10.480 @ 134.07
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,308
Likes: 157
From: NJ
The thing you may not understand is that we know Chaz, his car, his tuner and how he tunes, the tracks he runs out, the guy who setup his car and what it takes here in a manual vette to get it done. That's probably why we are passionate about what we say. We all will also help him go as fast as possible with his setup. The other thing people forget is holding the car together. That's something stock/bolton vette racers don't appreciate until they step up the power. It will keep you off the track and mess with your head.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,950
Likes: 265
From: St. Louis, MO
St. Jude Donor '08
The thing you may not understand is that we know Chaz, his car, his tuner and how he tunes, the tracks he runs out, the guy who setup his car and what it takes here in a manual vette to get it done. That's probably why we are passionate about what we say. We all will also help him go as fast as possible with his setup. The other thing people forget is holding the car together. That's something stock/bolton vette racers don't appreciate until they step up the power. It will keep you off the track and mess with your head.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 11,331
Likes: 18
From: Missouri City Texas
The thing you may not understand is that we know Chaz, his car, his tuner and how he tunes, the tracks he runs out, the guy who setup his car and what it takes here in a manual vette to get it done. That's probably why we are passionate about what we say. We all will also help him go as fast as possible with his setup. The other thing people forget is holding the car together. That's something stock/bolton vette racers don't appreciate until they step up the power. It will keep you off the track and mess with your head.
I'm not saying the car will run 9s how it sits in the garage right now
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,308
Likes: 157
From: NJ
Weight reduction isn't a "have it or don't have it" kind of mod...
I didn't know weight reduction had a set stopping point, lol.
Saying that weight helps with traction is just a bandaid for a poor suspension setup.
Again, I'd call his weight reduction pretty mild, as far as going for 9's is concerned. Next up I would imagine would be stuff like heater core, rear speakers, axle-back exhaust, replacing carpet with lightweight carpet, door panels, center console, etc.... All interior stuff can quickly go back to stock and you can rip a lot of weight out fast.
Radical tuning could simply be a more aggressive tune to run off 104 unleaded or something. I don't mean that it has to be tuned to the brink of destruction, but I've seen more than once that spending several hours on the dyno can result in 5-10 more rwhp even coming from an experienced tuner. If he's running a tune for daily driving and then racing off of that same tune then it obviously isn't maxed out.
I agree that a safe tune is best, but when you're going for serious records you have to live on the edge a little.
If he gets down in the 2800s range it's a 9 second capable car easily.
Lighter weight and better air will all help to contribute to a better 60'
I didn't know weight reduction had a set stopping point, lol.
Saying that weight helps with traction is just a bandaid for a poor suspension setup.
Again, I'd call his weight reduction pretty mild, as far as going for 9's is concerned. Next up I would imagine would be stuff like heater core, rear speakers, axle-back exhaust, replacing carpet with lightweight carpet, door panels, center console, etc.... All interior stuff can quickly go back to stock and you can rip a lot of weight out fast.
Radical tuning could simply be a more aggressive tune to run off 104 unleaded or something. I don't mean that it has to be tuned to the brink of destruction, but I've seen more than once that spending several hours on the dyno can result in 5-10 more rwhp even coming from an experienced tuner. If he's running a tune for daily driving and then racing off of that same tune then it obviously isn't maxed out.
I agree that a safe tune is best, but when you're going for serious records you have to live on the edge a little.
If he gets down in the 2800s range it's a 9 second capable car easily.
Lighter weight and better air will all help to contribute to a better 60'
1) Weight reduction doesn't always help. Sometimes a little weight in the right place actually helps in my experience with my vette. If you know the tracks around here when the da is great you may understand better. Also he has a street car which is what we are talking about here and no elaborate race suspension.
2) Radical tuning is just not necessary and he has an experienced vette 1/4 mile tuner. The dyno is not where you pick up et. The WOT tune on the street and strip can easily be the same.
3) He's already very light. 2800 lbs is a racecar. We're talking street car. I'm not sure if his car would be still considered a corvette at 2800lb raceweight.
* But I do get your point that with razor sharp driving and keen attention to detail with these setups, a H/C street vette can be a low 10 second car and better under the right conditions.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,308
Likes: 157
From: NJ
I've been thinking of that...my friend Robert's Superbee is so much faster to 330 and 660 even though I often out 60 foot him. He has a ton more torque than me but about the same HP.
I'm wondering if a professional tune by Formato would help my 330 and 660. I've never focused too much in this area...just making sure I wasn't knocking and fueling was good (by good I like 12.5 or leaner).
Here's my dyno sheet comparing fast vs no fast.
I'm wondering if a professional tune by Formato would help my 330 and 660. I've never focused too much in this area...just making sure I wasn't knocking and fueling was good (by good I like 12.5 or leaner).
Here's my dyno sheet comparing fast vs no fast.
Leaner isn't necessarily faster.
The torque will have a significant influence like you mentioned especially on a heavier less aerodynamic car.
Here's a pearl. It's possible that my car made 50 more rwhp than others like Chaz' in key areas when racing down the 1/4 mile.The average hp under the curve would then be drastically different while the peak hp and torque is the same.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 11,331
Likes: 18
From: Missouri City Texas
Of course I'm reaching...that's what it's going to take for someone to run single digits in a heads/cam build 
I doubt a weekend warrior is going to drive to the strip, crack off a single digit pass, and drive home.
If he has no intention on stripping his car down further to reach lower raceweights or improve suspension then that's totally fine, and I'd agree that 9s will be nigh impossible at his current raceweight. I have helped people get fbodies into the 2800-2900lb range and could be put back to mostly stock. Those cars aren't light stock, lol.
I doubt a weekend warrior is going to drive to the strip, crack off a single digit pass, and drive home.
If he has no intention on stripping his car down further to reach lower raceweights or improve suspension then that's totally fine, and I'd agree that 9s will be nigh impossible at his current raceweight. I have helped people get fbodies into the 2800-2900lb range and could be put back to mostly stock. Those cars aren't light stock, lol.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 8,308
Likes: 157
From: NJ
Of course I'm reaching...that's what it's going to take for someone to run single digits in a heads/cam build
I doubt a weekend warrior is going to drive to the strip, crack off a single digit pass, and drive home.
If he has no intention on stripping his car down further to reach lower raceweights or improve suspension then that's totally fine, and I'd agree that 9s will be nigh impossible at his current raceweight. I have helped people get fbodies into the 2800-2900lb range and could be put back to mostly stock. Those cars aren't light stock, lol.
I doubt a weekend warrior is going to drive to the strip, crack off a single digit pass, and drive home.
If he has no intention on stripping his car down further to reach lower raceweights or improve suspension then that's totally fine, and I'd agree that 9s will be nigh impossible at his current raceweight. I have helped people get fbodies into the 2800-2900lb range and could be put back to mostly stock. Those cars aren't light stock, lol.
We're all just bored and living thru Chaz. At least it get some of us psyched to get to the strip.
At times, I also think it's crazy making these cars less streetable to go faster. I'm thinking of going in the other direction. I miss having a bolton car that I could enjoy on the street occasionally floor the gas pedal.
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Race Director
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 11,331
Likes: 18
From: Missouri City Texas
Yeah, I'm not sacrificing streetability in my C6 for speed...I'll just supplement with a larger hit of gas if I want to go faster, lol. It'll see weekend weight reduction for the track (skinnies, exhaust, seats, carpet, etc.... but nothing that can't be put back to stock in 4-5 hours time.
Chaz has done a great thing in pushing the record deeper. I hope we get more people willing to push the limits to truly get a quest for 9s going in the C6 crowd. I don't care if it ends up being a full-fledged race car built by a tuner shop..I'd just like to see it happen
Congrats again on your record-breaking run
Chaz has done a great thing in pushing the record deeper. I hope we get more people willing to push the limits to truly get a quest for 9s going in the C6 crowd. I don't care if it ends up being a full-fledged race car built by a tuner shop..I'd just like to see it happen
Congrats again on your record-breaking run
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,950
Likes: 265
From: St. Louis, MO
St. Jude Donor '08
Maybe a little Joe but not big gains IMO. A WOT tune is not very complicated IMO but there is some small gains.
Leaner isn't necessarily faster.
The torque will have a significant influence like you mentioned especially on a heavier less aerodynamic car.
Here's a pearl. It's possible that my car made 50 more rwhp than others like Chaz' in key areas when racing down the 1/4 mile.The average hp under the curve would then be drastically different while the peak hp and torque is the same.
Leaner isn't necessarily faster.
The torque will have a significant influence like you mentioned especially on a heavier less aerodynamic car.
Here's a pearl. It's possible that my car made 50 more rwhp than others like Chaz' in key areas when racing down the 1/4 mile.The average hp under the curve would then be drastically different while the peak hp and torque is the same.
Hmmm...since you're in the mood to share, could you post up a dyno sheet? Would be interesting to compare as I contemplate my next goal for the car and the driver.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,950
Likes: 265
From: St. Louis, MO
St. Jude Donor '08
Are you available for hire?
We're all just bored and living thru Chaz. At least it get some of us psyched to get to the strip.
At times, I also think it's crazy making these cars less streetable to go faster. I'm thinking of going in the other direction. I miss having a bolton car that I could enjoy on the street occasionally floor the gas pedal.
We're all just bored and living thru Chaz. At least it get some of us psyched to get to the strip.
At times, I also think it's crazy making these cars less streetable to go faster. I'm thinking of going in the other direction. I miss having a bolton car that I could enjoy on the street occasionally floor the gas pedal.
It's easy to say we will launch easier but when that tree comes down the foot goes to the floor. Can't help it.
Team Owner
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 27,254
Likes: 136
From: Short Hills, NJ
...even if all of the measures were taken (weight reduction, better driver and stellar DA/track prep) that still doesn't ensure that the car can take it for the multiple (or even one) passes that it would take to get the number out of it. That is simply restating the obvious of course but it is a factor.Even more so than manual C5s (that also break often enough), these manual (non Z06/non ZR1) C6s just seem to be inherently less likely to take serious drag racing abuse. The 2005 rear is an obvious issue but it might also be the suspension angles/mounting points or the longer wheelbase but something seems to be making that quest for low 10s/high 9s much more difficult.
Automatics have a little better shot but even they break plenty on the way to super quick ETs.
This was the topic of discussion with my buddy last Saturday at the track. Four years ago we were tickling 11's on a good run and our cars were dead nuts reliable and we had a ton of fun with them. Now we are nearly a second faster......and we dont race because we're afraid of the $5500 bill for a rear and a tranny.
Though even bolt ons only manual C6s still live with at least the threat of breakage on every hard launch.
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,922
Likes: 4
From: Cheektowaga NY
St. Jude Donor '08
Maybe a little Joe but not big gains IMO. A WOT tune is not very complicated IMO but there is some small gains.
Leaner isn't necessarily faster.
The torque will have a significant influence like you mentioned especially on a heavier less aerodynamic car.
Here's a pearl. It's possible that my car made 50 more rwhp than others like Chaz' in key areas when racing down the 1/4 mile.The average hp under the curve would then be drastically different while the peak hp and torque is the same.
Leaner isn't necessarily faster.
The torque will have a significant influence like you mentioned especially on a heavier less aerodynamic car.
Here's a pearl. It's possible that my car made 50 more rwhp than others like Chaz' in key areas when racing down the 1/4 mile.The average hp under the curve would then be drastically different while the peak hp and torque is the same.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 1
From: Central Jersey, Union County N.J.
St. Jude Donor '10
Weight reduction? The car already has skinnies, various parts removed and lightweight race seats. Next up might be air conditioning, stereo, amp and all speakers, interior panels and carpeting etc. That would certainly all help but not sure chaz wants to go quite that far.
Better air/much lower DA will definitely help, that could take him to a 10.3x.
Radical tuning? In my experience, radical/on the edge tuning ultimately leads to shortened (or totally expired) engine life.
I personally prefer a proper tune at all times.
Seat time? Absolutely. That along with great air could possibly net him a high 10.2x...the very same ET range that I'd predicted as quite possible a page or two back.
Or he could just shoot for a 1.25 sixty foot, that alone could be a 9.
Better air/much lower DA will definitely help, that could take him to a 10.3x.
Radical tuning? In my experience, radical/on the edge tuning ultimately leads to shortened (or totally expired) engine life.
I personally prefer a proper tune at all times.
Seat time? Absolutely. That along with great air could possibly net him a high 10.2x...the very same ET range that I'd predicted as quite possible a page or two back.
Or he could just shoot for a 1.25 sixty foot, that alone could be a 9.
won't happen, i put the C6Z exhaust back on C6Z Seats i use in the summer.I've reach my 500 rwhp N/A goal, and i'm satisfied. At this time i wouldn't consider a Radical tune.
Seat time
Last edited by chazc6; Apr 12, 2011 at 05:34 PM.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 1
From: Central Jersey, Union County N.J.
St. Jude Donor '10
Weight reduction isn't a "have it or don't have it" kind of mod...
I didn't know weight reduction had a set stopping point, lol.
Saying that weight helps with traction is just a bandaid for a poor suspension setup.
Again, I'd call his weight reduction pretty mild, as far as going for 9's is concerned. Next up I would imagine would be stuff like heater core, rear speakers, axle-back exhaust, replacing carpet with lightweight carpet, door panels, center console, etc.... All interior stuff can quickly go back to stock and you can rip a lot of weight out fast.
Radical tuning could simply be a more aggressive tune to run off 104 unleaded or something. I don't mean that it has to be tuned to the brink of destruction, but I've seen more than once that spending several hours on the dyno can result in 5-10 more rwhp even coming from an experienced tuner. If he's running a tune for daily driving and then racing off of that same tune then it obviously isn't maxed out.
I agree that a safe tune is best, but when you're going for serious records you have to live on the edge a little.
If he gets down in the 2800s range it's a 9 second capable car easily.
Lighter weight and better air will all help to contribute to a better 60'
I didn't know weight reduction had a set stopping point, lol.
Saying that weight helps with traction is just a bandaid for a poor suspension setup.
Again, I'd call his weight reduction pretty mild, as far as going for 9's is concerned. Next up I would imagine would be stuff like heater core, rear speakers, axle-back exhaust, replacing carpet with lightweight carpet, door panels, center console, etc.... All interior stuff can quickly go back to stock and you can rip a lot of weight out fast.
Radical tuning could simply be a more aggressive tune to run off 104 unleaded or something. I don't mean that it has to be tuned to the brink of destruction, but I've seen more than once that spending several hours on the dyno can result in 5-10 more rwhp even coming from an experienced tuner. If he's running a tune for daily driving and then racing off of that same tune then it obviously isn't maxed out.
I agree that a safe tune is best, but when you're going for serious records you have to live on the edge a little.
If he gets down in the 2800s range it's a 9 second capable car easily.
Lighter weight and better air will all help to contribute to a better 60'
But i'm not ready to remove any thing esle in my car, especially the heater core, a/c, stereo or carpet.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 1
From: Central Jersey, Union County N.J.
St. Jude Donor '10
Of course I'm reaching...that's what it's going to take for someone to run single digits in a heads/cam build
I doubt a weekend warrior is going to drive to the strip, crack off a single digit pass, and drive home.
If he has no intention on stripping his car down further to reach lower raceweights or improve suspension then that's totally fine, and I'd agree that 9s will be nigh impossible at his current raceweight. I have helped people get fbodies into the 2800-2900lb range and could be put back to mostly stock. Those cars aren't light stock, lol.
I doubt a weekend warrior is going to drive to the strip, crack off a single digit pass, and drive home.
If he has no intention on stripping his car down further to reach lower raceweights or improve suspension then that's totally fine, and I'd agree that 9s will be nigh impossible at his current raceweight. I have helped people get fbodies into the 2800-2900lb range and could be put back to mostly stock. Those cars aren't light stock, lol.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 1
From: Central Jersey, Union County N.J.
St. Jude Donor '10
Yeah, I'm not sacrificing streetability in my C6 for speed...I'll just supplement with a larger hit of gas if I want to go faster, lol. It'll see weekend weight reduction for the track (skinnies, exhaust, seats, carpet, etc.... but nothing that can't be put back to stock in 4-5 hours time.
Chaz has done a great thing in pushing the record deeper. I hope we get more people willing to push the limits to truly get a quest for 9s going in the C6 crowd. I don't care if it ends up being a full-fledged race car built by a tuner shop..I'd just like to see it happen
Congrats again on your record-breaking run
Chaz has done a great thing in pushing the record deeper. I hope we get more people willing to push the limits to truly get a quest for 9s going in the C6 crowd. I don't care if it ends up being a full-fledged race car built by a tuner shop..I'd just like to see it happen
Congrats again on your record-breaking run
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 1
From: Central Jersey, Union County N.J.
St. Jude Donor '10
I think you are reaching here buddy.
1) Weight reduction doesn't always help. Sometimes a little weight in the right place actually helps in my experience with my vette. If you know the tracks around here when the da is great you may understand better. Also he has a street car which is what we are talking about here and no elaborate race suspension.
2) Radical tuning is just not necessary and he has an experienced vette 1/4 mile tuner. The dyno is not where you pick up et. The WOT tune on the street and strip can easily be the same.
3) He's already very light. 2800 lbs is a racecar. We're talking street car. I'm not sure if his car would be still considered a corvette at 2800lb raceweight.
* But I do get your point that with razor sharp driving and keen attention to detail with these setups, a H/C street vette can be a low 10 second car and better under the right conditions.
1) Weight reduction doesn't always help. Sometimes a little weight in the right place actually helps in my experience with my vette. If you know the tracks around here when the da is great you may understand better. Also he has a street car which is what we are talking about here and no elaborate race suspension.
2) Radical tuning is just not necessary and he has an experienced vette 1/4 mile tuner. The dyno is not where you pick up et. The WOT tune on the street and strip can easily be the same.
3) He's already very light. 2800 lbs is a racecar. We're talking street car. I'm not sure if his car would be still considered a corvette at 2800lb raceweight.
* But I do get your point that with razor sharp driving and keen attention to detail with these setups, a H/C street vette can be a low 10 second car and better under the right conditions.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,549
Likes: 27
From: Southampton NJ