Come spring, I'm considering installing a set of long tube headers. At this point, I'm in the research phase and have not come across any threads about B&B's headers. (Yes, I did a search.) So, anybody have any experience with B&B's long tube headers?

http://www.bbexhaust.com/car/corvette/c6/

 

I considered buying B&B longtube headers since I already have B&B Bullets on my car. I did some research on the forum and found out that not many people have them. I decided to buy Kook's longtube headers instead. Kook's, LG and American Racing seem to be the most popular and best performing headers for a C6.
I see you live in Brainerd, I picked my car up there last May.

 

I think everyone is afraid of them because of that very funny shaped collector doesn't look too efficient.

 

In an attempt to be unsheepish, I have the BB headers on the way and will have a full report and dyno on them in the next month.

Definately scary getting into something that no one else has, but the headers should have a few things going for them...1st, they apparently match the quality of the bullets.. which are amazing looking. You cannot go wrong with that type of quality!, 2nd, they work with the stock h pipe..they might make less power then LGs or Kooks, but looks at the price difference.. you will need to use the competitors droney x pipes, which are no doubt nicely engineered but still drone bad..3rd) headers xpipe and bullets are too loud for most people, but they sound amazing.. imagine turning that down a little by running the bullet prt with headers, well you can do this with the bb headers.(I have a feeling im gonna have the best sounding stock block c6 around)

The collector is still 3" If you compare headers with stock exhaust vs. BB headers with bullets, I doubt there will be to large of a power difference. The later system has no restrictions.. plus the front part of the prt can be moddified to fit cats later (which I will probably do in time). I also plan to dynomat the back hatch.. the result should be an awesome exhaust sound with less drone then others are getting with such a loud exhaust.

Thats all I have right now, but ill take some nice pictures when they arrive this week. Any power lose over normal headers can be made up with a ported intake...with a good tune, I still expect to see 400whp (ported intake, LPE CAI, bullet headers, bullet prt, tune)

 

Sounds interesting - keep us posted.

 

bdking57........Please, do keep us informed and post pictures.

Given the quality reputation of B&B's cat back systems, I'm surprised their long tube headers are not more popular.

 

The other headers have those long merge collectors and x pipes that are tapering from 3" back to stock.. I can see how that setup makes more power when comparing header vs. header...

Ill take some macro shots of the collector inside and out... this is one of the least invasive headers and you could actually use the stock h pipe if you want it really loud so you could have bullets and headers for the same price as just the LGs or Kooks.

 

I had never heard that it was the X pipe that caused Drone. I have LG Pro long tubes with the 3" X pipe and I do not have any drone. However, I'm running the stock catback. So I always thought it was the catback that caused the drone. Hopefully you'll do a before and after dyno to see what gains you get. Keep us informed.

Thanks,
Glenn

 

Did not mean to indicate its just the X pipe thats causing the drone here.. but the bottom line is if your going to go with a high flow catback you need something to absorb the resonance that the entire system is creating... the PRT system is really quite revolutionary as its killing drone, while not interfering with flow at all.. or the overall sound quality... Its just a better concept then a muffler for great sound... headers def. increase drone.. adding sound deadening on the xpipe is the best way to do this. The other header companies have forced everyone into a situation where you need to buy their x pipe... but too bad they dont include any type of sound management so that everyone could still use the most popular sounding exhaust out there.

The issue here is that no one is ultimately looking to produce the "complete" package for the consumer as far as power vs. sound. I guess you could say LGs plus corsa is this setup.. but I sure wont be paying over $3000 on an exhaust system! I paid $1700 for everything shipped (bullets, PRT xpipe, headers )

Unfortunately.. I wont have a before dyno on the car as im doing everything in my garage and then going for the tune, but we should be able to easily baseline it off of other m6 z51s on the same dyno.

 

bdking57.......Where did you buy your set up from? The lowest price I can find for the headers is WCC a $999.00. Since I already have B&B's x-pipe and Rt. 66 cat backs, all I need are the headers.

Also, isn't illegal for a shop to install an exhaust system without catalytic converters? Does the customer need to sign an "off road" disclaimer?

 

Hey, excellent point about the cats. I just realized the B&B's are made to hook directly up to the stock H pipe, which is a nice cost savings, but you will not have any cats. I have 2 high flow metal matrix cats on the end of my LG Pro LT headers. They work great and I haven't thrown any codes. Plus, a lot of guys run cats to remove the raspy sound of the exhaust and make the car smell better. So, your savings are going down if you have to buy 2 cats and weld them into the H pipe. Cats will cost your $300 and probably another $75 to get them welded into the H pipe and add O2 sensor bungs.

If you don't get cats, then you'll either have to buy HPtuners for $500 or get a tune for $500 to remove the codes. Either way, your cost savings pretty much evaporated by running the B&B headers. You may think you need a tune anyway, but I picked up 26 rwhp and 39 rwtq without a tune. The B&B website only quotes that you will pick up between 19 and 22 rwhp with their headers.

You may want to look at the American Racing Header, they are a good deal with the cats.

 

I thought I read bd has the whole system on order which excludes switching to a different header company.

 

Ill definately be getting a tune to turn off the rear 02s. The tune is the best mod you could get, so I dont know why anyone wouldnt get a tune as you can yield 15whp on just that alone on a stock motor. If its a concern, a mail order tune for $175 should do the trick of turning off the sensors.. worst case scenario is just ride around with a cell on.

Part of the reason people are gaining large numbers with just adding headers is that its leaning out your fueling.. leaning out the car on top and making more power doesnt actually mean the headers are that much more effecient.. a tune on a stock motor would have netted you 15whp for example, but after LGs.. you leaned out the fueling so much you may only now pick up 5whp off of a tune because you are already running leaner... so if a stock motor with just a tune can make 365whp, that should be considered optimal for the stock setup.. so If you gained 26whp from just headers you should be at 391whp/400+ tq with just header correct? Its strange we are not seeing more 400whp cars if the headers are really that effecient as it would only take the addition of an intake. A big portion of the gains are definately from moving to larger highflow cats.. looks how tiny the stock ones are. So If you replaced these collectors with random tech cats, and tuned the car. I wouldnt doubt 375whp was possible without headers.

If you want to test this, go have your car tuned, then add headers... I bet power will end up being lost due to all the pulled timing due to detonation.

Im not trying to stir anything up here.. there is just other routes to receive similiar results, and if they end up being cheaper too then thats just a plus.



I mentioned previously this would only work as a catless system, which really isnt that bad unless you are daily driving your car. Catless will sound better, make more power.. just stinks a little but varies on what type of gas you are using(some smell worse then others!) I only drive the vette 40 miles a week so not a big deal for me.

let me diagram this out..

stock h pipe................................coll ector/cats
--------------------------------- -----------
BB x pipes..................................h eader
--------------------------------- ------------



now the front portion of the prt x pipe is made with different material then the rear... would be pretty easy to add cats.. and I thought most were a slip fit so it might just need to be cut in order to fit the pipe (not welded).. Ill add those at a later time.

other header x pipes

xpipe....................cats of TPs............header
-------------------- ------ --------------------

 

These look really simply to install vs the massive LTs.. Just invest in some jackstands and do a little bit each day.. should be cake. I would never pay mechanic to touch a vette unless it was a vette shop ( who wont be giving you a hard time about no cats)

 

I have an A6 so my before and after were 334/360. By your numbers, you have a stock M6 making 365 rwhp. I sure haven't seen one that high. More like mid 350's. There are plenty of examples of LG's, Kooks, and AMR's picking up 25 to 30 rwhp, so mine was not a fluke.

I sent information to Charlie for the $100 mail order tune that was listed here on CF. I included the dyno pulls with A/F's and he said I did not need a tune. People who are picking up 15 hp with a stock car must have had terribly rich A/F's to begin with. There is a tuner here in the Phx area that told me the other day there isn't much power, if any, to pick up with timing on the LS2.

I hear what you are saying about leaning out the motor with headers, but that did not happen on mine. I was 13.0 to one stock and around 12.8 to one after headers.

So, you are going to put a header on your car that the manufacturer admits only picks up 22 hp max in order to save a few dollars? Buy the AMR (I am assuming you don't want to pay $1800 for the best, LG's), they are only $1600 and you may be able to save on the tune. Plus, your car will sound and smell better with Cats. You like the sound without cats, however, it reminds me of the sound of a garbage truck, way too much rasp. I just don't think you'll be happy with the B&B's. If you are determined not to run cats, then get the Kooks or AMR's without Cats, they are not that much more than the B&B's and they'll make more power.

Good Luck,
Glenn

 

I installed my "massive" LG's with the car on jackstands. Took me about 4 hours. Easiest header install I've ever done.

 

see easy! Considering the LGs when in very easy, a smaller set should be even less work. No sense paying someone $400 to do this job.

 

not sure if you had a adding error or not...there is no way, bullet + prt + bb headers + shipping = $1700

bullet w prt = around $1500
b & b headers = around $1000

 

ok you got me, it wasnt all new.. I picked up a bullet for 650 shipped used with 1500miles and a bullet prt for 230 shipped used... headers were 970 shipped from tybrne.

There are enough use bullets floating around to not have to deal with buying a new set.

but just in case, corvettes of houston has them for
$1,188.95 bullet prt
$929.95 headers

 

ok, i get it now...you probably is the one that brought the prt from vidal1313.