Valve Ping with Edelbrock E Force
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 7,821
Likes: 412
From: Montreal
St. Jude Donor '13
After my cats went bad I put ARH headers and high flow cats. No issues so far but if they do screw up I willl just gut them and be done with it. We dont have emission testing yet but if you gut them it looks like you still have cats rather than just removing them and making it obvious you dont.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 327
Likes: 22
From: Ligonier PA
I believe they plug into the infamous OB-II port and ask the computer to tell them how clean the car is running. Tailpipe sniffing went out quite a while ago in PA I think.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 7,821
Likes: 412
From: Montreal
St. Jude Donor '13
Doesnt make sense. Once you get it right you will love it. Did the cats check out ok? There has to be a simple explanation. Who is checking the car for you?
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 327
Likes: 22
From: Ligonier PA
I mentioned the possibility of the cats being clogged but they didn't seem to have any interest in pulling the exhaust and checking them out. Truthfully, I don't think it is the cats as my detonation is at 3,000 to 4,200 rpm under very light acceleration. If I jump on it, it runs great, no valve rattle, no detonation, no pinging. I just get this feeling I am melting down a piston every mile I drive. And yes I have the Edelbrock warranty but who wants to have their car in the shop for a month while they re-build the motor in SWPA where we only get six to seven months to drive the car.
I did find out today that they do not have the HPTuner or EFILive software that would allow them to actually log data and send it off the Edelbrock. They are only able to take a "snapshot" of the tune when it is detonating and have been sending this to Edelbrock. Obviously with no success as I have had four tunes in the car in the last three weeks.
I priced EFILive and found it for $349, just for the data logging part and am considering buying it and taking it out to them to get this thing right.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 7,821
Likes: 412
From: Montreal
St. Jude Donor '13
I guess its a good thing they will warranty it because to me it sounds like an install/tune issue. I doubt they have experience with the unit and logs would make it much easier for them to get help from edelbrock. I wish you luck and keep us posted.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 327
Likes: 22
From: Ligonier PA
Ok guys. Tune 5 loaded today, we are 95% there. Was still able to get her to detonate but very hard to make it happen. Have found out that we now will have the ability to log data rather than "snapshot" data so honing in on this tune should get easier now. I'll be taking her back again to the installer and having them log data and send it off to Chris at Edelbrock for yet another but perhaps the last revision.
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Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 327
Likes: 22
From: Ligonier PA
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,022
Likes: 18
From: Tampa FL (formerly Justinjor)
Tech Contributor
St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13-'14
Well, IMO, "canned" tunes are garbage anyway--there are far too many variables for a 1 tune fits all kind of deal--we're not talking about baseball caps here. Every car is different.
Mail order tunes can be effective as they can be catered to your specific mods, but canned tunes aren't good imo. I'd personally never run one and its a bummer that you're forced to in order to retain your warranty...at least they're taking care of it for you so that's a good thing.
I'd bet your fueling was way off at the meat of your torque curve(where you're seeing the detonation) and they're having to richen it up to have it run smoothly.
Mail order tunes can be effective as they can be catered to your specific mods, but canned tunes aren't good imo. I'd personally never run one and its a bummer that you're forced to in order to retain your warranty...at least they're taking care of it for you so that's a good thing.
I'd bet your fueling was way off at the meat of your torque curve(where you're seeing the detonation) and they're having to richen it up to have it run smoothly.
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,502
Likes: 82
100% of the Corvette inventory that comes off the assembly line is delivered with a “canned tune”. Why does it work for GM? Because you build a calibration for a given configuration. If you step outside that configuration, then the calibration has to change to match the config change. There are hundreds of these superchargers on the road running that Edelbrock calibration without issue.
In this specific case, I’m inclined to believe they are tuning around some other issue with this car but lack the expertise to troubleshoot properly at his installer.
In this specific case, I’m inclined to believe they are tuning around some other issue with this car but lack the expertise to troubleshoot properly at his installer.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 327
Likes: 22
From: Ligonier PA
100% of the Corvette inventory that comes off the assembly line is delivered with a “canned tune”. Why does it work for GM? Because you build a calibration for a given configuration. If you step outside that configuration, then the calibration has to change to match the config change. There are hundreds of these superchargers on the road running that Edelbrock calibration without issue.
In this specific case, I’m inclined to believe they are tuning around some other issue with this car but lack the expertise to troubleshoot properly at his installer.
In this specific case, I’m inclined to believe they are tuning around some other issue with this car but lack the expertise to troubleshoot properly at his installer.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 7,821
Likes: 412
From: Montreal
St. Jude Donor '13
A strange coincidence. I was at my tuners today and he was telling me about a camaro that came in yesterday. It had an eforce installed by the dealer and the customer was not happy with the way it ran or power produced. Edelbrock sent him to my guy as he's the nearest eforce installer. Bottom line. The canned tune was so bad he started from scratch and got 100 HP more and the car ran great. I mentioned this thread and my guy said the car was pinging badly at mid range rpms. Sounds a bit like what you have going on. It seems they may be having problems with the canned tune.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 327
Likes: 22
From: Ligonier PA
Well, tune 6 is in the car and it is running very well. I cannot get the car to detonate, seems fine now. I have asked the installer if we can get a dyno done now that the obvious tune issues are behind us and am waiting for a response. Kinda of a different situation as they "rent" time off of a local tech school for the dyno.
Former Vendor
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,045
Likes: 3
From: Bridgewater Ma
A strange coincidence. I was at my tuners today and he was telling me about a camaro that came in yesterday. It had an eforce installed by the dealer and the customer was not happy with the way it ran or power produced. Edelbrock sent him to my guy as he's the nearest eforce installer. Bottom line. The canned tune was so bad he started from scratch and got 100 HP more and the car ran great. I mentioned this thread and my guy said the car was pinging badly at mid range rpms. Sounds a bit like what you have going on. It seems they may be having problems with the canned tune.
The first correct fix is when the problem happened, Edelbrock should have a list of good tuners out there to fix the car on the spot, not **** in the wind and send files "hoping" the motor doesn't fail while "testing".
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,391
Likes: 23
From: Santa Barbara CA
We have gotten 3 cars like this. It's pretty dangerous.
The first correct fix is when the problem happened, Edelbrock should have a list of good tuners out there to fix the car on the spot, not **** in the wind and send files "hoping" the motor doesn't fail while "testing".
The first correct fix is when the problem happened, Edelbrock should have a list of good tuners out there to fix the car on the spot, not **** in the wind and send files "hoping" the motor doesn't fail while "testing".
Heel & Toe
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 21
Likes: 1
From: edmonds washington
Edelbrocks tune is a joke
I am a tuner in Seattle. I tried the tune that came with the eforce kit and had some major issues. The car would die when pressing in the clutch at a stop light and it would die when cold on startup. Their tune had very bad MAF/VE calibration and also the timing was about 10-15 degrees too low at WOT and was lacking over 100hp at the wheels. this was all tested with a new dynapack dyno and tuned with HP tuners. This supercharger is great but the software they developed was only a starting point. anyone with this supercharger needs a dyno tune for better drivability and power.
That's why I planned my install with a dyno tune included.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 327
Likes: 22
From: Ligonier PA
Well, tune 6 is in the car and it is running very well. I cannot get the car to detonate, seems fine now. I have asked the installer if we can get a dyno done now that the obvious tune issues are behind us and am waiting for a response. Kinda of a different situation as they "rent" time off of a local tech school for the dyno.
The bad news is I was able to get a detonation out of her at 2,800 RPM, loading the engine going up hill in 4th, very light pedal pressure.
I have read alot about IAT (Intake Air Temperature) and am wondering if the fact that it was 90 and humid could have been attributed to the engine detonation?
I am going to inform the dealership today and see what they have up their sleeve next. I am also going to start a new thread looking for an Edelbrock tuner in my area with a dyno to get this thing right, warranty or no warranty.
