Looking at how well the LS2 takes to mods (bolt ons), especially headers with or without HF Cats, intakes, and tunes.....

Do you all think that with the extra .2 liters and better heads that the LS3 will respond with even greater range of power with the same bolt ons?

I am thinking that the potential and response of the LS3 with just a header back exhaust and intake with a dyno tune will be up to 10% more effective then even the LS2 motor is.

Thoughts?

Nevermind a cam, I think once you go cam on the LS3 it is really going to shine. I wouldn't doubt that a header back exhust, intake, cam, pulley and tune will put down near 475-500 WHP on the 2008 cars

 

To get 500rwhp on the new 2008 LS3 you will have to pull the heads off and notch the pistons. This is assuming the L92 heads are in place which does coincide with the 10.7:1 static compression with 70cc heads and a stock gasket on a 6.2 liter motor. The P/V clearance isnt going to let you run much more than a 224 cam and that isnt doing 500rwhp. The only people that got 500rwhp with those heads used huge cams over 238 duration. That isnt fitting without flycutting. So assume the heads are comming off, notching, and hopefully a bump in compression with a thinner gasket.

I hope this section doesnt turn into a guess the numbers for the LS3 rather than actual tech posts on mods done to actual motors. This happened oer on LS1tech and the only posts you see are L92 strokers and 'what cam would work best posts'. There are never head cam LS2 posts. By the way....if anyone wants to see a lot of tech dont posts to LS2's then LS2gto.com has many guys digging into the motors and doing real world mods without care for the warranty. I guess the cars are cheap enough that that demographics coincide as far as wrenchers and LS2's.

Maybe the moderaters can segregate the hypothetical posts over to the general discussion section and leave actual mods done (results) in this section.

 

I'm sure someone somewhere is working on comming up with mods for it right now

 

 

Oh please don't get me wrong I wasn't trying to start a pissing contest or a rediculous over the moon estimation.

I was just trying to get a discussion around with what we know about the LS3 how it will respond to mods and tunes in relationship to the true data we know about the LS2 already.

We know all about L92 heads already as well so I thought this could be rather technical.

I have seen real cars with LS2's cam headers intake tune put down "near" 440 WHP. Now that was with standard heads on a 6.0 So with that being that, I think it is possible to get to 475 WHP with the same mods done to the new LS3 since that is basially a head job too on top of the LS2 mods plus larger displacement

 

According to several tuners I have spoken with, the '08 Corvette will be very difficult to work with because the LS3 computer is totally different from prior years. It is much more powerful than before and it creates virtual VE tables each time the car is started. That means the car no longer goes to fixed fuel tables (the VE tables) under part throttle and WOT, nor can tuners change the values in those tables to account for mods. To the extent fixed tables still exist as a vestige of the prior hardware, they would be ignored by the CPU. This would be too bad because the engine itself has a ton of potential.

I guess the question is whether the computer is powerful enough to change with mods. We'll see...

Newer is not always better.

 

It can be technical and I wasnt singling you out. There will 200 posts for what cam works best for the new 6.2L. Please remember that guesses not tested by experimentation arent 'tech'; they are heresay or general discussion. The problem is the prediction posts. No one will search for the last 100 threads on that.

Having used the L92's I do have biased input. If you are going to use the LS2 cam only examples then look at the cams that did 435rwhp cam only with a 210cc intake runner. A 232 duration with these heads can only fit with stock compression on the LS3 (maybe) and I can tell you that the low end will suffer for it. If you want to use a 232 cam with 10.7:1 and have a DCR of under 8 you will have a soggy low end. The added displacement will help though.

The heads would do much better with the same cams that the LS2 uses with success if you port the exhaust port only on the L92 heads. This would get the intake to exhaust ratio closer to that which would favor the type of split cams that are around. Having to notch pistons for use with a big cam AND good compression (milled heads and thinner gaskets lessen P/V clearance) isnt the end of the world. It just isnt the simple cam swap most will think it is. In the end the LS3 with .2 liters additional displacement will amount to 15-20rwhp more with the same heads and cam. I would expect peak numbers to be great for the 6.2 liter with such high flowing heads. Under 4k rpms with huge cams wil be a different story with stock compression. A 232 cam in a 6 liter with a stock 210cc intake runner will feel very perky to the street only car in the sub 4k rpm range by comparison.

 

Freakin computers! Give us a carb,

 

I was also wondering about the tuning capabilities available for the new Corvette.

This will of course be key in maximizing the benefit of whatever modifications are done to it.

Also, don't the '07s do the same thing as far as the VE tables are concerned?

 

So basically what you are saying, of course until otherwise proven, that the new 08's are going to be more difficult to mod.

Being that with the newer computer, the same boltons won't necessarily yeild the same results as they will on the earlier years?

Which would mean that the 08's would run about the same as the earlier ones with the same mods?

LEX

I should add, there are always chip replacements, but with that, that would mean an entire engine, tranny, ect warrenty void?

 

All I can say on this is look how much better the LS2 responds to boltons than the LS6 or the LS1. It would probably be like that.

 

If it works out that way, it will be a concern. Tuning is the cornerstone of modding for performance.

Right now the Dodge/Jeep guys don't have very many tuning options and it is a big concern for the guys with the Chargers and SRT8 Jeep SUVs. They are practically begging the folks at HP Tuners to give them a solution. Diablosport has nothing for the gas engined Dodges either, and I don't know about EFI Live.

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5467

Hopfully, the '08 will not fall into the category of not having a readily available tuning solution.

 

Maybe GM is doing it on purpose.

1 - To keep the 05-07 guys from being upset
2 - Warranty issues
3 - Keeping it down so that the SS is the King when released.

I am wondering about the warranty side of things. Maybe there have been alot that they can't prove, have to fix, killing the bottom line and are trying to prevent that.

Or, they know that they have already pushed the LS2 to the limit, now being the LS3, and mods will hurt the car more than they will with the LS2.

Wonder if they are doing the same with the 08 Z06's?

LEX

 

Don't know their motives, but it remains to be seen how easy or difficult the '08 will be to tune. It could turn out to be no more difficult to tune than an '07.

Don't know.

 

The static VE tables were gone on the '07 cars, but the car is certainly tuneable with HPTuners. I've been able to get our stock Z51 car actual AFR to equal commanded very easily by adjusting the MAF transfer function. Timing tables are still there, no problem there. But this is on a stock motor where the new VE calculation isn't off much anyway.

The days of relatively easy tuning are nearly gone. Of course, we thought that in '04 about the '05 and later CAN cars, too. My bet is that the heads/cam LS3 car owners will have fits with the tunes until the tuning software people catch up. No way would I change the camshaft on an '08 car until the tuning package is available.

Joe

 

Aren't we still fighting TM or whatever it is on LS2's w/o a true and satisfactory solution? I believe the LS3 will be "locked down" further by GM with regards to "tuning". The LS2 was a glimpse of that as the LS6/LS1 were so easy to mod and tune. With each successive new motor GM feels it's necessary to keep the "back yard" mechanics out of the computers.

We'll know soon just how "locked down" the LS3 is.

Tom

 

me likes my 05 and the tune/set up I have

 

Yeah I guess it is all speclation until the first guy can get the car to a tuning shop to see what they can do with it.

There is nothing that computers can't eventually do. So it might take time for the tuning world to catch up but to shops that this is thier bread and butter, they will be forced to put in the R&D to break the "code" as it is their source of income. It may take a year or so but I don't think I would even mod a 2008 for at least a year anyhow.

Let the market catch up, maintain the warranty for a bit, then have some fun with 436 horses becomes just too slow

 

True ... there are backyard mechanics ... and there are real tuners (LPE, Katech etc) ... GM would not want to kill the aftermarket so quickly, but they can make the price of entry a little higher.

 

I agree, GM would be making a big mistake if they Lock down the PCM, we all look forward to see what we can make our cars do. GM is enjoying the incredible surge their performance market is having to attempt to clip out ability to mod them, I think.