I did'nt want to interrupt too much on another thread about ported 241 heads, so I'm making this one.

My car has the 853 heads, I found these ported new LS6 heads http://texas-speed.com/p-4-prc-stage...ted-heads.aspx

1600 bucks vs sending my 853 heads to Advanced Induction to be CNC ported, and valve job, the car has about 82K miles, so I don't know if the valve guides need to be updated with bronze liners, or replaced with full bronze replacements.

Depending on if it needs bronze liners, or updated to full bronze guides, or they are fine as is, it would be 125 to 250 extra, on top of the 1145.00 "100% CNC'd High Compression 219cc GM LS1 Cylinder Head Package", plus extra for better springs, retainers, seals etc.

Also the AI setup uses your factory valves, the new PRC heads come with new 2.02"/1.575" Stainless Steel Valves, which would be larger than 2.00/1.55, I'm guessing stainless steel valves would be better as well?

I'm just researching here, the AI heads say they will make 11:1 compression ratio on a stock 346 LS1 while retaining the stock available P2V which allows the use of large duration cams without cutting piston reliefs!

Would 11:1 be too much on my engine with premium/supreme pump fuel, I think it's 91 octane here in the Phoenix area?

I'm thinking the PRC heads could do the 11:1 as well, but I'm not sure.

Of course there would be a new cam and valve train to support the new heads, LS6 intake or aftermarket if the LS6 is not good enough, long tube headers and full exhaust, still with cats if they will work ok, maybe a vararam to help get in more cool air.

I wonder if the PRC heads will make the same power that AI heads say they can make "Typical gains for this CNC work are in the 40-55rwhp SAE range over the as cast 241, and 346cid LS1's can manage 440-470rwhp SAE with bolt ons and one of our daily drivable HR cam grinds."

I'm thinking that might be almost 500 HP at the crank!

This could be some fun on a budget, the car has a 6 speed manual, and is still bone stock after over 10 years of having it.

I'm not wanting to race the car, or trying to be the fastest, just want to make the car more fun to drive, to be honest it's not as fun as when I got it back in 2003, or even years after that.

I know this is a lot of questions, I'm just wanting to put together a full package that is well thought out where everything works together, and is a good bang for the buck.

If I had the $$, I would just get a new C6 Z06 and would be plenty happy with the factory power, but I don't have that kind of $$ lol.

 

The 243 castings are not that expensive, why not just go to the 243 ported heads and then the issue with the guides is taken care of in the process. I would rather have the powder metal guides than bronze, which wear quicker and rocker geometry is more critical.

 

That was what I was thinking for 1600 bucks new 243 or 799 heads, CNC ported.

650. dual valve spring kit (I honestly don't know if that is what is best for me, would need to research that area more)

I read in my old 2003 LS1 LS6 book, it says the LS1 heads, and I assume LS6 heads came factory with stainless steel valves, intake and exhaust, so that is really not a upgrade on the PRC LS6 heads, however they are larger than factory valves.

For 50 more dollars it says "You also have the option to upgrade to the PRC .675" Lift EHT Dual Valve Spring Kit. This spring kit is the top of the line and offers almost double the life of other valve spring kits on the market! The following items are included in the EHT dual spring kit:

Dual Valve Springs Rated to .675” Lift
Precision-Machined Titanium Retainers
Hardened Machined Spring Seats
New Viton Valve Seals"

Again, I'm not sure about valve lift #'s, but I want to guess more is better, but not always, so I need to learn more about this area, if anyone can explain?

 

Also look at the Patriot Performance Stage II Heads.

 

Thats what your running on your car isn't Bill ? What all do you have in your motor and what kind of numbers doesit make ? I had 224/228/581/588 ,LS6 Intake PP thottlebody ,CAI, Kooks Lt's ,xpipe,axle backs ,342's now I'm ready for some heads , but dont want to pay $2300+ for a set. Just want to be in the low 400's ..369/346 right now....xzo

 

Even better price, for some reason Summit is not telling their price?

 

While that book might provide some basic information, it is outdated. True LS6 243 heads have the lightweight valves. Not all 243 heads have these valve, rather they are stainless. For example, my 2009 Silverado has 243 heads.

I would also check out Advance Induction heads. They seem to provide some really good results and are competitively priced. They also started using the Dart castings, similar to the 243 design but with a thicker deck.

 

Hopefully this will help.

OP, I use Advanced Induction exclusively for all my stock casting CNC work. This is after years and years of R&D with other companies trying to find who had the best product per dollar spent. I found that in A.I. I'll give you a few reasons as to why.

If you ask the A.I. to cater your cylinder head to your application, they will do so. This includes chamber size, port volume, valve spring selection, valve spring INSTALL HEIGHT matched to your camshaft (something nobody pays attention to), Piston/Valve clearance calculations to make sure you have no problems there, etc etc

All of those things are very important and most of your mass produced CNC mills don't do that. I won't mention any names but shops pumping out 20-30 sets of cylinder heads a week aren't checking those things. Not necessarily because they don't want it, it's because they can't when you're pushing that much volume. A.I. caters more to the crowd wanting to dial in every aspect of their combination.

Here's a couple of threads over on LS1tech I've posted in the past with A.I. ported castings....

Spartan cammed, A.I. ported LS3 making 490/470 with a stock intake..
http://ls1tech.com/forums/showthread...referrerid=183

This doesn't necessarily to what we're talking about but impressive none the less. 492RWHP/448TQ, stock bottom end LS2 with Spartan Camshaft, A.I. ported TFS 220's...
http://ls1tech.com/forums/showthread...referrerid=183

A very mild cammed GTO picking up 40+ rwhp with a set of A.I. ported 241's...
http://ls1tech.com/forums/showthread...referrerid=183

A.I. 243's with a baby Spartan camshaft picked up 49rwhp on an LQ9 engine...Dyno graph is a dead link in here for some reason. I'll check on that.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/showthread...referrerid=183


Hopefully that helps give you some solid data to go off of. I'm sure I sound like an A.I. cheerleader at this point but the results speak for themselves. Phil @ A.I. is one of the first CNC porters I've met that match my personal attention to detail. I spend 20-30K/year with their company and have no plans of going elsewhere unless I'm buying a Trick Flow casting.

Total Engine Airflow gets honorable mention. They have some absolutely FANTASTIC CNC programs for the 5.3L and 243 castings. I have nothing but respect for TEA, but I chose to use another company when Brian Tooley sold the business.

Hope this helps!

 

Forgot to add. For those of you that might happen to stumble on some 317 castings (truck heads) dirt cheap, A.I. can convert them to the 243 casting for you. Their 241 program can reach compression ratio's of 11.5:1 with damn near stock PTV clearances as well.

OP, I also forgot to touch on your concerns for valve sizing. Don't get too hung up on larger valves. With a properly ported casting, stock valves will feed a 5.7L engine all the air it'll ever need.

 

Last time I dynoed it 450 RWHP but I have a self ported TB and FAST 90 Manifold with a Englandgreen whiplash cam.

 

I used to have all the bolt-ons, including UD pulley, electric WP, and ported FAST90. With the TEA finished TF 215s, and 10.9 C.R., with a Crane 228-232 (pretty small) cam did 483/432 SAE corrected. I attribute the Trickflow heads, and the custom work by TEA for the great results. Very streetable, almost stock, until I had to replace my clutch/hydraulics.

 

Good information guys!

The information about AI checking and optimizing other parts of the heads just right vs other heads not having time to do it, seems to add more value to what they do.

I had just gotten into the mode of why put a lot of $$ into rebuilding heads when you could buy new better heads to start with that might end up being the same price, or even less, before any CNC machining begins.

Vettenuts, it's funny you say my old 2003 LS1 LS6 book is outdated, it says to have your LS1 heads CNC ported vs buying LS6 heads, claiming LS6 heads are VERY expensive, and they probably were then, they seem to be affordable now.

 

Does that 483/432 SAE corrected mean RWHP, or is that what they are estimating it would be at the crank, by calculating the RWHP X's what the drive train loss factor is?

If that is RWHP, I'm wondering what a stock C6 Z06 makes at the wheels?

 

RWHP/TQ. I think about 450 for a stock LS7. Of course, now it's alot more.

 

Basically, if you've got the budget, IMO, the best is Trickflow, as custom built by TEA. Just don't do what I did, and go high compression, and then later decide to supercharge. Driven it about 3k miles with a stock block w/o trouble, after a very safe tune, but who knows?

 

From what Bill Curlee has, if I was to get a FAST intake, the 90mm would be the best choice?

As for a LS6 intake, I'm seeing them costing more than 500 bucks new, yeah I know I could get a used one as well, but would rather have a nice new clean piece.

The FAST intake may not be that much more than a new LS6, but offer a lot more flow?

 

I thought I read that FAST is re-releasing the 92, and a brand new LS2 take off is about $200. You still need the adapter harness, and new injectors, if you still are running stock ones. Those can wait until you tune, if you want. The 102 takes a little modification to fit, and I wouldn't bother. Try SDPC for the TB.

 

I see a 92 on their site, and a 102, so I guess 92 would be the way to go, if I use the aftermarket heads, or even ported stock head from AI.

Now, say I don't do cam and heads and bolt on a Magnacharger 2300, but still go with long tube headers and full exhaust including new X pipe and mufflers.

Could that make as much power at peak as the heads and cam?

I'm guessing the 2300 maggie would whip the heads/cam NA from a red light to maybe up to top end.

Looks the like the heads and cam, fast intake would still be a lot less $$ however.

Also, either way the differential probably needs to be at least the Z06 output shafts, ot they could snap with the extra umph?

 

I finally read all those links, every last post.

Now I'm thinking of a crate LS3 then have the heads done and a better cam, so many choices nowdays!

 

Don't get any FAST setup if you plan of doing some kind of FI, especially a PD unit, like Maggie. They replace the intake manifold, so you'd just be throwing away money. Any kind of FI setup, be it PD, centri, or turbo, is going to give way more power potential. A little bit more now (very little if you shop carefully) will save you the trouble of getting the most out of any displacement motor. The truth is, it's lots easier making HP with boost, than with cubic inches. This is also true of nitrous, but I've never been a fan of temporary power. I spent alot of money to have a sweet NA setup, with a stock block, and ended up selling stuff that was no longer needed to help pay for my A&A Vortech setup.