I agree with your definition of a worn clutch. My inference from reading this thread is that the folks who are **** about the clarity of the hydraulic fluid in their clutch cylinders are being that way because they believe that the black "material" in the slave cylinder might interfere with the proper operation of the clutch and not allow it to fully engage the disc, causing excessive wear. My reading is that, if it aint broke don't fix it. Some folks just need to fiddle with their toys.

 

Understood and agreed, but if like me you have a lot of experience with clutches, then I don't have to tell you that with 400 plus HP if your clutch isn't engaging all the way...you're gonna know it whether it be by just the feel of it, or watching the tach wind up and the car isn't really moving much....LOL......

 

Your taking about two different systems here.

The clutch is the flywheel, the clutch disc and the pressure plate. As the clutch disc wears from use, it creates clutch dust in the bell housing.

Now on the hydraulic side, you have the master cylinder, the slave cylinder and the throw out bearing that they will push forward to push the pressure plate fingers in so the pressure plate is not longer under tension (to allow the flywheel to free spin).

So what the ranger method does is removes the clutch dust that will work it way into the hydraulic system fluid, so the dust does not cause premature wear to the hydraulic side (inner parts of the slave and master cylinder).

So when the clutch parts wear out, the clutch will not engage correctly (clutch slips). When the hydraulic system wears out, then it will not push the throw out bearing outwards far enough against the pressure plate fingers, and you can not disengage the clutch instead.

Worst yet, as the hydraulic fluid becomes contaminated, this cause less movement of the slave cylinder to be able to push the throw out bearing outward to disengage the clutch fully as you push the clutch pedal all the way in, and cause premature wear to the clutch parts since it not fully disengaging

Bluntly, you can do the ranger fluid changes for around the cost of a quart worth of dot 4 to keep the fluid clean ($8), or you can just take the car down to GM to have the fluid power flushed every two years as called out in the service manual isntead (at the cost of around a grand for GM to power flush the fluid since it a PITA to get to the slave cylinder bleed vavle).


So again, very first fluid change in the tank, do the pedal pumps.

After this first time, just drive the car with changing out the fluid in the tank every few weeks as it become dirty again (no pumping needed on these fluid changes,since you driving the car is doing to pedal pumps instead), and after a few weeks of just fluid changes alone, the fluid will stay clean for months at a time until you will just need to change the fluid out in the tank again.

 

And when the clutch dust in the slave cylinder fluid prematurely wears out the seal in the slave, don't come crying to us when you are gouged $3K to just replace it. Better yet, since the walls of the master cylinder is plastic, and wears out even faster from the abrasive properties of the clutch dust then the slave, having to have the master cylinder replaced is around a Grand instead.

The master cylinder is easy to replace since you don't have to drop the drive line to get to it, but you still have to power bleed the system afterward, which means dropping some of the exhaust parts to get to the slave cylinder bleeder valve to power flush the system after the master cylinder has been replaced.

Why, since you did not want to take the time to just ranger method change the fluid to keep it clean for a total of around $8 worth of dot 4 fluid instead.

 

I just purchased on 06 with the MZ6 transmission. When I checked the clutch fluid after picking up the car I was shocked at how low and dirty it was. However I did the ranger method and added fluid and even after pumping the pedal 50 times the fluid stayed clear. Is this normal for the first time or indicative of another issue?

 

I found you need to actually drive the car for a bit to get the fluid to recirculate. Just sitting in the garage cycling the fluid using the ranger methods along with pedal pumps in insufficient in cleaning the system.

 

Its 12:51 AM EST. After reading this thread I went into the garage and changed the fluid in the reservoir. It took me 5 minutes. I probably do it 10-12 times a year. The fluid is very clear for 40K miles. I don't know if it helps in the long run. But, I agree with those above who say that is very cheap insurance.

 

WHOOOOOAAAAA here. Are we suggesting that GM designed a clutch system that is so poor that it lets clutch dust get into the system that easy ? If clutch dust gets into the system that easy then there can't be a very good seal and that should mean that there should never be enough hydraulic pressure to operate the clutch properly. You guys can call it what ever you want, but it seems pretty cut and dry that either GM designed a system that is a total POS and gets contaminated when ever anyone sneezes too hard, or this is just another case of the internet "experts" trying to convince every one that they should needlessly work on their clutch hydraulics at the same time they change their engine oil every 3000 miles....now theres some poor guy thats gonna change his clutch fluid 10-12 times a year......you just got to love the internet.......

 

Yes that is what everyone is saying here. GM GOOFED UP. It happens, they are not perfect. The hydraulic part of the clutch system is not up to par on these cars. That is why they have a bulletin out ( not recall but) they are extending the warranty with a free replacement of the clutch master cylinder for 10 years and for cars as 10 years old. If that is not an admission, what is?. The main culprit is the fluid contamination,which is not helped by the location of the bleeder which is more than PITA. I do not recall the exact tech details but this contamination increases the pressure and the resistance inside the master and plunger fails, part of it falls off and your pedal stays on the floor and does not come up. Do the search on the forum. What everyone is saying is that if you keep the fluid clean that will reduce and or possibly eliminate the chances of this happening. And from the looks of it it works, I have not read clutch master failing from people who keep their fluid clean yet, using this method or any others. I for one hate dealers, will avoid having them touch my car at any cost. If this has any chance of keeping from their greasy hands, I will take it and use it.

 

Understood....and completely agreed, but lets face it......if someone has to resort to changing their clutch MC fluid once a month, well thats just outrageous....

 

Just driving the car and using the clutch normally is better than pumping the clutch 40 times sitting in the garage. Besides the fact that pumping the clutch 40 times just needlessly wears on the system...why not spend those 40 times actually having fun driving it.

 

And i totally agree with you too. That is excessive, and if this is what i had to do every month they would have my gs stuck up their ying yangs. What i do ( just did it this morning) once a month i pull out the slightly discolored fluid from the clutch master with a syringe, fill it up with Dot 4 to the line and go for my Sunday cruise ( rub it in, i live in florida and the weather was perfect today) and all that clutching distributes the fluid. Once the fluid is clean by ranger method it is very easy to maintain it this way, just 5 minutes a month.

 

Sounds like you have at least some what simplified the problem. But here is what I find interesting. If the unit as a whole is so bad that it lets in all the contaminants, then how the heck can it hold the fluid in the first place ? Seems as though the pressure would blow fluid out all over the place.

 

Dirt in a hydraulic system is very common. Think of the hydraulic ram on a piece of earthmoving equipment....it is constantly getting dirty and then as the ram slides back into its' housing, some of the dirt on the surface is going to get past the seal and get into the system. Same with a shock absorber and the fork on a motorcycle or bicycle. These systems all continue to work fine, but the dirt is certainly not a good thing.

 

And the glitch, GM designed the master cylinder out of plastic, so the grit/clutch dust scores the walls even faster than a steel lined master cylinder instead.

And even worse, since GM put three orifice restrictiors in the clutch fluid line to slow the clutch engagement down to save the drive line (the part that they warranty) if you clutch dump (the clutch they do not warrenty so they put the abuse to it with it slipping instead of the slower engagement), the more contaminated the fluid, the slower it is in returning from the slave to the master cylinder as well.

Hence here is the nasty rub, since the clutch pedal assists spring will try to pull the clutch pedal up when the assist spring cams over about half way up, and when the fluid is not returning to the master cylinder fast enough instead (through the 3 line restrictors), it end up pulling the end plumber off the end of the master cylinder rod to cause the dead pedal problem.

Read this thread, and the problem is caused by dirty fluid in the clutch system.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...-pressure.html

So simply, GM is still not trying to solve the clutch dust problem in the lines from the bad seal design of the slave cylinder, but just came up with a new master cylinder that the end plunger is not pulled off so easily by the back fluid pressure not returning to the master cylinder through the restrictors instead. So even with the new master cylinder, the service book is still saying that the clutch fluid line still needs to be power flushed every two years still.


To bottom line it, the term to sum it all, is product obsolescence, and it not so much that GM screwed up on the design, but designed the system in a way that it causes the end user to have to replace/service parts more frequently instead.

Clutch dump abuse ends up with the clutch burnt up faster (which again the clutch is not under warranty), and if the fluid is not power flushed every two years as pointed out in the service manual (for around a grand each time), when the slave and master cylinder system die due to clutch dust in the fluid, you get to pay to have them replaced as well.

So with the vet, the price tag to own it is the simple money, and then you have the service charges to maintain it (the corvette tax money and in the life of the car, several time more than the selling price to begin with).

So what the Ranger Method does, is to save you a great deal of money, but staying in front of the problem/product obsolescence to begin with, to get multi-folds more expected life out of the clutch hydraulic instead.


And if think that its only the clutch hydraulic system that GM pull this stunt to sell more parts and services on the vet, your are sadly mistaken.

Case in point, GM designed the NPP exhaust solenoid backwards (NC, instead of Normal open) and it burns out in a short time, instead of lasting the life of the car instead.

 

Absolutely....and lets not forget the inner design of the piston and seal. The more pressure applied, the greater the seal....for a while anyway....LOL. And when the piston is returning in its bore there is no pressure being applied in a one way system....

 

Well I did the ranger method for the first time today. Did it three times. I drove the car for a little while. All is good. I checked it after the drive and its still clear.

 

Well, if you are talking about me, you should actually read my post. It takes me five minutes to drain the reservoir. And, put clean fluid in. Five minutes. That translates into an aggregate time of about one hour per year. Nobody is talking about changing MC fluid once a month. How much time do you spend cleaning your chrome wheels?

 

WOOOAAAA.....pull in them reins there skippy. I'm sorry if your take offense to someone saying that its ludicrous to have to "Re-Arrange" your clutch fluid once every month, but guess you'll just have to live with it. It is ludicrous to have to go through that hassle regardless of how long it takes. And I only clean my chrome wheels once a month or 10-12 times a year....which ever comes first...

 

I use the modified Ranger method:
Got a couple 40 cc medical syringes with some large needles. One for sucking out bad fluid, the other for filling with clean fluid. Went on the WEB and found some thin black nylon tubing. Stiff walls, but flexible. Dimensions are 0.075 ID and 0.125 OD. Cut it about 18" long.

(Credit to tjl5709)

Takes 5 minutes to completely flush out the fluid. Repeat every few months and your normal driving cycles any missed fluid through the system for you to catch on the next flush.

Pics of what's needed.