Axle Nut Info from Assembly Plant
09-13-2007, 05:46 PM
#61
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
This is not serious issue, but something that should be looked after.
Save The Wave,
John
09-13-2007, 05:49 PM
#62
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
09-13-2007, 05:50 PM
#63
Le Mans Master
Not to hijack the thread but has anyone found their nuts loose after tightening them once to spec? My passenger was very loose but has not budged in the past 5 months.
09-13-2007, 06:03 PM
#64
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
I checked them again on 9/11 at 5360 miles. Left still tight, right 90-100 ft-lb. The right was not as loose as the first time, but not where I set it in June. I have a new nut but did not have the Loctite so I just tightened the right back to 120 ft-lb. I also marked the nut and spindle shaft with a dab of nail polish. I was able to obtain some Loctite today but I think I will wait a while. I want to get some miles on it and check the nail polish to verify that the nut is actually turning.
I was unable to find Loctite 272 locally. Most of the hardware and parts stores sell the Permatex brand and all they had was 27100 which is not as strong as Loctite 272. I was at my local GM dealer today having my Radio/NAV replaced (defective touch screen) and I purchased the GM brand. Larger quantity than I needed 10 ml, but it was the proper type.
The GM number in the information I received from the plant was 12345493. This part number has now been superceded by 89021297.
09-13-2007, 06:13 PM
#65
I'm "Apache" a psycho dog
It is a 6pt made by Great Neck tools there was play turning both left & right, it has a plastic plug in the wrench end so it can't be used and then returned so i didn't wan't to remove it unless it fit, so im able to return it.
09-13-2007, 06:21 PM
#66
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
The kit I purchased (K/D) does not even contain a 33, skips from 32 to 34.
Someone (maybe on another forum) posted the tolerance for these large sockets and there was a lot of overlap between a 33 and 34.
Save The Wave,
John
09-13-2007, 06:26 PM
#67
I'm "Apache" a psycho dog
Thanks Rob, I suspected it was 6 point since I have not seen many 12 point sockets this large.
The kit I purchased (K/D) does not even contain a 33, skips from 32 to 34.
Someone (maybe on another forum) posted the tolerance for these large sockets and there was a lot of overlap between a 33 and 34.
Save The Wave,
John
The kit I purchased (K/D) does not even contain a 33, skips from 32 to 34.
Someone (maybe on another forum) posted the tolerance for these large sockets and there was a lot of overlap between a 33 and 34.
Save The Wave,
John
09-13-2007, 06:35 PM
#68
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
No, mine was a little sloppy. I was not too concerned since the nut wrench face is big and the socket was 6 point. I measured all of the nuts I have and they are greater than 33.5 mm face to face so a 33 mm socket might not fit. I did not have a 33 mm to try. The 32 mm I have is way too small.
Save The Wave,
John
Save The Wave,
John
09-13-2007, 07:05 PM
#69
SUBVETTE
Another socket option you can try (which worked for me) is a Sears Craftsman 1 5/16" . It comes in a 3/4" drive only, so you need a 1/2" drive adapter, but if fits pretty nicely since it's a 12 point socket.
09-13-2007, 08:12 PM
#70
I'm "Apache" a psycho dog
No, mine was a little sloppy. I was not too concerned since the nut wrench face is big and the socket was 6 point. I measured all of the nuts I have and they are greater than 33.5 mm face to face so a 33 mm socket might not fit. I did not have a 33 mm to try. The 32 mm I have is way too small.
Save The Wave,
John
Save The Wave,
John
the 33 is cheaper) and just tried it and it fits, but i cant check the TQ because all i have is IN/FT TQ wrench, so it will have to wait till monday when i can borrow by brothers.
Last edited by Rob 99; 09-20-2007 at 08:34 PM.
09-20-2007, 08:35 PM
#71
I'm "Apache" a psycho dog
I checked the TQ the DS was right on at 118lb/ft but the PS was not reading at 80lb/ft, it took a very small turn to get it to 118, i marked the nut/threads to make checking easier.
09-21-2007, 07:35 AM
#73
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
"If there is presence of the nut "indexing and/or looseness"
All vehicles do not have this issue so I "think" the factory and service manual instructions will remain as they are now. I don't know this for a fact, we will have to wait for an official TSB from GM to see how it reads.
Save The Wave,
John
09-28-2007, 07:33 AM
#74
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Member Since: Aug 2000
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I posted this information at the end of an existing thread. It was suggested that I start a new thread so that anyone with the problem can see the corrective action.
I used the Owner Feedback at http://www.bowlinggreenassemblyplant.com/
to ask about the Axle Nut issue.
I received a reply and asked for permission to post the fix on the forums. The information I received is as follows:
If there is presence of the nut "indexing and/or looseness", do the following:
1. Remove existing nut
2. Apply Goodwrench # 12345493 (also known as Loctite 272) on threads in area where nut finally seats
3. Install new nut (p/n 10257766)
4. Torque nut to 190Nm (140 ft-lb), static
5. Allow 24 hours cure time.
Update 9/13/2007
Part Number 12345493. has been superceded by 89021297.
Note that a NEW nut is required and the torque has been increased from 118 ft-lb to 140 ft-lb.
Save The Wave,
John
I used the Owner Feedback at http://www.bowlinggreenassemblyplant.com/
to ask about the Axle Nut issue.
I received a reply and asked for permission to post the fix on the forums. The information I received is as follows:
If there is presence of the nut "indexing and/or looseness", do the following:
1. Remove existing nut
2. Apply Goodwrench # 12345493 (also known as Loctite 272) on threads in area where nut finally seats
3. Install new nut (p/n 10257766)
4. Torque nut to 190Nm (140 ft-lb), static
5. Allow 24 hours cure time.
Update 9/13/2007
Part Number 12345493. has been superceded by 89021297.
Note that a NEW nut is required and the torque has been increased from 118 ft-lb to 140 ft-lb.
Save The Wave,
John
It contains instructions that are different in important respects from those cited above. Specifically, a different part number for a new axle nut and a different torque value for that nut.
The usual assumption is that the latest dated info is more accurate. But I hate to assume anything on this subject. I'll proceed by attempting to get a copy of the latest document.
Ranger
09-28-2007, 09:07 AM
#75
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
There is a new tech document from GM on the axle nut issue.
It contains instructions that are different in important respects from those cited above. Specifically, a different part number for a new axle nut and a different torque value for that nut.
The usual assumption is that the latest dated info is more accurate. But I hate to assume anything on this subject. I'll proceed by attempting to get a copy of the latest document.
Ranger
It contains instructions that are different in important respects from those cited above. Specifically, a different part number for a new axle nut and a different torque value for that nut.
The usual assumption is that the latest dated info is more accurate. But I hate to assume anything on this subject. I'll proceed by attempting to get a copy of the latest document.
Ranger
Ranger, thanks for the updated info.
I received an E-mail from the assembly plant last week telling me a TSB would be released this week with the official information. All of the internal reviews were completed on 9/20/2007.
I wonder if the nut is actually different, or like the Loctite just the GM part number was changed. I have some new nuts of the original part number. I will try to find one of the new nuts so I can see what is different, if anything.
UPDATE 9/28/2007 9:14AM
I just checked the new TSB and the part number for the nut remains the same as the original information I received. Only the torque value has been increased from 140 to 160.
Save The Wave,
John
Last edited by jbeidl; 09-28-2007 at 09:17 AM.
09-28-2007, 09:46 AM
#76
Burning Brakes
Thanks! 
Yes, very interesting... especially since many of us had speculated that thread locker as well as high torque might not be the best thing for the situation.
Of course, thread locker and high torque would be the most typical cure for any typical situation where a given nut tends to loosen. Hopefully the engineers thought this through for this specific situation and didn't just rattle off the textbook answer for a loose nut.
We learned from the axle chatter issue that responses from GM about curing a problem may or may not be correct... at least not the first time.
I torqued my original nuts to spec (one was loose) and did not use thread locker. My intention was/is to simply check the torque regularly every 5k miles or so (or at every oil change, whatever). I may continue to do this and only take more extensive action if I note one or both nuts starting to loosen again at any point... or until we know for sure that GM's new cure is indeed the most appropriate course of action.
The only bad thing about using thread locker is that once you use it, you can no longer check torque without disturbing the locking bond and/or the bond will not allow you to achieve a true accurate torque reading. Until we know 100% for sure why these nuts lose their torque, I may continue to check torque periodically (which means no thread locker)... because i'm not yet convinced that it's the NUT that's merely backing off, losing torque... the loss of torque may be coming from something wearing, stretching, moving etc with respect to the axle itself... if so, thread locker will not help.
Will give this a little more time to unfold. In the meantime my axle nuts are torqued nice and have been holding torque.
Yes, very interesting... especially since many of us had speculated that thread locker as well as high torque might not be the best thing for the situation.
Of course, thread locker and high torque would be the most typical cure for any typical situation where a given nut tends to loosen. Hopefully the engineers thought this through for this specific situation and didn't just rattle off the textbook answer for a loose nut.
We learned from the axle chatter issue that responses from GM about curing a problem may or may not be correct... at least not the first time.
I torqued my original nuts to spec (one was loose) and did not use thread locker. My intention was/is to simply check the torque regularly every 5k miles or so (or at every oil change, whatever). I may continue to do this and only take more extensive action if I note one or both nuts starting to loosen again at any point... or until we know for sure that GM's new cure is indeed the most appropriate course of action.
The only bad thing about using thread locker is that once you use it, you can no longer check torque without disturbing the locking bond and/or the bond will not allow you to achieve a true accurate torque reading. Until we know 100% for sure why these nuts lose their torque, I may continue to check torque periodically (which means no thread locker)... because i'm not yet convinced that it's the NUT that's merely backing off, losing torque... the loss of torque may be coming from something wearing, stretching, moving etc with respect to the axle itself... if so, thread locker will not help.
Will give this a little more time to unfold. In the meantime my axle nuts are torqued nice and have been holding torque.
, and I'm doing the same thing.
09-28-2007, 09:54 AM
#77
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Member Since: Aug 2000
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^^^
Simple approach: use loctite, retorque the nut, and then use two dabs of paint to index the nut to the axle. From that point on, checking the nut tightness is a visual inspection requiring only popping off the wheel cover.
Ranger
Simple approach: use loctite, retorque the nut, and then use two dabs of paint to index the nut to the axle. From that point on, checking the nut tightness is a visual inspection requiring only popping off the wheel cover.
Ranger
09-28-2007, 10:52 AM
#78
NCM Life Member
Thread Starter
Check post #64 and you will see might right side was loose again. I did not have the proper Loctite available at the time so I just tightened it back to 120 ft-lb and marked it with nail polish (not mine - I "borrowed" it from my wife). I plan to drive it a few thousand miles and check if the nut actually moves.
Save The Wave,
John
Save The Wave,
John
