:crazy: waste of time that would prove nothing to forum. And, what exactly and why do I have to prove anything you? Since you are a self proclaimed computer god, why don't you go ahead an prove that I can't do it?

 

When the car is purchased (My Dad's DTS in this case), the Onstar system must be set up and activated. The salesman explained the features and asked him if he wanted it set it up. My dad called me and asked my opinion. My dad is 84. I feel much more secure about his and my mother's safety with onstar activated than with it off.

 

So you were talking out of your azz. Understood.

You don't have to, as long as you're cool with appearing like you're talking out of your azz.

Please show me where I stated that I am a "computer god."

That is quite possibly the dumbest statement I've ever heard. How, pray tell, would one go about proving a negative such as that? You may as well ask me to prove that there is not $5.99 in your pocket. You're just dancing around it because you don't know what the hell you're talking about.

 

dead cat in a box science.

Since it cannot be observed that he can do it. He cannot.

Just like since you cannot prove that there is a dead cat in a box. There isnt.

 

I'll break this down and make it easy for you to understand:

OnStar currently has the capability to listen in on you without confirmation or an alert of the occupants. This was used here in the D.C. area recently.

Your computer does not, unless you plug in a mic.

OnStar, unless you disable it, can track you "right now."

Your computer does not, so long as you don't do anything stupid like post your address to your hard drive or post the locations of various routers and other computers to their respective storage areas. At best, when everything is properly set up for security, you can be tracked to your ISP in real time. Anything further requires hardware tracing and takes time.

OnStar will likely get a camera in the future, opening a new can of worms.

You computer doesn't have to.

OnStar is linked to your real identity in a database.

Your computer doesn't have to be.

OnStar can be cracked and used to shut down your car.

Your computer, at worse, can be cracked and mined for personal data, which shouldn't be on there in the first place. Nothing life threatening, though.

You control almost every aspect of your computer so you control the level of security and the ease of tracing and identifying. OnStar is not so controllable.

Unless you feel that every OnStar representative is on the up-and-up, every GM computer is unhackable, and OnStar systems will never be abused or screwed with, there is certain risk of Big Brother and other problems. Computers are a lot easier to keep control over and hide your identity with.

 

HouseStar would be a good idea for Michael Jackson.

 

Holy Cow I just want a car not a freaking computer with 4 tires! :skep: :rant:


[Modified by ghostRder, 6:17 PM 12/29/2003]

 

:eek: :lurk: :eek: Onstar: had it on my Aurora. Let the contract lapse after the free year. It didn't freak me out, but I'm sure it can be abused. The nefarious will probably always take advantage of the naive. Oh well.

 

DELETED



[Modified by Runge_Kutta, 8:06 PM 12/29/2003]

 

That isnt where he was posting from earlier

 

Good job, and easily obtained with a search of the archives, but that's not where I was posting from.

In fact, that info is more easily obtained from my resume on my web page.


[Modified by Scissors, 8:32 PM 12/29/2003]


[Modified by Scissors, 9:39 PM 12/29/2003]

 

Have you ever used OnStar Scissors? Do you have a vehicle with one?

1) When I drive, I do not talk to myself, I listen to the radio. (If you talk to yourself while driving, then you have bigger issues at hand than OnStar big guy.)
2) If you have "TOP SECRET" stuff to talk about, then you need to find yourself a solid soundproof box somewhere because with todays available surveillance equip, OnStar ease dropping is the least of your worries.
3) If you ARE someone that is VERY IMPORTANT that someone MUST gain access to OnStar criminally through employee corruption, electronic hacking, etc. Then I doubt that is the ONLY way you are under survallience! I'm sure the hell not going to casually break into OnStar just so I can listen in on the stupidity that comes out of your mouth in your car just for the hell of it Scissors! (Bad enough I read it here)

As far as GPS location of the system. WHO cares! The stupid Motorola cell phone strapped to my butt can be used on me to locate me to where I stand within seconds. What do I care who sees where my vehicle is??? Now if you are the kind to do unlawful deads, then I most certainly see a cause for alarm.

You say
then
You are worried that GM's computer may be hackable (OnStar) but yet you "think" you control almost every aspect of your computer and the level of security? Ha, and you are giving me poopie about computer knowledge, yet make a naive statement about having control. Uhhjjjj On top of it, a MICROSOFT Windoze NT administrator talking about "security" and "Privacy." Something about that in itself that one gets a chuckle out of.

I give up Scissors, may you have the last word. Obviously, you are a superior being to my mere mortal self! As a mortal, myself, if OnStar has a 1% chance of one day maybe saving my butt, then I could care less if some corrupt operator at OnStar wants to listen in to the Radio with me. :p

If you are so worried about your privacy, may I suggest a nice wood cabin in the mountains somewhere lit by candle power?


[Modified by H82BFST, 7:54 PM 12/29/2003]

 

I have to say that black boxes and their like are a major invasion of privacy. You should be able to at least disable them.

I don't need people knowing when I drive, how fast I drive, how many times I redline the car, how many g's I'm pulling in corners, etc... Whether I drive like a grandpa or Schumacher is nobody's business. The logic of "if you're not doing anything wrong you have nothing to worry about" does not fly in reality. What's next...everybody gets tagged like cattle?

 

I have driven a car with onstar and I dont like it. Waste of money. As well as sketchy.

 

So I take it that means you never talk to passengers and you never talk on a cell phone.

There's a significant logistical difference between having to use a laser microphone or bugs versus simply utilizing an already-in-place monitoring system.

Additionally, we government security guys know that a large volume of unclassified data can be pieced together to get classified info. This is bad if Government fleet vehicles all get OnStar.

Yeah, because as we all know, people don't hack into secure systems just for the fun of it. :rolleyes:

That was sarcasm, by the way.

Perhaps a thief who uses OnStar or your Cell Phone to find out when you're far away from home so he can steal everything from your home without interference.

Thanks for proving my point that you don't know what in the hell you're talking about. GMs computers must have a variety of complex programs running and communicating with each other, which opens up vulnerabilities. Your home PC, on the other hand, does not. I can easily secure any home Windows or Unix PC to where it is 100% secure from network hacks and cracks. (Novell, on the other hand...) But you'd know all of this if you weren't a computer newb.

Translation: "I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'll just say something that sounds vaguely witty and attempt to save some modicum of my dignity."


[Modified by Scissors, 8:59 PM 12/29/2003]

 

:skep: The black boxes...

A. Don't transmit
B. Only record a few seconds of data
C. Only confirm what other forensic evidence on the scene already states

 

Wow. I apologize for jumping into this fracas, but I was reading it with a mixture of amusement and horror :jester . I'm wondering of all this fractious posts of late are justing simmering hormones over the impending c6 release? Or could it be, for the most part, we are a bright, technologically-savy bunch with the stereotypical lack of socialization and social skills? :D

Or, is that regardless of the venue or forum (excuse the pun), there's always the attempt to sort who the alpha dog is?

Either way, we are all passionate about the car, and hopefully we won't get too ugly (like posting home addresses to show you can)...you never know who you're going to really upset sometime - someone with a very long reach and with the willl to use it for their amusement (there are a few certified good guys/bad azzes that post here though you wouldn't know it by their user profile).

Anyway, there's always going to be a big brother of some sorts, let's just hope our Constitution and political backbones hold up. :cheers:


[Modified by RGGregory, 9:00 PM 12/29/2003]


[Modified by RGGregory, 9:05 PM 12/29/2003]


[Modified by RGGregory, 9:07 PM 12/29/2003]

 

That would be H82BFST. I mean, it's not like I do computer security for a living, or anything.

Wait...


:hat

 

Yeah, I talk to passengers. Shooting the poopie to pass driving time, not discussing National Security Plans. If I'm talking on my Cell Phone, it's easier for the "spy" to listen to me through my cellphone and get both ends of the conversation than through Onstar. Wouldn't you say?

Agreed, but I'm sure sensitive government vehicles would be on OnStar equipped or you boys would rip out the system anyways. It's a mute point. I am talking about the casual go citizen. Not everyone here is a Americian Super Spy.

Perhaps if he is so dedicated to break into all the complex systems as you put it just to rob my house, then I and my family are glad that we are not home. They could take whatever they want as it can all be replaced. My family and I can not. I guess you would rather die for your material things???

Ahh, so good to be young and make assumptions about others. I'll give you a hint, we drive the same color C5 w/ polished 5 spokes, we hold similar jobs and I agree with some of the stuff you say. But that's about where it ends. I don't have a naval ring nor am I military, etc. I'm just your average citizen which isn't paranoid about On-Star... yet. So far, you haven't given me any legit reasons to why the average Joe should run for the hills because OnStar is here.

 

Scissors, you are against OnStar because it is an invasion of your privacy, correct?

If you are so worried about your privacy, then why do you post everything down to the letter about you and your family on the web?

Not trying to be an butt here, but seriously, why would you fear someone locating you by OnStar when your location is posted by you on your own website, etc???


[Modified by H82BFST, 8:22 PM 12/29/2003]