street cam, some consider a ms4/Trak/whiplash/ etc a good street cam.. it all comes down to opinion..
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 81,241
Likes: 3,063
From: altered state
St. Jude Donor '05
Get the right head tune and supporting mods you can hit over 450 with the 224 cam has fairly good manners and wont shake your teeth loose.
Spend as much on the tune as needed to perfect it.
Spend as much on the tune as needed to perfect it.
Racer
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 353
Likes: 3
From: Houston TX
Well I will be buying my cam in this next coming week, and well I am going with a big cam, no sleeper cam, no mild cam for me, and idc how much it shakes, the drivability, smell, etc.
The reason, well this is not my daily driven car, and I want the maximum amount of power that I can get out of the engine, its a max effort car. Not to mention it is just going to sound dirty idling.
The reason, well this is not my daily driven car, and I want the maximum amount of power that I can get out of the engine, its a max effort car. Not to mention it is just going to sound dirty idling.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 5,245
Likes: 25
From: Blue Ridge Georgia
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,375
Likes: 328
From: CA.
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
I agree with most--anything in the high 220's is streetable---You will need better heads though to reach 450 RWHP-- Just remember the longer the duration the HIGHER the RPM range you'll have to go to in order to get those higher HP numbers--
For example a STOCK cam signs off and makes the most HP around 5800-6000
A .220 cam raises the power band and requires up to 6200 to make the Max HP
.225 up to around 6400
.228 up to around 6600
.230 up to around 6800 and up
So depending on where you plan to shift and how much you're willing to risk longivity dictates which duration you choose
Also for smoother idling --a Stock cam has an LSA from 119-117
Most performance cams are in the 114-112 range--The lower the LSA the more lopier the idle and can be harder to tune--However with a 6-speed the idling/surging issues are not as bad as with an A4---Any A4 with a stock TQ converter is a bear --to drive in town and tune--That's one reason why a Stall converter is called for to loosen up the lower RPM's to avoid those issues--(like holding it still at a stop light idling at 850)----
For example a STOCK cam signs off and makes the most HP around 5800-6000
A .220 cam raises the power band and requires up to 6200 to make the Max HP
.225 up to around 6400
.228 up to around 6600
.230 up to around 6800 and up
So depending on where you plan to shift and how much you're willing to risk longivity dictates which duration you choose
Also for smoother idling --a Stock cam has an LSA from 119-117
Most performance cams are in the 114-112 range--The lower the LSA the more lopier the idle and can be harder to tune--However with a 6-speed the idling/surging issues are not as bad as with an A4---Any A4 with a stock TQ converter is a bear --to drive in town and tune--That's one reason why a Stall converter is called for to loosen up the lower RPM's to avoid those issues--(like holding it still at a stop light idling at 850)----
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,980
Likes: 10
From: Crook County
TSP told me I should run there 233/239 Cam that it is awesome for the vettes... They Make HUGE POWER.... I had the TSP228R Cam in my GTO which was a 228/228 .588 .588 112lsa and I made big power, I actually made more power then guys who had the V2 Cam which is larger... I was putting down 425/396 in my 04 GTO with just that cam, full exhaust, CAI and a tune... Stock LS6 intake and ****** 241 heads... I think Im gonna go larger this time around in my vette though...
Here was my GTO with the 228R... Very streetable cam...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GP6b1zGf-A4
Here was my GTO with the 228R... Very streetable cam...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GP6b1zGf-A4
Last edited by Breze84; Nov 26, 2011 at 02:35 PM.
