ferdthe4

so I have a base model 08 with z51 and a 6spd. Bought right around a year ago with 37000 miles has just over 39000 now. I don't drive it a ton just a date night/sunday cruiser occasionally drive to work with it. Anyways I recently moved and last night spent the evening at my old house doing some work packing some crap up. Decided to leave my daily beater there and drive the corvette to the new house. I was doing this as I had an appointment with the dealership to drop my vette off this evening to get the headlight harness fix done for the recall. Mine never had it done. Anyways I start it up it cranked a little weak but started up fine. I figured the weak cranking to be a little weak battery from sitting the last couple weeks without a battery maintainer when it's been colder than crap out lately. Well as I'm driving to the new to me house about 45mins away it was running fine then all of sudden just shut down lights all stayed on but just shut down service traction control, service fuel system, bunch of crap lit up the dash.

I coasted into the next closest drive off the road that I could get in. I turned the car off at the start button. popped the hood terminals looked good, I unfortunately hadn't payed much attention to the volt meter while driving. When I first left the old house it was showing around 13.5-14. Anyways shut the hood hit the unlock button darn door was a little funky getting the stupid electronic handles to work has always been like this I hate the stupid electric doors. Get in hit the start button it fires up runs fine.

Stupidly just glad it started up again and only being about 6-7 miles away from home I just go hoping it would make it not really paying attention to the volt meter like I should have. It goes a few more miles I make my turn off the county highway on to the more back roads I have to take to get to my house. I live in rural southern Indiana a little ways off any main roads.

I'm going down the small county rd off course just as I'm driving through a small valley/gully area the car just up and dies again while staying keyed on with all the lights on. I coast over at this point I'm weaving a tapestry of profranity cause I'm only about four miles away from my driveway. And of course this little valley area is just a cell phone dead zone. I pop the hood look things over a bit, not much it was bitter cold around 5 degrees F. I try locking it unlocking it door is funky as usual get it hit the start button lights go blank no crank then the dash lights back up everything sweeps over and back like usual. Thankfully a nearby neighbor drove by saw me help me push it into the next driveway off the road. We pop the hood hook up his jumpers it at least cranked and started for second then died this time.

So now I'm thinking ok my battery must have gone to crap it's sat the month at least in a cold garage. The battery is a couple years old. So neighbor is at least nice enough to drop me off at home. Fiance runs me to wal mart I hate the place and hate their battery's. But by this point it's the only place open I can get a battery. I get a battery go back to the car put it in still does the same thing as before. Try to crank it with jumpers off the fiance's car it cranks starts hardly runs a second then dies.

Well at this point it's just after midnight around 0 degrees I had, had enough. After a slurry of profanity slamming the hood grabbing some crap out from it I said screw it left it there went home. Didn't even feel like dealing with trying to get a tow that time of night and waiting for it to only move the car four miles. It's still sitting in the driveway met the person who had the place they didn't care left them my number to get a hold of me if need be I'd leave work to get it moved or towed. Thought about taking a half day and missing the morning at work to get it towed first thing. But didn't feel like wasting time of screwing the POS.

Anyways I'm gonna leave work as early as I can here in the next few hours. After reading through these topics

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...message-2.html

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...t-gremlin.html

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...t-start-3.html

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...fob-works.html

I'm gonna take a jack with me so I can hopefully get under the stupid car to check the starter solenoid connection. I'm hoping that's it's just a bad connection and the cables/harness aren't scorched. I'm really hoping it's not a steering wheel lock issue. I wish I had paid more attention to what the lock was doing when I was changing batteries and screwing around with it last night.

If I didn't love driving this car so much when I do drive it I'd get rid of it. I can't stand all the electronic everything on it, and mine is a base model with no options except z51 6spd package. Glad it is all hud, nav that crap would probably just **** me off. I can't stand the electric doors, the throttle by wire, push button keyless start all of it just seems so problematic. That and mine has the clutch SSB bulletin I'm hoping that master cylinder goes before february when gm won't cover failure on mine anymore. Sorry for the long post any advice, experience, or input is appreciated.

All Stock Ls2

ferdthe4

all stock ls2 thanks for the handle advice I'll have to that. Well I'm baffled now guess I will have to go through the topic I posted that had the wiring schematics. On my way home from work I stopped at the car as it was just in a far away neighbors driveway around 4-5 miles from my house I though screw lets stop and see if she will run. Originally I was going to go home first grab some basic tools and a jack to be able to get under and check the starter connections. But though what the hell maybe she will go and I can get it home on the lift.

Well low and behold she starts right up no problems volt meter showing 13.5 volts or so. Drive it home the few miles go right in the garage bay with the lift before it can shut down. pop the hood got a the wood stove fired to heat the garage up while I rode bike back to my truck left it where the vette was. I get back after riding to the truck, pull the battery cables the ground point by the battery tray was clean and tight. Didn't wiggle at all.

So I raise it up hoping I will find a loose starter connection. Nope get it up main positive connection at the starter solenoid looks good, and was tight no wiggle. The only thing I was little concerned with was the smaller plug on the solenoid that I assume is the low amperage power to actuate the solenoid was rather stiff but it was cold. I couldn't get it unplugged with the dipstick being right behind where I needed to pull the plug, and how stiff the wire was from being so cold. I didn't want to be too hard on it in fear of breaking a cold brittle plastic plug. The main power cable going to the starter looked good I couldn't see any signs of heat damage.

The battery after being out of the car for around an hour showed 13.4 v on my cheap old craftsman meter. I went ahead and put it on a the charger on the low amp setting letting it just sit on there today while at work. If she starts up for me fine after work today I will probably go ahead and drive it into town to leave at the dealer to at least get he low beam head light harness replaced, as it's recalled and mine hasn't been done. I haven't had any head light issues, but I know it should be done. I doubt it's related to my issue, but who knows.

At this point I'm still not sure what my root problem and is guess I will being doing more digging. If it wasn't so much work, time, and money to do so I'd just get a clean C3 and stuff a newer ls engine in it with the fuel injection, five or six speed, and make some suspension upgrades. I didn't think it would shut the car down but maybe it can, in the past it has thrown throttle position codes. About every time I drive it at some point the throttle can be kind of wonky. I've had where it feels like when I get on it the throttle just cuts out completely like a dead miss like it has suddenly just shut then reopened to where it should be all of a sudden.

If it is the throttle body having issues I thought it would just go into a low powered limp in mode. Maybe it's the darn steering wheel lock if it has the start issue again I will have to pay closer attention to the security lock light on the dash and noises the column makes. I guess what I just don't understand is what was wrong with mechanical door handles, a key, and mechanical steering column lock that released with key turning. Wish I could have this car, and drive train without all the electronic garbage like stability control, anti theft, electric doors, electric throttle, key less push button start, etc if only the only major electronics where the ones for running the darn engine. This car and other cars I've had with throttle by wire are making me want to hang on to every vehicle I have that still has a throttle cable. For a while I had a five speed vue four banger for a daily beater that was throttle by wire most my problems with that thing were with the throttle.

ferdthe4

well found this today, will definitely be checking my relays this evening, and plugs going into the under hood fuse box.

Dano523

Close, but still need to go back and pull the upper fuse block again.

This time, pull all the fuses and relays out of the upper box (take a photo so you where where to put them all back in), light up the fuse/ relay tabs in the upper fuse box with electrical cleaner, light up the lower upper fuse box tabs, and the lower connector tabs with contact cleaner to get all the surfaces clean, and before you go to put it all back together, you need to use dielectric grease on all the contact points, including the U prongs for the fuse and relays as well.
Note, since it hard to get the grease down in the upper fuse box slots for the relay and fuse U prongs , you can grease the tabs of the fuses and relay tabs to get grease down in the U prongs that way isntead.

Not only will the dielectric grease prevent corrosion again, but will help as a heat sink paste to help dissipate the heat of the connection points as well (contact heat build up, why the clip in the lower connection point dropped down in the first place).






As for the upper fuse box, it can be split if needed, since the problem may be that the U part that the relay tab clips into, has spread apart to cause a bad contact there isntead.
Hence the low beam jumper wire was not due to problems in the lower blocks, but a trace wire in the upper box that would get hot and snap instead. The same problem can happen for the fuel relay, being not so much the trace wire snapping, but the contact point for the trace wire to the U tab have a bad connection instead.
Note, often with just contact cleaning and dielectric greasing without splitting the upper fuse box fuse and relay contact points on the top of the upper fuse box, will solve problems is the problem is there; the trace wire connection point to the U prong.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...dlights-5.html

ferdthe4

Dano 523 thanks for the advice. Well yesterday after work, I pulled the cover off the under hood fuse/relay box fuel pump relay heck all the relays for that matter looked fine and showed no signs of over heater. Went ahead and pulled the fuse box. The main bulk head plugs under it all looked fine no signs of damaged slots or overheating. Same for the underside of the fuse block. It looked really clean as I would have thought being it's been garaged all it's life and less than 40k on the clock.

Also took my driver side door handle apart while the battery was out to clean the contacts up. Put it back together. Then I went ahead and cleaned my battery cable connectors really well, put the battery back in which showed 13.5v according to my meter. Horn started going off hit the unlock button it shut up.

get in go to start it and it cranks starts up for a second then dies all while the dash and lights all stay on liked it's keyed on still. Try to crank again nothing dash goes blank few seconds then comes on gauges sweep and every light is on. I key it off get out of the car shut it lock it, unlock it, get back then it starts up, and runs fine. After that I shut it off and restarted just fine for five more times before I said screw and went to bed.

I guess I will pull the fuss box box again and really hit with some contact cleaner and put dielectric grease on all the pins on the topside and bottom side. It crossed my mind to do that last night, but didn't

ferdthe4

On a good note the door works great now use to have to press the door handle just right to get her to open up.

All Stock Ls2

ferdthe4

didn't have an eraser handy had some finer scotch brite pads cut a little piece of that and it cleaned the contacts up pretty nice. It is nice not having to fight and cuss at the door every time to get in the SOB.

ferdthe4

pics of my starter connections, ground by the battery tray, and my handle before cleaning it. I would have taken an after pic of the handle, but phone died. Connections on the starter are all tight. Only one I question is the green plug. I can not get that one unplugged to save my life to try and clean it and apply some dielectric grease to it. Took a video of the car starting, dying, then doing the no crank. Going to try and upload it to youtube and put the link in.

ferdthe4

video I took this is the link of it starting then dying, then not starting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Al4...ature=youtu.be

AORoads

You haven't mentioned any codes being thrown---have you seen/read any? I would have thought the three majors (batt., starter, fuses). Codes may take you to down a 'tree' of what to do and check. If the batt. is good as new, can't recall how many but there's a bunch of grounds which need to checked (not just the batt. and starter locations altho those are usual culprits). Altho this doesn't sound like it, it does remind me of the gas pedal sensor(s), but that problem usually causes a limp-home mode with reduced power (significant). But I wouldn't go replacing things without knowing what is the issue. For all we know it could be a short in the system somewhere.

Good luck and keep us posted on how it turns out for you.

Dano523

Get a fuel pressure gauge on the rail so see if it dipping out just after you start it to cause the motor stall.

If the fuse terminal for the fuel pump relay look as bad as it did, then you can bank that the fuel pump connector back at the pump is looking less than ideal as well. Hence if you are getting a fuel pressure dip in the rail, and you know the problem is not longer at the fuel pump relay location int the fuse block, then it has to be done line instead.


Also, if that is the upgraded HP kit, then the fuel pump at the pump should have been changed to a ls-9 pump, so unless something with it went back, would still dare to guess the connector at the tank for the pump instead.

P.S, did not see the volt dip on the dash when the motor stalled, so at least you know that the ECM is getting full voltage at the motor stall.

ferdthe4

thanks for the replies and suggestions guys to be clear the first video I posted was not me or my car just a video I found of someone that seemed to have similar issues to mine. I checked my under hood fuse/relay box after watching that video. I found all my relays, fuses, the box, pins, and bulk head connectors under the box looked fine on my car. To my knowledge other than the mufflers on my car everything is bone stock.


The battery is brand new now shows 13.5 volts roughly when the car is off. When it was running it was showing 14 give or take so alternator seems to working fine as well. This was verified with a volt meter not just the gauge. I haven't pulled codes, but when it's running I don't have a check engine light at all. I'm busy with drill this weekend in the Army Reserves so I won't get to mess with it this weekend until sunday evening maybe depending on what time I get home.


I would have hooked my scan tool off and graphed my accelerator pedal and throttle body positions while it was running and shut down. But I didn't have scan tool with me when I was messing with it. It was sitting in my truck at my old house/shop 45mins away. I first had this problem this past Tuesday Jan 2 when I drove my truck to the old house to drive the vette back to the new house/shop cause originally I was going to leave it at the dealership Wednesday evening to get the headlight harness recall fixed. But that hasn't happened since it decided to be a temperamental now. As soon as I can I will plug my scan tool into it and see what I have.


In the past year that I've had it a couple of times the check engine light has come on. Each time it was throttle pedal or throttle body circuit codes. I can't remember which one the codes were for. I will go ahead and pull the fuse box again and put dielectric grease on all the pins to help out all the connections even though they looked good. Mine showed no signs of scorching or excessive heat like the first video I linked. The second video linked was my car on Thursday night Jan 4 when I was last working on it. Didn't have time last night to screw with it had to get things ready for this weekend.

HOXXOH

I don't have much to add that hasn't already been said about the primary problem you have, but here's some helpful info for the future.

Fill out your profile, so when you or others have questions, that info is available. Your location (State, County, City, or other general area) can be added to your avatar (no exact address), since people local to you may be able to help or you help them. It'll reduce the need to continuously post unnecessary information about you or the car.

Only the '05 had a column lock and no part of the Z51 option affects electronics.

All '08's have 6 speed transmissions. To avoid confusion, we refer to them as M6 or A6.

Think about removing the door handle fingerprint cover. It catches dirt and water, which floats near/into the button assembly, creating corrosion. It increases drag and excess weight that affects top speed and fuel economy. They make washing/waxing a pain and they also look like crap (personal opinion).

A couple of your pics show corrosion at other connections. When the weather gets nice, you might want to disconnect, clean, reconnect, and protect anything you can reach. Position your battery and positive cable to create the most available slack to avoid stress on the solenoid post.

You may dislike electronics, but they are far more efficient than what they've replaced.

You have OnStar, which has been reported to create a starting/running problem, albeit very rarely. It's worth checking and/or disconnecting. Pulling the fuse will eliminate the ability to connect, but only a full system hardware disconnect/bypass can fix the starting/running problem.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...al-method.html

That's for a full hardware removal. You can do a hardware disconnect simply by pulling the connector on the OnStar box and installing jumpers. I took mine completely out for weight reduction. Testing the continuity of the wires being jumped is still a good idea.

We're grasping for straws here, with hopes one fixes the problem.

BTW, thanks for your service to our country.

ferdthe4

HOXXO thanks for the advice and tips, sorry been meaning to update my profile just forgot. When I say 6sp it's an M6, sorry I forget that by that point the autos were 6spd as well. I don't mind electronics where they help, such as fuel injection/engine management. It's just so much more efficient than a carb in most situations, what I don't like electronics in is things that's it's not so necessary like the throttle control. What was wrong with a simple cable. Doors obviously they knew electric handles were dumb enough that they should still have mechanical handles/openers on the interior. I'll read through the onstar thread I hadn't even thought about that garbage yet causing an issue. Glad it doesn't have the steering wheel lock like earlier C6's. Like I said once I'm back and can plug the scan tool in I will and see what I have for codes. And thank you for the support.

HOXXOH

If the throttle was controlled by a cable, it would still connect to an electronic switch, since lots of other functions tie into the throttle opening. Because the switch is part of the foot pedal assy, it eliminates the need for a cable. The good thing is that the sensitivity can be controlled electronically. You can't do that with a cable.

About the door switch. There are several reasons why it's electric, but one is the striker bar. To be mechanical, the latch assembly must be in the door and the striker bar on the door jamb. The space for ingress/egress is limited by the need for the fuel tank location to be forward of the rear wheels. That doesn't allow easy or enough clearance if a striker bar were on the door jamb.

BTW, I've always been a military supporter. Been that way for generations in my family. Currently have 2 active and several retired.

ferdthe4

Well finally hooked up the cheap scan tool to the car last night. No codes which didn't surprise me having the battery out overnight last week probably cleared anything, and haven't run/driven it enough to set any. Don't trust driving it anywhere in fear it will just die on me again. Even recorded some data sets with all the accelerator pedal, throttle body parameters it could do. When I looked through them nothing weird was going on. All of them correlated with each other and didn't have any weird spikes. My coolant temp sensor was jumping around a decent bit which is annoying as I replaced that when I first got it cause it would just suddenly peg out then go back. Maybe got a bad replacement, connection at the sensor is good. I might buy a fuel pressure gauge kit, when I try to hold it at a steady rpm of any kind be it 1000rpm or 2500rpm I can't it fluctuates down then up around 100-200rpm when it goes down almost like the engine is starting to cut out then goes back up. I wouldn't think the ect would give me issues like that. I need to see what the fuel pressure is doing, there isn't any ecm fuel pressure sensor is there I might be able to see on a scan tool? I don't have a great scan tool it's the HF one that has basic data recording capabilities and can read abs codes. looking at the live data I didn't find anything that was a fuel pressure of any kind.

ferdthe4

well got a fuel gauge set up, went in the garage last night started up no issues. When it keyed on gauge went to just above 60psi held that during start up and while running for 10 minutes or so while revving up and down. After shutdown it went down to 55psi after a minute and held there for good while after it was shutdown at least 10 mins before. No codes still but weather has been crappy so haven't driven it enough to set any. Still baffled as to what my dying while driving issue was, and not restarting issue. Fuel system seems to working as should.

So now I'm wondering if it was bad battery caused, and security system didn't reset properly when I frantically threw a new battery in it during the middle of the night when it was single digits when it decided to die on the side of the road. So still a little leery of driving it around. When it was running last night when I'd try to hold a steady rpm it would fluctuate some almost like it was misfiring or letting off the throttle. No codes still.

ferdthe4

I'm gonna unplug the onstar either way, it's not active, and as long as I have it it won't be. Maybe my battery was going on the drive home, when I had problems last week, and when I first replaced it in the cold at night I didn't get the connectors on the best. Not sure going to pull the under hood fuse box and dielectric grease all the connectors just be sure. I suspect my rpm issues is accelerator peddle related or throttle body cause in the past it has thrown a code now and again for one of them.