427 Warhawk.
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,734
Likes: 232
From: Youngstown Ohio
Latest status.
The heads and FAST intake manifold were delivered to LME (the heads coming back from World Products, and the intake being sent from Chris). Bryan called Chris today to tell him that the work is completed and the engine should be packed up for shipment back to Blountstown today. So maybe by mid next week the engine will show up and the rebuild can continue. Hopefully......
The heads and FAST intake manifold were delivered to LME (the heads coming back from World Products, and the intake being sent from Chris). Bryan called Chris today to tell him that the work is completed and the engine should be packed up for shipment back to Blountstown today. So maybe by mid next week the engine will show up and the rebuild can continue. Hopefully......
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
Well the build has resumed, but it is slow going. EVERYTHING so far has had to be modified to fit onto this Warhawk block and heads. Motor mount brackets, timing chain cover, windage tray, alternator bracket, A/C mounting bracket..... and it's not even close to be finished yet. So each accessory mod that has to be done just slows down the build. Seriously, I thought this would be pretty much a drop in engine, but such just is not the case at all. I'm on constant pins and needles now waiting for the "brick wall" event to take place and Chris telling me that something or another just will not bolt onto the block and that is that. I HOPE this won't be the case, but who the heck knows at this point.
I took some pics yesterday of those "fixed" holes on the heads for the intake manifold mounting. I have to admit that I'm not really all that enthusiastic about them....
And I'm guessing that they just were not drilled DEEP enough if those bolts for the FAST intake manifold stick this far out after bottoming out....
Maybe all this sort of thing is normal, but it sure doesn't seem "normal" to me.
I took some pics yesterday of those "fixed" holes on the heads for the intake manifold mounting. I have to admit that I'm not really all that enthusiastic about them....
And I'm guessing that they just were not drilled DEEP enough if those bolts for the FAST intake manifold stick this far out after bottoming out....
Maybe all this sort of thing is normal, but it sure doesn't seem "normal" to me.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 19,423
Likes: 1,146
From: Dyer, IN
I know you are neck deep in this project, and I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but why did you not insist on new heads? You paid for new, not repaired heads. The repair looks like $hit, especially for the money you are forking out here. The threads on the one repaired hole(pic above) are trashed.
Intermediate
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
From: Danville CA
Wow!
I have had some expereince with engine machine shops, and this work appears to be sub-par. It may be too late to 'turn back', but, given all the additional mods require to make things work, if you have the opportunity, you may consider doing so.
I feel for you, Bro.
I have had some expereince with engine machine shops, and this work appears to be sub-par. It may be too late to 'turn back', but, given all the additional mods require to make things work, if you have the opportunity, you may consider doing so.
I feel for you, Bro.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
Oh, and another thing that caught my eye.. The head casting of one of the heads itself just seemed, well, of "lesser quality", then the other to my untrained eye.
To show you what I mean, here are some photos of the casting around the valve springs. This is on the driver's side of the engine...
This is what I would expect to see in a quality head. In the next post, I'll show you what the head on the passenger side of the engine looks like in comparison.
To show you what I mean, here are some photos of the casting around the valve springs. This is on the driver's side of the engine...
This is what I would expect to see in a quality head. In the next post, I'll show you what the head on the passenger side of the engine looks like in comparison.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
OK, here's the pics of the same areas on the passenger side head....
Yeah, maybe this is just normal and I just am jumping at shadows right now with all the other issues, but still.........
Yeah, maybe this is just normal and I just am jumping at shadows right now with all the other issues, but still.........
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
Probably too late for that. But honestly, if I had this to do over again, I would not make the same choices I did originally.
I have to assume that LME looked over those holes and felt them acceptable to pass through onto THEIR customer. Same thing with those casting "anomalies". Apparently both LME and World Products were perfectly willing to have their names associated with this engine.
I have to assume that LME looked over those holes and felt them acceptable to pass through onto THEIR customer. Same thing with those casting "anomalies". Apparently both LME and World Products were perfectly willing to have their names associated with this engine.
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Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
I know you are neck deep in this project, and I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but why did you not insist on new heads? You paid for new, not repaired heads. The repair looks like $hit, especially for the money you are forking out here. The threads on the one repaired hole(pic above) are trashed.
Yeah, this is certainly being a learning experience. Unfortunately it won't help me, as I do not intend to ever do anything like this again in my lifetime. If I could go back in time and change my mind when I came up with this idea, I most certainly would.
Racer
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
From: Western Burbs of Detroit MI
Just curious why you went with the Warhawk? How much power are you trying to make?
Any reason you didn't use the LSx block? Or just get an Iron block?
Another option, and a cheap option in comparison is what Kevin aka WKMCD is having VA speed re sleeve his 402 and bore it for a 427.
Any reason you didn't use the LSx block? Or just get an Iron block?
Another option, and a cheap option in comparison is what Kevin aka WKMCD is having VA speed re sleeve his 402 and bore it for a 427.
Race Director
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 16,667
Likes: 1,209
From: Raleigh, NC
St. Jude Donor '15
You were told there would be issues using this block from the beginning by vendors/builders in the other thread. Why are you surprised now? Did you think they were kidding or something?
Racer
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
From: Western Burbs of Detroit MI
Race Director
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 16,667
Likes: 1,209
From: Raleigh, NC
St. Jude Donor '15
Fair enough, I suppose. He had this attitude in the other thread too.. someone would tell him exactly why he should go a different route to save $$ while still getting exactly what he wanted but he just had to have this warhawk.
Oh well, I'll quit stirring things up now, lol.
Oh well, I'll quit stirring things up now, lol.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
Yeah, I guess I just drew the short straw on this one....
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
Just curious why you went with the Warhawk? How much power are you trying to make?
Any reason you didn't use the LSx block? Or just get an Iron block?
Another option, and a cheap option in comparison is what Kevin aka WKMCD is having VA speed re sleeve his 402 and bore it for a 427.
Any reason you didn't use the LSx block? Or just get an Iron block?
Another option, and a cheap option in comparison is what Kevin aka WKMCD is having VA speed re sleeve his 402 and bore it for a 427.
As for the LSx, no, I didn't want the extra weight of an iron block. As for power, I didn't really care. It's not going to make much differnce to me either way. I just wanted a 427 cube Warhawk.
I wasn't really interested in the cheapest path to take at all. I wanted the best I could afford. After selling off much of my gun collection, I could afford to spend the money I felt I would need to get a quality product.
Pro
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 505
Likes: 0
From: tyler tx
I just read the entire thread and WOW! What an experience for you.
I think you need to let chris and his vendors build your motor, get a written warranty and enjoy your new engine. Chris should have told you of the issue and then reassured you that it's not a problem and got it fixed. He should have dealt with the vendors and got them to do what was necessary, and if that's "fix" the bolt holes, then he should have gotten the reassurance from his vendor and moved on. You paid chris damn good money to build you an engine and stand behind it. It's up to him be ok with the work a vendor supplies to him, and if he doesn't want to be left holding the bag if there is a problem, then he needs to settle that with his vendor. If he doesn't feel comfortable with installing what his vendor supplied him, then he should have told you and advised accordingly. If he is ok with it, run with it. HE is the one that is ultimately responsible for the contract that he entered into with you to build you an engine, HE took your money.
I think you need to let chris and his vendors build your motor, get a written warranty and enjoy your new engine. Chris should have told you of the issue and then reassured you that it's not a problem and got it fixed. He should have dealt with the vendors and got them to do what was necessary, and if that's "fix" the bolt holes, then he should have gotten the reassurance from his vendor and moved on. You paid chris damn good money to build you an engine and stand behind it. It's up to him be ok with the work a vendor supplies to him, and if he doesn't want to be left holding the bag if there is a problem, then he needs to settle that with his vendor. If he doesn't feel comfortable with installing what his vendor supplied him, then he should have told you and advised accordingly. If he is ok with it, run with it. HE is the one that is ultimately responsible for the contract that he entered into with you to build you an engine, HE took your money.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,788
Likes: 2
From: Tallahassee FL
I just read the entire thread and WOW! What an experience for you.
I think you need to let chris and his vendors build your motor, get a written warranty and enjoy your new engine. Chris should have told you of the issue and then reassured you that it's not a problem and got it fixed. He should have dealt with the vendors and got them to do what was necessary, and if that's "fix" the bolt holes, then he should have gotten the reassurance from his vendor and moved on. You paid chris damn good money to build you an engine and stand behind it. It's up to him be ok with the work a vendor supplies to him, and if he doesn't want to be left holding the bag if there is a problem, then he needs to settle that with his vendor. If he doesn't feel comfortable with installing what his vendor supplied him, then he should have told you and advised accordingly. If he is ok with it, run with it. HE is the one that is ultimately responsible for the contract that he entered into with you to build you an engine, HE took your money.
I think you need to let chris and his vendors build your motor, get a written warranty and enjoy your new engine. Chris should have told you of the issue and then reassured you that it's not a problem and got it fixed. He should have dealt with the vendors and got them to do what was necessary, and if that's "fix" the bolt holes, then he should have gotten the reassurance from his vendor and moved on. You paid chris damn good money to build you an engine and stand behind it. It's up to him be ok with the work a vendor supplies to him, and if he doesn't want to be left holding the bag if there is a problem, then he needs to settle that with his vendor. If he doesn't feel comfortable with installing what his vendor supplied him, then he should have told you and advised accordingly. If he is ok with it, run with it. HE is the one that is ultimately responsible for the contract that he entered into with you to build you an engine, HE took your money.
Yeah, I worry a lot about any minor anomaly I see. Maybe I should have just stayed out of the shop and told him to just call me when it is finished.... But heck, I've gotten the video bug and want' to video EVERYTHING these days. I could no more resist being at the shop then I could hold my breath for three days straight.
I REALLY REALLY hope that a lot of people are correct in that the final results will leave all these concerns far behind in the dust and rubber smoke....
But at least Chris hasn't banned me from the shop yet..
Pro
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 505
Likes: 0
From: tyler tx
Well, I certainly can't argue very long nor hard against that advice. I will say that Chris has had his hands full with other issues lately, and that coupled with the fact that I like to hear the story "from the horse's mouth" put me into the middle of this.
I'd be the same way I'm sure.
But I think at some point I would've had to give the reigns back to chris, especially if I trusted him as you described.
From the beginning, Chris has said that whatever I want to do, he will back me up on it. So far, he has not indicated that I should bail on the Warhawk, and from the very beginning has said he will warranty all this for a year. He IS guaranteeing the job, and I think even if something goes wrong and it absolutely NOT his fault, he will still bend over backwards to make sure I am satisfied. Which, quite honestly, is probably the major reason that I haven't just thrown in the towel on this project.
I would expect that from him, but what was his advice/recommendation?
Yeah, I worry a lot about any minor anomaly I see. Maybe I should have just stayed out of the shop and told him to just call me when it is finished.... But heck, I've gotten the video bug and want' to video EVERYTHING these days. I could no more resist being at the shop then I could hold my breath for three days straight.
I REALLY REALLY hope that a lot of people are correct in that the final results will leave all these concerns far behind in the dust and rubber smoke....
I'm sure it will.
But at least Chris hasn't banned me from the shop yet..
I'd be the same way I'm sure.
But I think at some point I would've had to give the reigns back to chris, especially if I trusted him as you described. From the beginning, Chris has said that whatever I want to do, he will back me up on it. So far, he has not indicated that I should bail on the Warhawk, and from the very beginning has said he will warranty all this for a year. He IS guaranteeing the job, and I think even if something goes wrong and it absolutely NOT his fault, he will still bend over backwards to make sure I am satisfied. Which, quite honestly, is probably the major reason that I haven't just thrown in the towel on this project.
I would expect that from him, but what was his advice/recommendation?
Yeah, I worry a lot about any minor anomaly I see. Maybe I should have just stayed out of the shop and told him to just call me when it is finished.... But heck, I've gotten the video bug and want' to video EVERYTHING these days. I could no more resist being at the shop then I could hold my breath for three days straight.
I REALLY REALLY hope that a lot of people are correct in that the final results will leave all these concerns far behind in the dust and rubber smoke....
I'm sure it will.
But at least Chris hasn't banned me from the shop yet..
What did he say he would do if it was HIS motor?
Personally, I would want a mileage warranty. 1 year is not many miles for most vettes.
