I caught that after I posted. The exhaust is too cool at the 02s for them to work right. Maybe coating the headers will help?
140' seems really low for a cat to work. Great site BTW, I used it for my Z06 MAF conversion. :cheers:

 

I'm not catalytic converter scientist, I'm just going on what Lou G himself has reiterated to me. Its a new cat that just came out in the past year, and according to Lou, the "old school" thinking of how cats work simply doesnt apply to these.

I do know the car doesnt smell like gas, like it does with the cats off. Of course, I also know my nose isnt a scientific instrument. :lol:

 

I passed the sniffer tests here in TX with my Supra (a 94 twin turbo) and my Eclipse (a 92 turbo) with no cats, so I doubt jimx will have any problems passing with the cats a little farther back than usual.

That said, if you're going to run cats you might as well run them closer to the engine so they can do as much good as possible, then just swap them for pipes when you go to the track. :)

 

i agree. i use your site for everything. thank u pat

 

Great write up Jon.

As for the cats. When talking to Random, I was told that the old, ceramic cats needed the high temps to work correctly. In fact they were made out of ceramic material specifically so it would "Glow" and retain the heat to perform properly. If you remember all the ceramic cats have a tin "Heat Shield" on them to prevent grass fires and car fires.

The new "Metal Matrix" cats do not even come with a heat shield because the Metal matrix does NOT retain the heat, and does not run hot, no mater where it is located. The new operating temp according to Random is now 140 degrees for proper functioning. In addition, these cats do not take away the kind of hp that the old Ceramic cats do. They are just more efficient. New technology is a wonderful thing.

My car is lowered about 1" and I must not drive over speed bumps as big, because mine do not scrape.

We have not heard about any other adapters that were wired wrong, but i will check a few and find out. If that is the case, then that would explain the few cars that set codes for no real reason.

The parts delays were from being out of stock when JMX ordered his headers. Sorry about that.

AGain, great writeup. You must be tired from installing all the parts on your "To Do" page!

thanks

Lou G

 

Based on these factors and the price for these headers, why would one want to buy these? It this is all true, then Lou failed to do his homework. Unacceptable to have to fix vendor problems, IMO. :mad

 

EXCELLENT write up Jon:thumbs: Your LS1howto.com is an AWESOME sorce for C5/F-body DIY, thank you Sir.

Ok, mistakes happen and LG corrected the issue with Borla. Now when are they going to correct the issue with YOU? Seems to me good customer service would dictate that LG send you a new set of headers with the proper O2 bung holes. I mean for $1800 you shouldn't have to be "drilling large holes in the transmission tunnel closeout plate":eek: to fix THEIR mistake.




[Modified by K.Shupe, 1:57 PM 4/3/2004]

 

Thanks for the kind words guys. I do these writeups mostly due to the fact that when I started on the LS1, there wasnt much out there to tell me how to work on the car, in laymans terms. Included instructions with products were usually very basic..so I figured a site "for dummies" like me would be best :jester Last month was the busiest month yet in the history of my site, so I need to thank YOU guys for using it and letting others know!

As for the issues, I didn't post them to say that the LG's are bad. On the contrary, I do like these headers. I posted them because I'm trying to point out that when modifying a car, stuff happens. Its how things go sometimes, and little modifications are necessary. The delay doesnt happen to most, the bungs have been since fixed, the cats take 15 seconds to "slot" for better fitmit (maybe LG will do this inhouse soon?), and the ground clearance is the same as other longtube header solutions out there.

I just didnt want to mislead somebody new to car modification into thinking things will always go rosy if they just follow my instructions, sometimes stuff doesnt work out perfect. I'm "keepin it real", as the kids say these days. ;)

Lou, the car would look like it has a dead o2 sensor if the adapter was wired wrong...the car goes into OL-FAULT mode (open loop) with a dead O2. Its pretty easy to spot with a scan tool, so if people are having issues it should be easy to find with a tech-2 or autotap/efilive. I first thought it was my o2 sensor, but then saw the wires didnt match between the left and right ones on the adapters. Simple and free fixes are the best!

Jon
http://www.ls1howto.com

 

:iagree: Yep, even though they know about those issues LG keeps selling the "bad" headers. Common LG better customer service. :seeya

 

Great site dude.

:thumbs: :thumbs:

 

:thumbs: may be using it soon

 

We never knew about any issues with the driver side 02 bung until all the headers were sent out. No one really brought it to our attention until the next batch was being built.

Why so many of you want to jump in and cry foul when even the few sets that made it out of Borla were installed with no feed back from the customers. Had we known there was a problem, we would have easily fixed it in house before any sets left. To this day, I have only heard from about 2 other customers who experienced what JMX experienced with the 02.

As Jmx said, there was one batch with "Some" of the drivers side 02 bungs at a bad angle. IT made the 02 wires too close to the tunnel cover. Borla since corrected this, since it was just a few headers out of the batch, It must have been a bad day for one of their employees.

I would have done anything JMX wanted to remedy the issue. There was a 2 week wait for a new batch of headers to come in, and Jon wanted to change out his FLP/dynatech headers because the mounting tab had broken out and he was leaking exhaust out of a 1/2" hole.

I never heard about the adapter wire problem until after he fixed it, and was complete with this project.

Our headers are fully guaranteed and we would have done whatever was necessary to remedy any issues. Anyone who know LG Motorsports know this.

I am pretty sure that he changed to my headers because his former brand would not warranty them even though the headers broke.

I also belive that Jon forgot to mention that we installed an extra wideband 02 bung at NO Charge so he could run his own wide band to monitor his A/F ratio. I think that that would indicate some extra customer service above the call of duty.

I know that most of the header threads lately have been a "Gotcha" kind of thread. ( I noticed the NJ in there somewhere) Jon, is a DIY kind of guy, and he would not bother calling with a minor issue like a mixed up wire. Had he called, I would have JUMPED, like I always try to do. I

So haveing said that, I would like to thank the over 300 LG PRo Long Tube buyers who have had trouble free installs and who we have helped through any minor issues to a successful conclusion. And who are enjoying the new found hp and especially the new found Torque from the LG Pro Long Tube Headers.

Customer service is our #1 concern at LG Motorsports.

So, Again, i will say, good writeup Jon, and keep up the good work.

thanks
Lou Gigliotti

 

Thanks Lou, I wanted my post to reflect that I was NOT trying to bash these headers, I was just iterating that when modding, stuff happens. Most of the stuff is small, and I dont want people to freak out when minor stuff happens, its just how things go. Apparently I worded it in a way that people are taking it the wrong way...every time there was an issue, I never had any doubt that it'd get resolved one way or another, either by me spending a few minutes to fix it, or by calling LG motorsports and having them fix it (which I knew they would if I asked them).

And somebody up above mentioned the xpipe weld looks "ugly"...that is actually a wideband bung that they welded in for me (for free, like lou mentioned), not an ugly weld.

Anyway, I just removed the xpipe/rear pipe setup....8 minutes. Not bad, its at least as swappable as the FLP's V-clamp solution!

 

I can't wait to get mine installed on Monday.... :party:

 

I would be very interested to find out if there is any correlation to the wiring issue and the codes being set. That might be a plausable explanation that would benefit those who have had the problem and those (me :D ) that are contemplating a future purchase.

 

Hmmm. I'll have to check my adapters I am throwing drivers side insufficient switching and slow repsonse codes. I figured it was the sensor location.
What is the correct color order if you remember ?

 

I installed my LGs last week and I was impressed with the quality of the parts.

I stupidly reversed the 02s and my car ran like crap. I called LG and was immediately put through to Lou who diagnosed the problem in ten seconds. That is excellent customer service.

Anyone who is whining about the price should try running a business of their own. It has got to be tough to make a decent profit on parts like these due to the low sales volume. Hats off to Lou and eveyone else who risks their own money to develop new products for our cars.

Mike,

Portland, OR

 

The switched wires in the adapters shouldn't really have anything to do with the insufficient switching codes at all, the o2s will look dead to the computer, and it will very quickly let you know there is a dead o2. Insufficient switching is probably a worn o2, or an o2 that isnt getting hot enough, or maybe one that is coated with grease or oil. O2 sensors arent *that* hard to foul up.

My car very obviously told me a sensor was dead, and thats when I saw the crossed wire. The voltage will stick at something like 0.440 and just sit there, never moving.

FWIW, no codes yet on my setup once I put it all on. Drove it hard after install to blow all the oil and grease out of the suckers, and it seems to run just fine. :blueangel:

 

Hey,

That was my comment above concerning the weld looking "rough" not ugly, no biggy. I just wanted to make sure Lou didn't think I was bashing his product. :cheers:

That was really nice of them to accommodate your request for the bung fitment...... Talk about great customer service!! Hey, do you run your car with a wideband sensor all the time? If so, what product do you use? I assume you must be LS1-tech tuning your setup?

Thanks again for the write-up, you can be certain I'll be going back to your site again once I need to install a set of these bad boys! :thumbs:

 

If you want to see rough, take a look at the Kooks install thread. They look like a junior high shop project compared to the LGs. :leaving:

I'm leaning toward the dynatechs personally. They have the cats and O2s closer to the engine, and I will have a better chance at passing the roller test.