C5 Vrs C6 Numerically
Go big or don't go...
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,569
Likes: 1
From: Georgetown TX
FYI - I was just posting a scientific method for numerical data-analysis.
I don't really care what the 1/4mile time is for the stock C6 vs the C5. The C6 is detuned stock anyway; but as you said the numbers speak for themselves; in 1/4 it's pass/fail.
Frankly, tranny/rear-end wasn't designed to deal with the 400hp/LS2 very well.
JK
I don't really care what the 1/4mile time is for the stock C6 vs the C5. The C6 is detuned stock anyway; but as you said the numbers speak for themselves; in 1/4 it's pass/fail.
Frankly, tranny/rear-end wasn't designed to deal with the 400hp/LS2 very well.
JK
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 767
Likes: 6
From: near Spokane WA
I've always thought that for the same weight (approx 3300 lbs), add 50 hp = approx .5 sec improvement in e.t., add 100 hp = approx 1.0 sec. improvement. Basically -.1 sec per +10 HP.
So maybe the C6 isn't getting the full benefit of the +50 HP, or maybe the formula for drag racing I've held sacred for all these years is not accurate.
So maybe the C6 isn't getting the full benefit of the +50 HP, or maybe the formula for drag racing I've held sacred for all these years is not accurate.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 38,314
Likes: 35
Originally Posted by laron
THE WAY I DID IT WITH MN6 VRS MN6 THERE IS ONLY A 3.1 TENTH DIFFERANCE BETWEEN YOUR C6 AND THE C5...
THAT WOULD BE ROUNDED TO 3 TENTHS PLAIN AND SIMPLE..
ILL GIVE YOU 3 TENTHS AND ROUND THE 2.63 TO 3 MPH..
EIGHTER WAY IT'S STILL ONLY 3 TENTHS AND 3 MPH DIFFERANCE BETWWEN A C5 MN6 AND C6 MN6...
A C5 CAN CLOSE THAT GAP WITH A VARARAM...
YOU GUYS ARE ALWAYS LIKE THE C6 WILL DO THIS AND THE C6 WILL DO THAT...
WHAT EVER MAN...
WHAT THE C6 DID DO IS ONLY BEAT THE C5 BY
3.53 TENTHS AND 2.73 (YOUR WAY) MPH...
THATS PRETTY SAD...
9 YEARS LATER AND YOU GET A 3 TENTH AND 3 MPH ADVATAGE?????
AND THEN YOU WANT TO COMPARE IT TO A C5Z06????
DO YOU REALIZE THAT EVEN IF SOME ONE GETS A 12.2 IN A C6...
YOU'LL ONLY BE 4 TENTHS QUICKER THAN THE FASTEST C5'S.....AND STILL 5 TENTHS SLOWER THAN THE FASTEST C5Z06.....THATS RIGHT..EVEN IF YOU GUYS DO BEAT YOUR 12.4 AND GET A 12.2..
you will STILL be closer to C5 performance than C6.......Why so much denial.......this has already proven how small the 3 tenth and 3 mph gap is....your record of 12.4 vrs our record of 12.6 has already proven how small the gap is as well....RIGHT NOW YOUR QUICKEST STOCK C6 OF 12.4 IS GONNA NEED A SHOT OF NOS TO RUN THE 11.7 THE QUICKEST C5Z06 HAS RUN....BUT EVEN WITH ALL THE FACTS YOU STILL CLAIM THAT A C5 IS NONTHING COMPARED TO THE C6 AND THAT YOU CAN HANG WITH THE C5Z???????????
The hole reason this has even started is all because of this....
The mn6 C5 was advertised through GM and all the different magazines to run 13.0-13.3 at 107-109 mph....
And it always has done exactlt what was claimed....every week we have someone run in this exact range..
And once or twice a month we have people trapping 110 or 111 and running 12.8-13.0....
It has performed exactly as promised..
I was very excited about the C6 when I first read the specs..
All the mags were saying around12.6 at 114 mph!!!!!!!!
I was gonna trade my C5 in for one...
Then one day at the grocery store I was reading a GM magazine that had ran the C6...
These are the magazines that get 12.9's out of camaros so I couldnt wait to see what they got out of the C6....
No matter what they did they couldnt beat a 13.1 at 109 mph...
And they quoted ( these are stock C5 times)
They removed the TM and went back to the same track and ran a 12.4 at 114 mph.....
Thats all they did was remove the TM....!!!!!! Like unleashing a Demon they said...
Till after 3-4 passes the rear end broke and they said now they know why GM put in so much TM....
So they through in a stronger rear end and did like 1-2 mods and were running 11's no problem...
After reading this I went to your section here and started reading what they were turning at the strip....13.0-13.3 AT 108-110 WAS WHAT i SAW
AND YOU GUYS HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE NOT POSTING THERE LOW TO MID 13'S ON YOUR LIST..
CAS MOST OF THE TIME THATS ALL I SEE...
WHERES YOUR 13.6 BTW EB2003?????
I WASNT ASHAMED TO POST MY 13.5........
The C5 has always given us exactly what was promised..Low 13's at 107-109 mph...
You C6 guys are not all running 12.6 at 114 mph...
Most of you can hardly trapp 110....
Take a look at your list of 9 C6's.....
These 9 C6's represent your creme of the crop for speed..
Now look at the mph's...
5 of the 9 are trapping 108-111 mph.......
COME ON MAN!!!!!!
5 OF YOUR 9 TOP DOG C6'S ARE TRAPPING 3-6 MPH UNDER WHAT WAS CLAIMED BY THE MAGS AND GM....
( OH AND NOW YOUR PROBALY GONNA WANT TO BREAK THEM DOWN INTO TRANSMISSION CLASSES TO TRY TO MAKE YOUR NUMBERS NOT LOOK SO BAD COMPARED TO A C5Z06?????)
NOW LOOK AT THE C5'S..
Quite a few of the 1-2 mph over what was claimed...
IVE SAID IT A THOUSAND TIMES AND ILL SAY IT AGAIN...
IF I KNEW THAT THE AVERAGE C6 COULD RUN A 12.6 AT 114 MPH ID HAVE ONE....
THATS WHAT THEY WERE SUPPOSSED TO RUN?????
BUT IT TURNS OUT THAT IF YOUR C6 GETS ANYWERE NEAR 114 MPH YOUVE GOT ONE OF THE QUICKER ONES IN THE COUNTRY...
BUT THE AVERAGE C6 IS RUNNING A 13.0 AT 110 AND THE AVERAGE C5 IS RUNNING A 13.3 AT 107...
3 TENTHS AND 3 MPH IS NOT WORTH THE CHANGE TO ME...
A 5 MPH AND 5 TENTH DIFFERANCE LIKE WAS ADVERTISED WOULD HAVE MADE ME MAKE THE JUMP....
So far weve both proven that the differance isnt even a full 3 mph..
It's only like 2.7
How can a car that was suppossed to hit 114 only be 2.7 mph ahead of a car that was suppossed to hit 109????
SIMPLE...they blew the numbers up and gave the first C6's that got tested to unsuspecting car magazines with no tourque management....
Once the TM was put in the REAL production cars your one lucky SOB if you run a 12.8 at 112.....
As far as the C6 running or beating a Z06...
It could happen...
The TM dosent affect the car when it's acceleratin...
Only between shifts or while launching...
So if it's a short race wirth say only 1 shift...The TM will not be able to take it's toll the way it dose off launch at the track and going from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to third....
Then you'd be comparing a 345 rwhp 3250 pound car against a 355 rwhp 3150 pound car...
ACHOTS ( street meaning drag strip of course
)
But if there are a few shifts involved or ESPECIALY for the launch it's an easy kill for the C5Z.
If the C5 being close to the C6 in performance really up sets you that bad just go trade it in and get a C5Z06...
YOU'LL NEVER HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE C5 BEING CLOSE IN PERFORMANCE AGAIN....AN 11.8 UTTERLY DESTROYS A 12.6...( OR 12.4) FOR THAT MATTER.
12.4
-but are rims are an inch bigger
-but they have better drivers
-but weve only had 18 months
-but our tires arent as good
-but there arent enough of us yet
-but it's still summer air and soon the GOOD AIR will come
how about BUT our fastest C6 is slower than the fastest C5Z06 by 7 tenths and BUT were faster than the fastest C5 by 2 tenths.
THOSE ARE THE FACTS
lARON
THAT WOULD BE ROUNDED TO 3 TENTHS PLAIN AND SIMPLE..
ILL GIVE YOU 3 TENTHS AND ROUND THE 2.63 TO 3 MPH..
EIGHTER WAY IT'S STILL ONLY 3 TENTHS AND 3 MPH DIFFERANCE BETWWEN A C5 MN6 AND C6 MN6...
A C5 CAN CLOSE THAT GAP WITH A VARARAM...
YOU GUYS ARE ALWAYS LIKE THE C6 WILL DO THIS AND THE C6 WILL DO THAT...
WHAT EVER MAN...
WHAT THE C6 DID DO IS ONLY BEAT THE C5 BY
3.53 TENTHS AND 2.73 (YOUR WAY) MPH...
THATS PRETTY SAD...
9 YEARS LATER AND YOU GET A 3 TENTH AND 3 MPH ADVATAGE?????
AND THEN YOU WANT TO COMPARE IT TO A C5Z06????
DO YOU REALIZE THAT EVEN IF SOME ONE GETS A 12.2 IN A C6...
YOU'LL ONLY BE 4 TENTHS QUICKER THAN THE FASTEST C5'S.....AND STILL 5 TENTHS SLOWER THAN THE FASTEST C5Z06.....THATS RIGHT..EVEN IF YOU GUYS DO BEAT YOUR 12.4 AND GET A 12.2..
you will STILL be closer to C5 performance than C6.......Why so much denial.......this has already proven how small the 3 tenth and 3 mph gap is....your record of 12.4 vrs our record of 12.6 has already proven how small the gap is as well....RIGHT NOW YOUR QUICKEST STOCK C6 OF 12.4 IS GONNA NEED A SHOT OF NOS TO RUN THE 11.7 THE QUICKEST C5Z06 HAS RUN....BUT EVEN WITH ALL THE FACTS YOU STILL CLAIM THAT A C5 IS NONTHING COMPARED TO THE C6 AND THAT YOU CAN HANG WITH THE C5Z???????????
The hole reason this has even started is all because of this....
The mn6 C5 was advertised through GM and all the different magazines to run 13.0-13.3 at 107-109 mph....
And it always has done exactlt what was claimed....every week we have someone run in this exact range..
And once or twice a month we have people trapping 110 or 111 and running 12.8-13.0....
It has performed exactly as promised..
I was very excited about the C6 when I first read the specs..
All the mags were saying around12.6 at 114 mph!!!!!!!!
I was gonna trade my C5 in for one...
Then one day at the grocery store I was reading a GM magazine that had ran the C6...
These are the magazines that get 12.9's out of camaros so I couldnt wait to see what they got out of the C6....
No matter what they did they couldnt beat a 13.1 at 109 mph...
And they quoted ( these are stock C5 times)
They removed the TM and went back to the same track and ran a 12.4 at 114 mph.....
Thats all they did was remove the TM....!!!!!! Like unleashing a Demon they said...
Till after 3-4 passes the rear end broke and they said now they know why GM put in so much TM....
So they through in a stronger rear end and did like 1-2 mods and were running 11's no problem...
After reading this I went to your section here and started reading what they were turning at the strip....13.0-13.3 AT 108-110 WAS WHAT i SAW
AND YOU GUYS HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE NOT POSTING THERE LOW TO MID 13'S ON YOUR LIST..
CAS MOST OF THE TIME THATS ALL I SEE...
WHERES YOUR 13.6 BTW EB2003?????
I WASNT ASHAMED TO POST MY 13.5........
The C5 has always given us exactly what was promised..Low 13's at 107-109 mph...
You C6 guys are not all running 12.6 at 114 mph...
Most of you can hardly trapp 110....
Take a look at your list of 9 C6's.....
These 9 C6's represent your creme of the crop for speed..
Now look at the mph's...
5 of the 9 are trapping 108-111 mph.......
COME ON MAN!!!!!!
5 OF YOUR 9 TOP DOG C6'S ARE TRAPPING 3-6 MPH UNDER WHAT WAS CLAIMED BY THE MAGS AND GM....
( OH AND NOW YOUR PROBALY GONNA WANT TO BREAK THEM DOWN INTO TRANSMISSION CLASSES TO TRY TO MAKE YOUR NUMBERS NOT LOOK SO BAD COMPARED TO A C5Z06?????)
NOW LOOK AT THE C5'S..
Quite a few of the 1-2 mph over what was claimed...
IVE SAID IT A THOUSAND TIMES AND ILL SAY IT AGAIN...
IF I KNEW THAT THE AVERAGE C6 COULD RUN A 12.6 AT 114 MPH ID HAVE ONE....
THATS WHAT THEY WERE SUPPOSSED TO RUN?????
BUT IT TURNS OUT THAT IF YOUR C6 GETS ANYWERE NEAR 114 MPH YOUVE GOT ONE OF THE QUICKER ONES IN THE COUNTRY...
BUT THE AVERAGE C6 IS RUNNING A 13.0 AT 110 AND THE AVERAGE C5 IS RUNNING A 13.3 AT 107...
3 TENTHS AND 3 MPH IS NOT WORTH THE CHANGE TO ME...
A 5 MPH AND 5 TENTH DIFFERANCE LIKE WAS ADVERTISED WOULD HAVE MADE ME MAKE THE JUMP....
So far weve both proven that the differance isnt even a full 3 mph..
It's only like 2.7
How can a car that was suppossed to hit 114 only be 2.7 mph ahead of a car that was suppossed to hit 109????
SIMPLE...they blew the numbers up and gave the first C6's that got tested to unsuspecting car magazines with no tourque management....
Once the TM was put in the REAL production cars your one lucky SOB if you run a 12.8 at 112.....
As far as the C6 running or beating a Z06...
It could happen...
The TM dosent affect the car when it's acceleratin...
Only between shifts or while launching...
So if it's a short race wirth say only 1 shift...The TM will not be able to take it's toll the way it dose off launch at the track and going from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to third....
Then you'd be comparing a 345 rwhp 3250 pound car against a 355 rwhp 3150 pound car...
ACHOTS ( street meaning drag strip of course
)But if there are a few shifts involved or ESPECIALY for the launch it's an easy kill for the C5Z.
If the C5 being close to the C6 in performance really up sets you that bad just go trade it in and get a C5Z06...
YOU'LL NEVER HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE C5 BEING CLOSE IN PERFORMANCE AGAIN....AN 11.8 UTTERLY DESTROYS A 12.6...( OR 12.4) FOR THAT MATTER.
12.4
-but are rims are an inch bigger
-but they have better drivers
-but weve only had 18 months
-but our tires arent as good
-but there arent enough of us yet
-but it's still summer air and soon the GOOD AIR will come
how about BUT our fastest C6 is slower than the fastest C5Z06 by 7 tenths and BUT were faster than the fastest C5 by 2 tenths.
THOSE ARE THE FACTS
lARON
BTW Cajundude's car was lowered. So it was not bone stock either, and you have it listed as such. You have him down for a bone stock 12.9.
Nope, it didn't come from the factory lowered. Bone stock means bone stock.GSXRJack ran 12.999 with a smooth air coupler. How are you arbitrarily going to give him a 13.0 and call it bone stock? He never said that he made a 13.0 bone stock pass. But you have him down for 13.0 bone stock.
Where does he lay claim to a 13.0 second bone stock pass?http://forums.corvetteforum.com/showthread.php?t=967397
And I'm not too keen on having that 12.84 second 1999 FRC in the comparison either. Our C6s are either coupes or verts. Period. We don't have any non Z06 C6 FRCs because there are none.
If you want to compare C5 removable top coupes and verts vs C6 removable top coupes and verts then fine. But the time from that lighter fixed roof coupe has to go because we are not including a lighter FRC model in our C6 stats.
The Fixed Roof Coupe was a precursor of the C5 Z06. It was significantly lighter in weight to any of the other C5 coupes and Verts. And established a reputation for running faster times than the other coupes and verts as a result. The chances of coming across one, let alone a bone stock one, are very slim. Indeed many here have never even seen one as Chevy didn't make that many.
If you eliminate the three C5s above, your guys aren't even averaging 13 flat. Which is what I had already found out months ago.
I used to have a C5, remember. And like you, I thought that it was more than what it actually was. I too erroneously believed that it was close in performance to the C6. I was very wrong.
I ran my own thread back in February. The link is above. And as I recall there were no legitimate accounts of truly bone stock 12 second C5s in that particular thread..
If you are going to start arbitrarily adding a tenth to someones time run in a car which was modified, like you did in the case of GSXRJack then we want to add Nine ball and the top two people from this list too:
Cat Back
WS6JJP, Z51 .... 12.41 @ 112.07
Jschindler, F55/6sp ....... 12.57 @113.04
FLC6, Auto/3:15 .... 12.7@
Thanos, Z51/auto .... 12.8 @
Zoli007, Z51 ....... 12.97 @ 111.22 06
Parkev. Z51....... 12.99 @ 111.25
From:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...&page=13&pp=20
We can dock them all a tenth for their mods and call their times "bone stock" too.
But I am sure you don't want to do that. It would blow your "3 tenths difference" theory out of the water.
With our list, I think they are looking for the quickest, they are not looking for aborted runs or runs where 3rd gear was missed. So my 13.6 does not show up. No point in posting it. Just my opinion, but if it ain't a 12 second pass, then in my mind its not worth posting it. Anybody can run 13s.
We are talking about the cream of the crop. And the top C6s times here are averaging 12.6.
Someone asks me what the top C6 bone stock times here average, I say 12.6. Not 12.63775. Someone asks me what the best C5s here average, I say 13.0 or 13 flat. Not 13.081.
They ask me what the average best trap speed was, I say 111 mph for the C6 and 108 mph for the C5.
12.6 ............13.0
The C6 kicks the C5's *** by 4 tenths and 3 mph according to the average of the best results stock for stock. Thats a bus length in a drag race.
No way around it.
And BTW we aren't discussing C6 vs Z06. The C6 was never meant to compete with the Z06. But it will flat out dust a C5 coupe or vert.
Like I said. I don't even want to hear about a stock C5 unless its a Z06.
Anybody can run 13s.The average of the best in the C6 crowd here is 12.6 . The average of the best among the C5 crowd is 13.0. The average trap speed is 111 mph for the C6s and 108 for the C5s.
No need to try and skew the results by eliminating automatics either. We are talking C5 coupes and verts vs C6 coupes and verts. You tried to do that to eliminate four of the quickest recorded C6 times out there in order to make it look like the C5 was closer in performance to the C6 than it actually is. Won't work.
12.4 bone stock is the best yet. But that record will be broken.
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; Dec 17, 2005 at 11:01 AM.
Team Owner
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 37,329
Likes: 12
From: Plano Texas
CI 6-7-8-9 Veteran
CI-VI Car Show Winner
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13
I cannot believe it - 25 posts and not one has called 
on one of the primary responders.
laron, that guy is just pulling your chain. He looks for people like you (and sometimes me) to get into arguments.
I am not sure of his age (probably in his 20's, but whatever his real age a 10-12 year old mentality).
His primary 'skill' is to attempt to turn your argument/assumptions/facts against you.
However, close examination of his 'facts' generally show that either he is misquoting you for his own purposes, or relying on his ability to call white black, of black white.
You should note that in another thread he actually notes that he is just waiting for the Forum to 'reset' (last week during the Forum issues) so he could pull your chain some more (not an actual quote, but you get the idea).
If I were you, I would (and have) placed him on my ignore list.
on one of the primary responders.laron, that guy is just pulling your chain. He looks for people like you (and sometimes me) to get into arguments.
I am not sure of his age (probably in his 20's, but whatever his real age a 10-12 year old mentality).
His primary 'skill' is to attempt to turn your argument/assumptions/facts against you.
However, close examination of his 'facts' generally show that either he is misquoting you for his own purposes, or relying on his ability to call white black, of black white.
You should note that in another thread he actually notes that he is just waiting for the Forum to 'reset' (last week during the Forum issues) so he could pull your chain some more (not an actual quote, but you get the idea).
If I were you, I would (and have) placed him on my ignore list.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 38,314
Likes: 35
Originally Posted by AC54ME
I cannot believe it - 25 posts and not one has called on one of the primary responders.
laron, that guy is just pulling your chain. He looks for people like you (and sometimes me) to get into arguments.
I am not sure of his age (probably in his 20's, but whatever his real age a 10-12 year old mentality).
His primary 'skill' is to attempt to turn your argument/assumptions/facts against you.
However, close examination of his 'facts' generally show that either he is misquoting you for his own purposes, or relying on his ability to call white black, of black white.
You should note that in another thread he actually notes that he is just waiting for the Forum to 'reset' (last week during the Forum issues) so he could pull your chain some more (not an actual quote, but you get the idea).
If I were you, I would (and have) placed him on my ignore list.
on one of the primary responders.laron, that guy is just pulling your chain. He looks for people like you (and sometimes me) to get into arguments.
I am not sure of his age (probably in his 20's, but whatever his real age a 10-12 year old mentality).
His primary 'skill' is to attempt to turn your argument/assumptions/facts against you.
However, close examination of his 'facts' generally show that either he is misquoting you for his own purposes, or relying on his ability to call white black, of black white.
You should note that in another thread he actually notes that he is just waiting for the Forum to 'reset' (last week during the Forum issues) so he could pull your chain some more (not an actual quote, but you get the idea).
If I were you, I would (and have) placed him on my ignore list.
Originally Posted by AC54ME
Lets not get into a argument on this matter, please.
Sorry, don't think this link qualifies as DBS - appears (conjecture by the dealership) someone, or somehow, the back seat lights were left on, causing the battery to die.
The other link appears to be a DBS matter, but certainly there was no resolution put forth.
IMHO, we should continue to place efforts in discussing the GM arena regarding DBS, and specifically denoting this on the C6's.
Sorry, don't think this link qualifies as DBS - appears (conjecture by the dealership) someone, or somehow, the back seat lights were left on, causing the battery to die.
The other link appears to be a DBS matter, but certainly there was no resolution put forth.
IMHO, we should continue to place efforts in discussing the GM arena regarding DBS, and specifically denoting this on the C6's.
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Team Owner
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 37,329
Likes: 12
From: Plano Texas
CI 6-7-8-9 Veteran
CI-VI Car Show Winner
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13
EB,
You are correct - sorry I broke the truce - won't happen again.
Happy Holidays, and A Merry New Years to you and yours
You are correct - sorry I broke the truce - won't happen again.
Happy Holidays, and A Merry New Years to you and yours
