Edelbrock E-Force?
Former user ID rcthmpsn
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 734
Likes: 15
From: St. Charles Mo
I see you paid the extra $800 for the crystal red metallic on your car. Do you think it costs an extra $800 to paint your car with CRM? Must be a price fixing scheme....you also paid nearly a grand for delivery charges on that car when the plant is only a couple hundred miles away from you. Do you realize the guy in Alaska who bought a new Corvette paid exactly the same delivery charge?..must be a price fixing scheme. I could go on and on here 
If the Edelbrock kit is not within your budget then you should move on and buy something else. Trying to bash a particular kit because someone won't "cut you a deal" really serves no purpose.
If the Edelbrock kit is not within your budget then you should move on and buy something else. Trying to bash a particular kit because someone won't "cut you a deal" really serves no purpose.
I did not pay $800 for paint. That was msrp. The dealer had the option to choose how much profit he needed to make to stay in business. The S in msrp stands for suggested, not set in stone. They took over $11,000 off the car. Contrary to Oldelbrock policy.
I'm pissed because a vendor offered to take a grand off then re****ed because Oldelbrock said he couldn't. You don't see problem with that? It has nothing to do with the product.
Last edited by Rich_562; May 1, 2011 at 12:50 AM.
Former user ID rcthmpsn
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 734
Likes: 15
From: St. Charles Mo
I want to add this, but didn't want to edit my previous post incase others already read it.
I really have no dog in this race. Edelbrock screwed me on their pricing for sure and I'll even make Helen Keller listen. But what really amazes me is if I was slamming A&A, ECS, your mom, donkey konk Jr, or whoever, they would be on here responding. Oldelbrock ain't. I'm not spelling it wrong by accident.
I really have no dog in this race. Edelbrock screwed me on their pricing for sure and I'll even make Helen Keller listen. But what really amazes me is if I was slamming A&A, ECS, your mom, donkey konk Jr, or whoever, they would be on here responding. Oldelbrock ain't. I'm not spelling it wrong by accident.
Last edited by Rich_562; May 1, 2011 at 01:03 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,753
Likes: 210
From: North Western Connecticut
try and buy a Mac (Apple) discounted... 
There are many other products price protected by the manufacture. I DO NOT agree with those draconian pricing schemes because I believe in the free market system! If however Edlebrock is over charging for their product eventually competition will force them to re-evaluate their pricing structure. They can protect all they want but if the perceived value isn't there they will not be selling many E-Force units! I thought their original pricing was a little expensive but believe they have really pushed the envelop with the new increases...
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,502
Likes: 82
Edelbrock runs a forum on their company website....probably didn't see it worth spending the time or $$$ over here. They've been in the business since 1938 so they probably know how best to spend their time. Give them a shout over there and lodge your complaint. Otherwise you are just pissing in the wind.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 5,169
Likes: 199
From: Your Sister's Bedroom
Edelbrock runs a forum on their company website....probably didn't see it worth spending the time or $$$ over here. They've been in the business since 1938 so they probably know how best to spend their time. Give them a shout over there and lodge your complaint. Otherwise you are just pissing in the wind.
For once I agree with you.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 648
Likes: 0
From: Kalamazoo MI
try and buy a Mac (Apple) discounted... There are many other products price protected by the manufacture. I DO NOT agree with those draconian pricing schemes because I believe in the free market system! If however Edlebrock is over charging for their product eventually competition will force them to re-evaluate their pricing structure. They can protect all they want but if the perceived value isn't there they will not be selling many E-Force units! I thought their original pricing was a little expensive but believe they have really pushed the envelop with the new increases... totally
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 41,732
Likes: 1,718
From: Springfield MO
While Edelbrock might be able to control the retail pricing on their superchargers, they can't control things like shipping or installation costs of the retailer to the customer.
Talk with different retailers. They might all have the same retail price on the E-force, but will cut you some slack on installation, etc. They might not be able to discount the supercharger by, say, $750, but they might discount the installation of the supercharger by, say, $750.
Talk with different retailers. They might all have the same retail price on the E-force, but will cut you some slack on installation, etc. They might not be able to discount the supercharger by, say, $750, but they might discount the installation of the supercharger by, say, $750.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,999
Likes: 1,685
From: Southeast TX
While Edelbrock might be able to control the retail pricing on their superchargers, they can't control things like shipping or installation costs of the retailer to the customer.
Talk with different retailers. They might all have the same retail price on the E-force, but will cut you some slack on installation, etc. They might not be able to discount the supercharger by, say, $750, but they might discount the installation of the supercharger by, say, $750.
Talk with different retailers. They might all have the same retail price on the E-force, but will cut you some slack on installation, etc. They might not be able to discount the supercharger by, say, $750, but they might discount the installation of the supercharger by, say, $750.
Pro
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 695
Likes: 19
Yeah but this sucks for those that only need the Eforce kit and want to install it themselves. Price fixing is BS, and definitely shines a negative light on Edelbrock.
Maybe I can find someone who would throw in the injectors/pulley/Z06 pump on the 1592 kit, or the cam. (I Was planning on a ZR1 cam).
Although, here's my "hair-brained" idea for the IAT issue.
Have Dewitt, or another performance radiator shop create a split radiator setup.
My turbocharged Protege has a less wide radiator and a vertical "side-mounted" intercooler that sits right next to it.
In a stock Protege this is all just one radiator. When my radiator started leaking, I bought an upgraded, much thicker, aluminum replacement from Ron Davis. I also replaced the stock SMIC with a much thicker all-aluminum one.
I didn't want to go with an FMIC because it would block the condenser and the A/C has a hard enough time keeping up with the AZ heat. Also, an FMIC and piping gives the turbo more volume to pressurize which would reduce throttle response. (Although FMIC owners say otherwise).
I am very happy with the result, and in the hottest weather and hardest driving, heat soak is greatly reduced, and the coolant temp never budges from 5 degrees below 50%.
I think the Corvette with the Edelbrock could benefit from a similar setup, with side by side radiators. One for the engine coolant and one for the E-force's.
Naturally, you would would not make them equal size, but bias greatly towards the engine. The optimal dimensions would take a little bit of math I suppose.
A fully custom setup like this wouldn't be cheap, I would think somewhere around a grand. However, this would be a very clean and professional way of going without putting reservoirs in the storage bins, removing the fog lights, using your AC to cool the SC's coolant, or the like.
I've got an eight week vacation coming up and although it will be 150 degrees in my garage, I'll have plenty of time to tinker.
BTW, for what it's worth Motorhead, I created my own "beehive" back in 2007 long before it was sold as a product. I used very rigid ABS plastic and used angle brackets and rivets to hold it together and weather stripping to seal it off. I gained over 1mph trap with it on vs it off. I also have the vette-air scoop, but never had any problems with bucking. It's been like that for four years.
Maybe I can find someone who would throw in the injectors/pulley/Z06 pump on the 1592 kit, or the cam. (I Was planning on a ZR1 cam).
Although, here's my "hair-brained" idea for the IAT issue.
Have Dewitt, or another performance radiator shop create a split radiator setup.
My turbocharged Protege has a less wide radiator and a vertical "side-mounted" intercooler that sits right next to it.
In a stock Protege this is all just one radiator. When my radiator started leaking, I bought an upgraded, much thicker, aluminum replacement from Ron Davis. I also replaced the stock SMIC with a much thicker all-aluminum one.
I didn't want to go with an FMIC because it would block the condenser and the A/C has a hard enough time keeping up with the AZ heat. Also, an FMIC and piping gives the turbo more volume to pressurize which would reduce throttle response. (Although FMIC owners say otherwise).
I am very happy with the result, and in the hottest weather and hardest driving, heat soak is greatly reduced, and the coolant temp never budges from 5 degrees below 50%.
I think the Corvette with the Edelbrock could benefit from a similar setup, with side by side radiators. One for the engine coolant and one for the E-force's.
Naturally, you would would not make them equal size, but bias greatly towards the engine. The optimal dimensions would take a little bit of math I suppose.
A fully custom setup like this wouldn't be cheap, I would think somewhere around a grand. However, this would be a very clean and professional way of going without putting reservoirs in the storage bins, removing the fog lights, using your AC to cool the SC's coolant, or the like.
I've got an eight week vacation coming up and although it will be 150 degrees in my garage, I'll have plenty of time to tinker.
BTW, for what it's worth Motorhead, I created my own "beehive" back in 2007 long before it was sold as a product. I used very rigid ABS plastic and used angle brackets and rivets to hold it together and weather stripping to seal it off. I gained over 1mph trap with it on vs it off. I also have the vette-air scoop, but never had any problems with bucking. It's been like that for four years.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,502
Likes: 82
Yeah but this sucks for those that only need the Eforce kit and want to install it themselves. Price fixing is BS, and definitely shines a negative light on Edelbrock.
Maybe I can find someone who would throw in the injectors/pulley/Z06 pump on the 1592 kit, or the cam. (I Was planning on a ZR1 cam).
Although, here's my "hair-brained" idea for the IAT issue.
Have Dewitt, or another performance radiator shop create a split radiator setup.
My turbocharged Protege has a less wide radiator and a vertical "side-mounted" intercooler that sits right next to it.
In a stock Protege this is all just one radiator. When my radiator started leaking, I bought an upgraded, much thicker, aluminum replacement from Ron Davis. I also replaced the stock SMIC with a much thicker all-aluminum one.
I didn't want to go with an FMIC because it would block the condenser and the A/C has a hard enough time keeping up with the AZ heat. Also, an FMIC and piping gives the turbo more volume to pressurize which would reduce throttle response. (Although FMIC owners say otherwise).
I am very happy with the result, and in the hottest weather and hardest driving, heat soak is greatly reduced, and the coolant temp never budges from 5 degrees below 50%.
I think the Corvette with the Edelbrock could benefit from a similar setup, with side by side radiators. One for the engine coolant and one for the E-force's.
Naturally, you would would not make them equal size, but bias greatly towards the engine. The optimal dimensions would take a little bit of math I suppose.
A fully custom setup like this wouldn't be cheap, I would think somewhere around a grand. However, this would be a very clean and professional way of going without putting reservoirs in the storage bins, removing the fog lights, using your AC to cool the SC's coolant, or the like.
I've got an eight week vacation coming up and although it will be 150 degrees in my garage, I'll have plenty of time to tinker.
BTW, for what it's worth Motorhead, I created my own "beehive" back in 2007 long before it was sold as a product. I used very rigid ABS plastic and used angle brackets and rivets to hold it together and weather stripping to seal it off. I gained over 1mph trap with it on vs it off. I also have the vette-air scoop, but never had any problems with bucking. It's been like that for four years.
Maybe I can find someone who would throw in the injectors/pulley/Z06 pump on the 1592 kit, or the cam. (I Was planning on a ZR1 cam).
Although, here's my "hair-brained" idea for the IAT issue.
Have Dewitt, or another performance radiator shop create a split radiator setup.
My turbocharged Protege has a less wide radiator and a vertical "side-mounted" intercooler that sits right next to it.
In a stock Protege this is all just one radiator. When my radiator started leaking, I bought an upgraded, much thicker, aluminum replacement from Ron Davis. I also replaced the stock SMIC with a much thicker all-aluminum one.
I didn't want to go with an FMIC because it would block the condenser and the A/C has a hard enough time keeping up with the AZ heat. Also, an FMIC and piping gives the turbo more volume to pressurize which would reduce throttle response. (Although FMIC owners say otherwise).
I am very happy with the result, and in the hottest weather and hardest driving, heat soak is greatly reduced, and the coolant temp never budges from 5 degrees below 50%.
I think the Corvette with the Edelbrock could benefit from a similar setup, with side by side radiators. One for the engine coolant and one for the E-force's.
Naturally, you would would not make them equal size, but bias greatly towards the engine. The optimal dimensions would take a little bit of math I suppose.
A fully custom setup like this wouldn't be cheap, I would think somewhere around a grand. However, this would be a very clean and professional way of going without putting reservoirs in the storage bins, removing the fog lights, using your AC to cool the SC's coolant, or the like.
I've got an eight week vacation coming up and although it will be 150 degrees in my garage, I'll have plenty of time to tinker.
BTW, for what it's worth Motorhead, I created my own "beehive" back in 2007 long before it was sold as a product. I used very rigid ABS plastic and used angle brackets and rivets to hold it together and weather stripping to seal it off. I gained over 1mph trap with it on vs it off. I also have the vette-air scoop, but never had any problems with bucking. It's been like that for four years.
The Vette-Air surge issue is germain to the more sensitive LS3 MAF.
Oh and I didn't claim to invent the Beehive...just claimed to have stumbled across the fact that the Halltech Beehive is a near direct fit on the Edelbrock.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 5,169
Likes: 199
From: Your Sister's Bedroom
If you do a search over on the ZR1 forum you'll find a company who is making larger heat exchangers for the ZR1. I talked with the guy briefly on a couple of occasions and he is interested in doing one for the Edelbrock. We never got to the point of me committing resources to have him fab one up though. My personal opinion is that the biggest gain would be from a larger HE with it's own fan.
The Vette-Air surge issue is germain to the more sensitive LS3 MAF.
Oh and I didn't claim to invent the Beehive...just claimed to have stumbled across the fact that the Halltech Beehive is a near direct fit on the Edelbrock.
The Vette-Air surge issue is germain to the more sensitive LS3 MAF.
Oh and I didn't claim to invent the Beehive...just claimed to have stumbled across the fact that the Halltech Beehive is a near direct fit on the Edelbrock.
Ill be putting one of those coolers on the e-force LS3 im currently working on as well.
Pro
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 695
Likes: 19
By chemical you mean, r134a? As in the killer chiller or something of that effect?
A larger H/E is not a band aid, it is properly sizing the H/E for the intended application.
Since the first time I ever drove a car in the winter I wondered about using the A/C to reduce intake charge temps, but for some reason it just seems like it is robbing Peter to pay Paul, eventually Peter is going to get pissed off.
As good as the A/C system is in the Vette compared to my other vehicles, it still struggles a bit on the hottest days out here. Cabin temps are around 145 in the middle of the summer if you leave your car in the sun.
The GT500 story is somewhat convincing though, but can we really believe those Mustang guys?
A larger H/E is not a band aid, it is properly sizing the H/E for the intended application.
Since the first time I ever drove a car in the winter I wondered about using the A/C to reduce intake charge temps, but for some reason it just seems like it is robbing Peter to pay Paul, eventually Peter is going to get pissed off.
As good as the A/C system is in the Vette compared to my other vehicles, it still struggles a bit on the hottest days out here. Cabin temps are around 145 in the middle of the summer if you leave your car in the sun.
The GT500 story is somewhat convincing though, but can we really believe those Mustang guys?
Team Owner
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 48,589
Likes: 245
From: In the woods so F%^$ O&&
St. Jude Donor '17-'18-'19
Larger heat exchanger, larger pump, and a 4 gallon capacity reservoir (able to take ice) is not a band aid I can tell you for sure. More to come on this.
Team Owner
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 48,589
Likes: 245
From: In the woods so F%^$ O&&
St. Jude Donor '17-'18-'19
By chemical you mean, r134a? As in the killer chiller or something of that effect?
A larger H/E is not a band aid, it is properly sizing the H/E for the intended application.
Since the first time I ever drove a car in the winter I wondered about using the A/C to reduce intake charge temps, but for some reason it just seems like it is robbing Peter to pay Paul, eventually Peter is going to get pissed off.
As good as the A/C system is in the Vette compared to my other vehicles, it still struggles a bit on the hottest days out here. Cabin temps are around 145 in the middle of the summer if you leave your car in the sun.
The GT500 story is somewhat convincing though, but can we really believe those Mustang guys?
A larger H/E is not a band aid, it is properly sizing the H/E for the intended application.
Since the first time I ever drove a car in the winter I wondered about using the A/C to reduce intake charge temps, but for some reason it just seems like it is robbing Peter to pay Paul, eventually Peter is going to get pissed off.
As good as the A/C system is in the Vette compared to my other vehicles, it still struggles a bit on the hottest days out here. Cabin temps are around 145 in the middle of the summer if you leave your car in the sun.
The GT500 story is somewhat convincing though, but can we really believe those Mustang guys?
He is talking Meth.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,502
Likes: 82
Larger reservoir...forgot which part number it is...
And there are many options on the larger heat exchanger...if you can stuff a huge air-to-air intercooler up front (centri) you could certainly do the same with an air-to-water setup!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,999
Likes: 1,685
From: Southeast TX
Just one more opinion on this. I think you'd have to be completely nuts to hack into your a/c system to try to get a few degrees cooler on your IAT's. It is what it is. Try to make it something it isn't and you're going to spend big bucks and probably be disappointed. Even if it works as advertised (doubtful), you still have a system that's limited. It's dead nuts great at the power/boost levels that it was designed for. Use it there or find a system that's better suited for your goals. Or.....you can always beat your head against a wall.....repeatedly
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 5,169
Likes: 199
From: Your Sister's Bedroom
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 5,169
Likes: 199
From: Your Sister's Bedroom
Just one more opinion on this. I think you'd have to be completely nuts to hack into your a/c system to try to get a few degrees cooler on your IAT's. It is what it is. Try to make it something it isn't and you're going to spend big bucks and probably be disappointed. Even if it works as advertised (doubtful), you still have a system that's limited. It's dead nuts great at the power/boost levels that it was designed for. Use it there or find a system that's better suited for your goals. Or.....you can always beat your head against a wall.....repeatedly
Last edited by breecher_7; May 26, 2011 at 10:11 PM.
Former user ID rcthmpsn
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 734
Likes: 15
From: St. Charles Mo
Haven't been keeping up lately since you taught me centri was the only system worth running. Bought one by the way. Are you playing with an eforce?