LAPD,

You are incorrect about the Koni's and IMO the statement regarding 12 way adjustment is the hype. The Koni has an adjustment range of about 7 - 8 sweeps of the adjuster, but you can set it at any point between a sweep. In that sense, it has no definitive number of settings except the absolute minimum and maximum points; you can adjust the shock to any point between the minimum and maximum detents. Having 12 clicks such as on the HAL means nothing more than you have 12 defined settings. The number of settings does not determine the width of the valving range, it just means you are given 12 fixed points ranging between minimum and maximum. In the case of the HAL bleeder valve adjuster; maximum is set by the fixed valving on the piston, and every setting below that is determined by how much the flow bleed valve is allowing to bypass from one side of the piston to the other. This why the HAL adjuster affects both compression and rebound; all it is is a flow control valve to let fluid bypass the piston valve in both directions. If valving control were that simple Penske, Koni, JRZ, Suspension Dynamics, Moton, Ground Control and any other high end racing shock company would have been driven out of business a long time ago.

Shinobi Z, I have no idea what you mean by cut and paste or why you are being so hostile, other than you consider it a personal affront for someone to express an opinion counter to your own. You challenge the credibility of my knowledge and skill, then accuse me of boasting. You have provided nothing concrete yourself except showing us your ability to be derogatory and loud-mouthed, which frankly requires no real skill or effort. I have tried to explain my position the best I can. Since it is so important to you, what experience can you provide us to demonstrate your expertise on shock valving and tuning, specifics about any shock of any make, etc.?

If you are asking me if I can provide dyno charts of the HAL and compare them point by point to the Koni, the answer is no I have not dyno'd the HAL's. Otherwise, I don't understand what it is exactly that you are asking for. If you or anyone else is willing to provide a HAL we can have it run on a Roehrig shock dyno at the same time and under the same conditions along with a C5 Koni for me to display here with a point by point synopsis. In other words, I'm willing to put up, but are you?

As for hooking up, I am not into the dragstrip scene, but we run an SCCA series called Pro Solo; two mirror image autox courses with a christmas tree drag start and 400 ft straight just like at the strip, which then diverge off into mirror image autox courses for two car to quasi-race each other to the finish; a RL is an automatic DNF and 0.500 is a perfect launch, the reaction time from perfect is included in the overall course time. Most of my Z06 competitors rarely launch above 3,000, 3500 tops to avoid excessive wheelspin. I consistently launch at 4,500 - 5,000 with rarely any wheelspin and typically low-mid 5 reaction times; this is dropping the clutch (not sliding) on untreated concrete with Hoosier A3S03 305/30-18 DOT autox tires on what is otherwise essentially a factory stock Z06. I have never experienced wheel hop under any condition, not even playing around on street tires. Both the alignment and shock settings are optimized for autox maneuvers, so it could probably be improved upon considerably if I chose to optimize them for drag purposes along with some real drag tires.

I have never had this particular car at the dragstrip. It is currently being kept in Atlanta. We have a NHRA sanctioned track here in Montgomery and I was hoping to get it over here for a few runs before the season shutsdown. I regret that you think I am full of poopie, but you are just as entitled to their opinion as anyone else, though you don't seem to agree when the shoe is on the other foot.



[Modified by TeamZ06, 8:41 PM 11/1/2002]

 

TeamZ06,

We don't want to argue with you and have this dragged out more than you insist on doing. We just put up a post in a simple perspective.

If you feel that the Koni shocks are better than the HAL shocks, so be it, but don't force everyone to see it your way because it will never happen.

Again, we offer both shock brands at the same price, but the HAL shocks seem to sell at a 5:1 ratio over the Konis.

We can go on and on about this topic for years. Let's just allow forum members to install the shocks they choose to without further debate about it.

Shawn

 

I suppose that's easier than admitting what you posted is incorrect or coming to a definitive conclusion that provides people with a realistic understanding of why they should be deciding on one product over another.

If you've been incorrectly telling prospective buyers who don't know any different that adjustment number defines valving range it might explain a few things.


[Modified by TeamZ06, 9:07 PM 11/1/2002]

 

TeamZ06,

It is easy for you to attack a forum vendor's statement when I never posted any technical data. All I said was there is no need for a war on which shock is better.

Again, you are insisting that everyone just reads what you write and accept it as fact when ride quality of shocks aren't that simple.

You seem to be pushing the Koni shocks a little too much. Do you work for Koni or something?

Instead of me posting 10 pages of shock facts which nobody will take the time to read, why don't we just let the forum member choose what shock they want whether it be Bilstein, Koni, HAL, Penske, etc?

Shawn

 

Wow! I sure started a heated debate! :eek:

I do appreciate everyone's input!

What I'm really looking for are just hard performance numbers i.e. people who have gone fast at the drag strip and have proven combinations. I'm not an expert tuner, nor do I have the time (or money) to experiment with different combinations.

It sounds to me like most people are going in the 9's with the HAL's... So I probably will just follow the crowd instead of trying to blaze a new path.

Thanks! :cool: :cheers:

 

Cool you go with the Hals, and I will go with the Koni :D Since we both live in Yonkers, we can take each other for a ride to compare the two shocks ;) :seeya

 

I have located a good source for the C5 Koni shocks; $815 with shipping included.

Please note that despite claims above I do not profit from Koni sales, am not sponsored by Koni, or otherwise do not receive any financial compensation from Koni or it's distributors.

What shocks any of you use is no skin off my back. The people who use substandard shocks only make it easier for me to be faster ...

I will not otherwise respond to or visit this thread further. What I am going to do is go ahead and purchase a HAL shock out of my own pocket and run a comparison, which will be displayed and discussed in a separate post at a later date.





[Modified by TeamZ06, 2:14 AM 11/2/2002]

 

I guess it boils down to the application you want them for. For track events I don't think I would consider the HAL's to each his own as we discussed this on the road race forum for a while. Share info and be happy :D

 

Moundir: Its a DEAL! :cheers:

 

Maybe some of you people need to consider some decaffinated coffee :D