Post Your Dyno Results Here:
Race Director
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 12,375
Likes: 406
From: Florida
This is adressed generally to the aftermarket vendors:
1. It is VERY poor form to squabble in front of your customers. It is the fastest way I can think of to lose sales and credibility.
2. You need to be aware that, from the customer's perspective, there is a lot of hype and plain inaccurate info swirling around when it comes to C6 mods. Perhaps this reflects the new platform and the more complex programming, but it does little to inspire confidence in the aftermarket. That, coupled with the fact that most of you charge a pretty hefty fee for Corvette bolt-ons, causes people to be cautious. Most of what is sold for Vettes is ridiculously overpriced relative to similar products for the LS engines on cheaper platforms.
3. You are victims of your own hype. I see ads for the three main header systems touting 30-40 HP increases. I also see airbox vendors claiming 20HP from their mod alone. Those claims just don't add up, based on dyno results: people are systematically seeing only 30-35HP from airboxes plus headers PLUS a tune. At the prices being charged for these products and services, that's a total of $2,500 minimum, or $71 per horse. Now, if I were expecting that it might be OK. But if I got into that project expecting 45-55 HP from these mods, I'd be furious with the results. Please don't respond that the numbers are not meant to be additive. I have done PLENTY of modding in the past, and I know how this stuff works.
4. The info gets even more contradictory when you start calling individual shops. One vendor claimed their headers, designed for the LS2, got 40 RWHP on the new LS-7. Another vendor selling the same size headers (different brand, also for LS2), said theirs didn't even fit the ports properly. A third vendor who tried swapping a third brand on, got ZERO gains. All three brands dynoed within 5 RWHP of each other on forum members' LS2s. Interestingly, one of the vendors has stock Z06 manifold take-offs lying around his shop, but refuses to sell them. Wonder why?
5. Today, I tried calling around on programming. One vendor said no problems, no ECU locks, my choice. Another said brand X (a popular one) was riddled with problems and was a ticking time bomb, legally, due to the TM programming. A third, specializing in dyno services, flat refused to sell or recommend ANY tuning at this time because, according to them, C6 tuning is in its infancy and is nowhere ready for release. I can only guess at the confusion on the 2006, all-new ECU.
I realize vendors have to earn a living, and we Corvette owners are excited to have a choice of your products, but you folks should not be surprised to get tough questions, at these prices, on a public forum.
1. It is VERY poor form to squabble in front of your customers. It is the fastest way I can think of to lose sales and credibility.
2. You need to be aware that, from the customer's perspective, there is a lot of hype and plain inaccurate info swirling around when it comes to C6 mods. Perhaps this reflects the new platform and the more complex programming, but it does little to inspire confidence in the aftermarket. That, coupled with the fact that most of you charge a pretty hefty fee for Corvette bolt-ons, causes people to be cautious. Most of what is sold for Vettes is ridiculously overpriced relative to similar products for the LS engines on cheaper platforms.
3. You are victims of your own hype. I see ads for the three main header systems touting 30-40 HP increases. I also see airbox vendors claiming 20HP from their mod alone. Those claims just don't add up, based on dyno results: people are systematically seeing only 30-35HP from airboxes plus headers PLUS a tune. At the prices being charged for these products and services, that's a total of $2,500 minimum, or $71 per horse. Now, if I were expecting that it might be OK. But if I got into that project expecting 45-55 HP from these mods, I'd be furious with the results. Please don't respond that the numbers are not meant to be additive. I have done PLENTY of modding in the past, and I know how this stuff works.
4. The info gets even more contradictory when you start calling individual shops. One vendor claimed their headers, designed for the LS2, got 40 RWHP on the new LS-7. Another vendor selling the same size headers (different brand, also for LS2), said theirs didn't even fit the ports properly. A third vendor who tried swapping a third brand on, got ZERO gains. All three brands dynoed within 5 RWHP of each other on forum members' LS2s. Interestingly, one of the vendors has stock Z06 manifold take-offs lying around his shop, but refuses to sell them. Wonder why?
5. Today, I tried calling around on programming. One vendor said no problems, no ECU locks, my choice. Another said brand X (a popular one) was riddled with problems and was a ticking time bomb, legally, due to the TM programming. A third, specializing in dyno services, flat refused to sell or recommend ANY tuning at this time because, according to them, C6 tuning is in its infancy and is nowhere ready for release. I can only guess at the confusion on the 2006, all-new ECU.
I realize vendors have to earn a living, and we Corvette owners are excited to have a choice of your products, but you folks should not be surprised to get tough questions, at these prices, on a public forum.
Last edited by TTRotary; Oct 21, 2005 at 06:54 PM.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,131
Likes: 0
From: Dallas Texas
Originally Posted by jimman
So your getting 19 rwtq over Halltech with the LPE without a tune is that what your claiming????
My chart shows the progression of my car from stock until now. Read my other posts if you want the details.
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 219
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by midnite902
Maybe you should spend the time improving your product rather than trying to put up a smoke screen and discredit customers that have posted thier Dyno results?
My father told me "You can judge a man by the value he puts in his own word". I think it was sound advice. To quote a line from one of my favorite movies "You have been measured and found wanting"
However I do want to express my thanks, my Halltech tunnel did make an excellent drainspout extension whereby rain water is now directed away from my patio. I am sure no C6 intake would flow rainwater like your tunnel
Don't beleive me? I will post pics if you like?
My father told me "You can judge a man by the value he puts in his own word". I think it was sound advice. To quote a line from one of my favorite movies "You have been measured and found wanting"
However I do want to express my thanks, my Halltech tunnel did make an excellent drainspout extension whereby rain water is now directed away from my patio. I am sure no C6 intake would flow rainwater like your tunnel
Don't beleive me? I will post pics if you like?
Not here !
Supporting Vendor
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 13,099
Likes: 672
From: Bristol, Tennessee
St. Jude Donor '09
Originally Posted by Ed@Lingenfelter
Well well, what do we have here? Jim Hall and Jimman singing the same song yet again?? when are you two going to get it through your heads that we do not put out fake dyno numbers??
The results of our C6 intake system have been posted over and over again by MEMBERS, not LPE or 21st Century.If you don't agree with it, that's your business, but you are both way out of line following every thread, and accusing LPE of posting fake numbers, and it needs to stop. We don't ever post anything negative about you or your products, we only say that ours is better.
Jim Hall, feel free to call me directly at 260-724-2552 ext 1002 if you would like to discuss this, I'll be waiting for your call.
Ed
The results of our C6 intake system have been posted over and over again by MEMBERS, not LPE or 21st Century.If you don't agree with it, that's your business, but you are both way out of line following every thread, and accusing LPE of posting fake numbers, and it needs to stop. We don't ever post anything negative about you or your products, we only say that ours is better.
Jim Hall, feel free to call me directly at 260-724-2552 ext 1002 if you would like to discuss this, I'll be waiting for your call.
Ed
I apologize publically for getting you upset, that was not my intention here. Most customers can draw there own conclusions from the dynos that have been posted by your customers without vendor intervention.
I have asked for the Run Files in question since they first appeared, and would like to see them. Email me at jim@corvetteC5.com
You can say what you like about Jimman. He is no friend of Halltech. I have not and will not sell anything to him since he started the hydrolock BS back in 2000 when he claimed that our TRIC caused his motor to lock up. Look it up in the archives or ask Troy or one of the other moderators.
Jimman is not a plant for Halltech, does not work for Halltech, is not my friend, associate, customer, and I cannot control his posts, and nor can you. You should log your complaint with Troy not air it pubically. There are hundreds of forum members that know him from dyno days, and other functions.
There are many folks here that know who he is, and who I am. In fact, I refused to sell him a Stinger because of his attitude toward Halltech. and my guess that he would start the hydrolock questioning all over again.
I deleted my question to Mr. Midnight, and apologize for asking any questions about his results.
Jim Hall
Last edited by Halltech; Oct 21, 2005 at 08:48 PM.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,131
Likes: 0
From: Dallas Texas
Originally Posted by Bumpstick
This sounds like some one with an ax to grind. Whats up with your posts. I never come on to a forum and run some one down like you do. Jimman has allways had good input. Jim Hall at Halltech has allways ben streight and upfrount with every one on this forum. I belive you need to take your toy and go home and play. Not here !
Not here !If you are asking me to be a "woosie boy" and allow myself to be pushed around, you have the wrong guy.
Someone pushs on me, I will push back. If they want me to stop all they have to do is stop When people are civil with me I will be civil with them.
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 219
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by midnite902
You have your opinion, as I have mine. I am proud of my dyno results and I posted them here with no commentary.
If you are asking me to be a "woosie boy" and allow myself to be pushed around, you have the wrong guy. Someone pushs on me, I will push back. If they want me to stop all they have to do is stop When people are civil with me I will be civil with them.
If you are asking me to be a "woosie boy" and allow myself to be pushed around, you have the wrong guy.
Someone pushs on me, I will push back. If they want me to stop all they have to do is stop When people are civil with me I will be civil with them. 
There There isnt that a little better. 
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,259
Likes: 16
From: Monroe Township New Jersey
St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
St. Jude donor in memory of jpee '14
Originally Posted by yell03
Tommy -
I am going to leave it in "D" and just jam the pedal and GO!
I will try doing what you said as for the Traction Control.
The 1st couple runs I will do Competition Driving Mode just to see how the track is, I don't want a little wiggle to turn in to a costly error on a slick track.
How did the supercharged auto run???
Howard
I am going to leave it in "D" and just jam the pedal and GO!
I will try doing what you said as for the Traction Control.
The 1st couple runs I will do Competition Driving Mode just to see how the track is, I don't want a little wiggle to turn in to a costly error on a slick track.
How did the supercharged auto run???
Howard
Almost as fast as my little white mustang. He ran 11.57 @119 with drag radials. East Coast Superchargers did the work...... intercooled, headers, 3.42 gears, hi stall converter, 54 lb injectors & custom tune (otherwise stock motor & trans) It was his first run with the charger
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,259
Likes: 16
From: Monroe Township New Jersey
St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
St. Jude donor in memory of jpee '14
Originally Posted by jschindler
Yeah, I'll probably run a 13.something and never be seen again on the forum....
Jim,
Unfortunately, that is what a whole bunch of us (bone stock) guys are running
You have the advantage of having more
"seat time" than most of us. I am positive that there is a lower bone stock ET out there, just waiting to happen. 
Team Owner
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 26,714
Likes: 344
From: Houston, TX
Originally Posted by Tommy D
Jim,
Unfortunately, that is what a whole bunch of us (bone stock) guys are running
You have the advantage of having more "seat time" than most of us. I am positive that there is a lower bone stock ET out there, just waiting to happen.
Unfortunately, that is what a whole bunch of us (bone stock) guys are running
You have the advantage of having more
"seat time" than most of us. I am positive that there is a lower bone stock ET out there, just waiting to happen. I first drag raced four years ago - at the age of 48! I have only been to the track once or twice a year in the past two years. I think I have drag raced a total of about 7 or 8 times.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,259
Likes: 16
From: Monroe Township New Jersey
St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
St. Jude donor in memory of jpee '14
Originally Posted by TTRotary
This is adressed generally to the aftermarket vendors:
1. It is VERY poor form to squabble in front of your customers. It is the fastest way I can think of to lose sales and credibility.
2. You need to be aware that, from the customer's perspective, there is a lot of hype and plain inaccurate info swirling around when it comes to C6 mods. Perhaps this reflects the new platform and the more complex programming, but it does little to inspire confidence in the aftermarket. That, coupled with the fact that most of you charge a pretty hefty fee for Corvette bolt-ons, causes people to be cautious. Most of what is sold for Vettes is ridiculously overpriced relative to similar products for the LS engines on cheaper platforms.
3. You are victims of your own hype. I see ads for the three main header systems touting 30-40 HP increases. I also see airbox vendors claiming 20HP from their mod alone. Those claims just don't add up, based on dyno results: people are systematically seeing only 30-35HP from airboxes plus headers PLUS a tune. At the prices being charged for these products and services, that's a total of $2,500 minimum, or $71 per horse. Now, if I were expecting that it might be OK. But if I got into that project expecting 45-55 HP from these mods, I'd be furious with the results. Please don't respond that the numbers are not meant to be additive. I have done PLENTY of modding in the past, and I know how this stuff works.
4. The info gets even more contradictory when you start calling individual shops. One vendor claimed their headers, designed for the LS2, got 40 RWHP on the new LS-7. Another vendor selling the same size headers (different brand, also for LS2), said theirs didn't even fit the ports properly. A third vendor who tried swapping a third brand on, got ZERO gains. All three brands dynoed within 5 RWHP of each other on forum members' LS2s. Interestingly, one of the vendors has stock Z06 manifold take-offs lying around his shop, but refuses to sell them. Wonder why?
5. Today, I tried calling around on programming. One vendor said no problems, no ECU locks, my choice. Another said brand X (a popular one) was riddled with problems and was a ticking time bomb, legally, due to the TM programming. A third, specializing in dyno services, flat refused to sell or recommend ANY tuning at this time because, according to them, C6 tuning is in its infancy and is nowhere ready for release. I can only guess at the confusion on the 2006, all-new ECU.
I realize vendors have to earn a living, and we Corvette owners are excited to have a choice of your products, but you folks should not be surprised to get tough questions, at these prices, on a public forum.
1. It is VERY poor form to squabble in front of your customers. It is the fastest way I can think of to lose sales and credibility.
2. You need to be aware that, from the customer's perspective, there is a lot of hype and plain inaccurate info swirling around when it comes to C6 mods. Perhaps this reflects the new platform and the more complex programming, but it does little to inspire confidence in the aftermarket. That, coupled with the fact that most of you charge a pretty hefty fee for Corvette bolt-ons, causes people to be cautious. Most of what is sold for Vettes is ridiculously overpriced relative to similar products for the LS engines on cheaper platforms.
3. You are victims of your own hype. I see ads for the three main header systems touting 30-40 HP increases. I also see airbox vendors claiming 20HP from their mod alone. Those claims just don't add up, based on dyno results: people are systematically seeing only 30-35HP from airboxes plus headers PLUS a tune. At the prices being charged for these products and services, that's a total of $2,500 minimum, or $71 per horse. Now, if I were expecting that it might be OK. But if I got into that project expecting 45-55 HP from these mods, I'd be furious with the results. Please don't respond that the numbers are not meant to be additive. I have done PLENTY of modding in the past, and I know how this stuff works.
4. The info gets even more contradictory when you start calling individual shops. One vendor claimed their headers, designed for the LS2, got 40 RWHP on the new LS-7. Another vendor selling the same size headers (different brand, also for LS2), said theirs didn't even fit the ports properly. A third vendor who tried swapping a third brand on, got ZERO gains. All three brands dynoed within 5 RWHP of each other on forum members' LS2s. Interestingly, one of the vendors has stock Z06 manifold take-offs lying around his shop, but refuses to sell them. Wonder why?
5. Today, I tried calling around on programming. One vendor said no problems, no ECU locks, my choice. Another said brand X (a popular one) was riddled with problems and was a ticking time bomb, legally, due to the TM programming. A third, specializing in dyno services, flat refused to sell or recommend ANY tuning at this time because, according to them, C6 tuning is in its infancy and is nowhere ready for release. I can only guess at the confusion on the 2006, all-new ECU.
I realize vendors have to earn a living, and we Corvette owners are excited to have a choice of your products, but you folks should not be surprised to get tough questions, at these prices, on a public forum.
I absoutely agree. Very well written post.
If the aftermarket vendors want to make claims with regard to how good their product is...... then its time to put up or shut up! As I have previously suggested. "Why not have one of the Corvette mags run a comparison among all the cold air intakes. Use a stock Vette, run a baseline dyno and then install each manufacturers CAI. Lets keep the conditions the same and then repeat the test. Rules can be established for the manner in which the testing will be conducted so that it is fair. No more name calling & etc. I am sure there will be pros & cons to each system, so its a win-win situation for all. Moreover, all the forum members will get the dyno information they have been looking for."
The aforementioned was totally ignored, you vendors rather resort to arguing & etc.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,259
Likes: 16
From: Monroe Township New Jersey
St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
St. Jude donor in memory of jpee '14
Originally Posted by jschindler
You might be surprised at my track time. I know I've posted this before, but for those who have not seen it...
I first drag raced four years ago - at the age of 48! I have only been to the track once or twice a year in the past two years. I think I have drag raced a total of about 7 or 8 times.
I first drag raced four years ago - at the age of 48! I have only been to the track once or twice a year in the past two years. I think I have drag raced a total of about 7 or 8 times.
Unfortunately, I turn wrenches much better than I drag race
and so much for my theory about "seat time"
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,769
Likes: 0
From: SFV CA
Originally Posted by chemdry2
528 rwhp 515 rwhp on the motor n/a. Now adding a 175 shot of nos.
andy at a@a is the man. Was his car. Crazy fast.
andy at a@a is the man. Was his car. Crazy fast.
Pls post a picture
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,131
Likes: 0
From: Dallas Texas
Originally Posted by Tommy D
Unfortunately, I turn wrenches much better than I drag race and so much for my theory about "seat time"
and so much for my theory about "seat time" 
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,131
Likes: 0
From: Dallas Texas
Originally Posted by TTRotary
5. Today, I tried calling around on programming. One vendor said no problems, no ECU locks, my choice. Another said brand X (a popular one) was riddled with problems and was a ticking time bomb, legally, due to the TM programming. A third, specializing in dyno services, flat refused to sell or recommend ANY tuning at this time because, according to them, C6 tuning is in its infancy and is nowhere ready for release. I can only guess at the confusion on the 2006, all-new ECU.
I would advise everyone talk to their tuner and make the decisions. I am hesistant to "advertise" my car as a tuned car because I had so little done to it compared To Jeremy at Fasterproms all out tune. I read some of the things they are doing to get response and they are pulling every once of hp out of these "stock" motors.
I am not implie it is bad, just agreeing it is confusing
Administrator
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 67,460
Likes: 1,974
From: Chattanooga, TN
CI 2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12
Wounded Warrior Escort '11
St. Jude Donor '03 thru '26
NCM Lifetime Member
NCM Sinkhole Donor
Please take the pissin’ match to PMs or e-mail.
Jim Hall, midnite902, Ed@Lingenfelter, jimman & bumpstick: You have mail.
Jim Hall, midnite902, Ed@Lingenfelter, jimman & bumpstick: You have mail.