Tune Help ASAP
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
Tune Help ASAP
My car just came form the tuner and I am very very unhappy.My car 03Z did a baseline pull of 362RWHP.Thats stock.Well after Kooks headers/spark plug wires/new plugs and a street tune/dyno tune the thing only gained 11RWHP.A/F ratio was 13 across the board.So for $1500 headers/$950 of dyno time and install labor,I spent $2400 for 11RWHP.The tuner said that everytime he tried to add timing the car would pull it.He says the fuel that I was running was giveing off spark knock.
Anybody have any Ideas of what's the problem? I did put shell 93 in the car to drive it to the shop.But you would thing that a shop would have octane booster or race gas.
Anybody have any Ideas of what's the problem? I did put shell 93 in the car to drive it to the shop.But you would thing that a shop would have octane booster or race gas.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 19,245
Likes: 1,092
From: Dyer, IN
My car just came form the tuner and I am very very unhappy.My car 03Z did a baseline pull of 362RWHP.Thats stock.Well after Kooks headers/spark plug wires/new plugs and a street tune/dyno tune the thing only gained 11RWHP.A/F ratio was 13 across the board.So for $1500 headers/$950 of dyno time and install labor,I spent $2400 for 11RWHP.The tuner said that everytime he tried to add timing the car would pull it.He says the fuel that I was running was giveing off spark knock.
Anybody have any Ideas of what's the problem? I did put shell 93 in the car to drive it to the shop.But you would thing that a shop would have octane booster or race gas.
Anybody have any Ideas of what's the problem? I did put shell 93 in the car to drive it to the shop.But you would thing that a shop would have octane booster or race gas.
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 16,477
Likes: 26
From: Gone
CI 6-7-8-9-10 Veteran
St. Jude Donor '03
More timing isn't going to magically gain you more hp. Considering the stock timing, the more you mod, the more you hope to NOT have to reduce the stock advance values...trying to add onto them is quite rare and usually fruitless.
It almost sounds like you wanted to dump in some $10/gal fuel to make a more impressive number.
Money notwithstanding, how does the car feel and drive? Is it better than it was?
It almost sounds like you wanted to dump in some $10/gal fuel to make a more impressive number.
Money notwithstanding, how does the car feel and drive? Is it better than it was?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 983
Likes: 36
From: Middle Of Kali CA
Headers alone will not get a whole lot more. LG LT Pro Catless tuned +-20 HP. This is only the begining or first part of the puzzle.
Factory exhaust and intake were not far off the mark. A nice cam would kick it up a few notches....
Factory exhaust and intake were not far off the mark. A nice cam would kick it up a few notches....
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
More timing isn't going to magically gain you more hp. Considering the stock timing, the more you mod, the more you hope to NOT have to reduce the stock advance values...trying to add onto them is quite rare and usually fruitless.
It almost sounds like you wanted to dump in some $10/gal fuel to make a more impressive number.
Money notwithstanding, how does the car feel and drive? Is it better than it was?
It almost sounds like you wanted to dump in some $10/gal fuel to make a more impressive number.
Money notwithstanding, how does the car feel and drive? Is it better than it was?
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
Are you joking?Cause I just dropped $2450 for 11RWHP I'm not in the mood for jokes.Look at bad95killers post he's car is doing close to 400RWHP. at its to more post in the last few days with # at 400RWHP.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
That is possible that you have bad gas. The question is, did the tuner really get knocking, or is it a false knock from the sensors. I got a false knock the first time on the dyno, and it pulled timing. I changed the knock sensors, and all was well. A pinched harness can also introduce a false knock.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
I'm gonna take it monday to my man at the chevy dealer.The Vette tech there is a good friend of mine.Gonna have him scan it and see if the factory tune is still in the ECM.I'll bet a set of ZO6 speedlines that the factory tune is still there.
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Drifting
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 1,541
Likes: 2
From: Raleigh NC
If you are getting a flat 13 to 1 accross the board, you are not going to get much more out of it. That is as aggressive as you want to go on a factory motor. When we were trying to detune a friends race car so that he can stay within a HP to weight ratio, taking timing out really didn't make a big change on a stock LS6 with American Racing headers. Factory timing on a LS6 is 22 degrees. If you can get it to take 26 degrees you might gain 5hp.
If the car can't take the factory timing you can try adding an octane booster to see if it still pulls timing. If it does continue to pull timing then it is probably false knock. On my LS6 I had to desensitize the knock sensors at ~4000rpms to get it to stop pulling timing. I tested with 100 octane gas at the track.
If the car can't take the factory timing you can try adding an octane booster to see if it still pulls timing. If it does continue to pull timing then it is probably false knock. On my LS6 I had to desensitize the knock sensors at ~4000rpms to get it to stop pulling timing. I tested with 100 octane gas at the track.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,356
Likes: 1
From: Chesapeake Va
FWIW, the C5 Z06s show the least amount of gains both from tuning and from headers. You should see more than 11 rwhp though. They respond more to desensitizing the knock sensors and leaving the WOT timing alone.
Also, don't tune it for race gas. Tune it with the fuel you're going to run it in everyday.
PS, how far are you from Virginia Beach? I've tuned tons of those things.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 32,910
Likes: 2,402
From: Anthony TX
CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
Something isnt correct. You need to find someone with HP Tuners or EFI Live who can copy your tune and compare the values with a stock tune. I agree, 11 HP sucks. My 02 Z dynoed out to 390 RWHP and 375 Tq with vararam, Ported TB and a Stainless Work LT headers and a complete 3" exhaust system.
BC
BC
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
They can't tell if it has the stock tune in it or not. You'd have to have someone with HPT or another tuning suite to pull the tune, and compare it to a stock file. All the Tech II can tell is if the computer's OS is the factory OS or not. So, if it hasn't had a custom OS applied, the dealer can't tell a thing.
FWIW, the C5 Z06s show the least amount of gains both from tuning and from headers. You should see more than 11 rwhp though. They respond more to desensitizing the knock sensors and leaving the WOT timing alone.
Also, don't tune it for race gas. Tune it with the fuel you're going to run it in everyday.
PS, how far are you from Virginia Beach? I've tuned tons of those things.
FWIW, the C5 Z06s show the least amount of gains both from tuning and from headers. You should see more than 11 rwhp though. They respond more to desensitizing the knock sensors and leaving the WOT timing alone.
Also, don't tune it for race gas. Tune it with the fuel you're going to run it in everyday.
PS, how far are you from Virginia Beach? I've tuned tons of those things.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
Something isnt correct. You need to find someone with HP Tuners or EFI Live who can copy your tune and compare the values with a stock tune. I agree, 11 HP sucks. My 02 Z dynoed out to 390 RWHP and 375 Tq with vararam, Ported TB and a Stainless Work LT headers and a complete 3" exhaust system.
BC
BC
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
And another thing they pulled was,that my Kooks system came with manifold/header gaskets in the kit.I checked when they showed up.Well they charger me for 2 Gm manifold gaskets.They didn't give me any gaskets back. So my Kooks gaskets are prolly gonna be going on some body elses car.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,400
Likes: 3
From: Gboro/H-point/Reidsville NC
He claims that next sat they will strap it on the dyno and retune it.I'm gonna give them a chance to do the right thing.Thats why I've not call any names yet.What I think is the person that does the tuneing is outta town.The chimps at the shop can wrenck and do pulls but can't tune.And the guy wont be back till next Sat.
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 5,743
Likes: 11
From: Parkersburg West Virginia
Cruise-In X Veteran
You may want to find yourself a new tuner. It sucks to be in your position because you are basically at the mercy of the shop (been there). Hopefully it works out for you in the end. 
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,003
Likes: 248
From: Tampa Fl
St. Jude Donor '12-'13-'14
I did my vararam, LS6 manifold, Kooks and GHLs all at once. I felt the differnce, but it wasnt a crazy amount. The tune wasnt touched at this point. I didnt have a before and after tune. I noticed a differance, but I thought I would feel it more. ( Cot about 3K in parts)
After I installed the 1st cam ( baby T224) and tune, I noticed a differance in the car.
The exhaust manifolds on a Z06 are nicely designed though not as productive as long tube headers.