Roll cage
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Roll cage
Just looking at a wrecked C7 with collapsed windshield (hopefully caused by rescue cutting, not failure) but makes me sure I want a cage. Who makes a bolt in cage for these aluminum tubs?
https://www.corvetteforum.com/articl...ay-bites-dust/
https://www.corvetteforum.com/articl...ay-bites-dust/
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I'm looking for a bolt-in solution from a reputable manufacturer in the Corvette world with experience and proven products for the aluminum chassis generations.
Safety Car
Joined: May 2008
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From: Chesapeake VA
As a NASA instructor I'd never want to be on track with a bolt-on cage.... garbage. All the teams racing aluminum-chassis C6s use bonded plates to weld to. Venture over to the auto-x/road racing forum for more info.
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Hopefully there's a vendor preparing a roll bar or half cage for for C7's.
Racer
Joined: May 2008
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From: Boca Raton Florida
Nothing is going to be as good as a correctly designed full on tub, but do not sell a bolt in cage as worthless. Lotus does in in the aluminum elise/exige. ferrari does it in all the challange cars, 360,430,458. I have see bolt in apps. with backing plates and attachment points that are well engineered. Sure there will be crap with dubious mounting devices and revnut ,etc. But a well engineered product can be made to bolt in, and dealing with aluminum is not easy, welding .boltin, etc. Bonding has issues too. By the way like the handle Flat Crank.. I have had , lotus race cars, alumin frame, panoz race cars full tube frame, spec miata -semi tubbed, and other all have good and bad. It would be nice to see a well made , staged product as mentioned. Rear roll bar-harness bar, then front section then can be added for additional protection. Katech......
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Nothing is going to be as good as a correctly designed full on tub, but do not sell a bolt in cage as worthless. Lotus does in in the aluminum elise/exige. ferrari does it in all the challange cars, 360,430,458. I have see bolt in apps. with backing plates and attachment points that are well engineered. Sure there will be crap with dubious mounting devices and revnut ,etc. But a well engineered product can be made to bolt in, and dealing with aluminum is not easy, welding .boltin, etc. Bonding has issues too. By the way like the handle Flat Crank.. I have had , lotus race cars, alumin frame, panoz race cars full tube frame, spec miata -semi tubbed, and other all have good and bad. It would be nice to see a well made , staged product as mentioned. Rear roll bar-harness bar, then front section then can be added for additional protection. Katech......
I'm fine with "chemical welding" (the kind of bonding that's used around aluminum and composite or "carbon" tubs) but that all starts to run into serious dollars. I'm not a shoestring budget and I ascribe to "if you have a $10 head, get a $10 helmet" so I'm prepared to spend more on proper safety than on going faster, but I don't intend to spend more than necessary.
If need be, I'll have tcdesignfab.com do as much of a cage as he can install without compromising the car. He's been building pro and privateer cars for a decade or more, knows the club rules, engineering standards, etc. I don't need a piece of "jewelry" that's going to fold on me, but hopefully I can get something high grade "off the rack" without paying for the tailored suit.
Safety Car
Joined: May 2008
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From: Chesapeake VA
I can tell you there is nothing "high grade" that is bolt-in for these cars. Most of the bolt-in stuff is garbage used to pass drag race tech. It has tons of space to clear the interior panels. With the C7 being so new even the crappy drag-racer bolt-in stuff hasn't been developed yet. Best to have a shop custom make a rear cage section to your liking.
Personally, I built my racecar out of a C5 because I wanted a steel chassis. Pop the roof off, built cage, bolt back in place. I understand this is extreme for a street car. Personally I'd get a good bolt-in harness bar that uses the upper seat belt attachment points and call it a day. The OEM roof structure is very strong. Sure there's that shot of the silver C7 with the roof compromised, but it looks like they drove under something and then the roof was further cut off by emergency workers.
Personally, I built my racecar out of a C5 because I wanted a steel chassis. Pop the roof off, built cage, bolt back in place. I understand this is extreme for a street car. Personally I'd get a good bolt-in harness bar that uses the upper seat belt attachment points and call it a day. The OEM roof structure is very strong. Sure there's that shot of the silver C7 with the roof compromised, but it looks like they drove under something and then the roof was further cut off by emergency workers.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2007
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From: Greater Detroit Metro MI, when I'm not travelling.
Just looking at a wrecked C7 with collapsed windshield (hopefully caused by rescue cutting, not failure) but makes me sure I want a cage. Who makes a bolt in cage for these aluminum tubs?
https://www.corvetteforum.com/articl...ay-bites-dust/
https://www.corvetteforum.com/articl...ay-bites-dust/
Unless you intend to make a race car out of your C7 and drive around on a racing harness with a helmet on, putting a cage on it is stupid and misguided.
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Roll cages in street cars are known for turning non fatal crashes into fatal ones. A roll cage is just a part of a larger safety system that needs to include a five point harness and a helmet. If you add the cage but retain the factory seat belt, your head will now struck a piece of steel that has no give to it AND sits closer to your head than the existing vehicle structure.
Unless you intend to make a race car out of your C7 and drive around on a racing harness with a helmet on, putting a cage on it is stupid and misguided.
Unless you intend to make a race car out of your C7 and drive around on a racing harness with a helmet on, putting a cage on it is stupid and misguided.
Just look at the hard points around any typical vehicle cabin and there's numerous sources of hard impact in a roll-over long after the thorax and chest bags have deployed.
With a half cage or roll bar connecting to the hard pickup points of the tub (around rear suspension and the sill or seat and belt anchor points) with correctly engineered installation (reinforcement plates to disperse load and prevent penetration, correct HANS dimensions and shoulder harness location, six point anti-submarine, foot box reinforcement) the passenger compartment has added protection of triangles that transfer load to the strongest parts of the chassis.
This doesn't come cheap, but looking at the pancaked C7, I'd say it's necessary for track driving even at the occasional "weekend warrior" level of participation.
Safety Car
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From: Chesapeake VA
That car apparently drove up under something... it wasn't flipped. A rollbar is not necessary for HPDEing the car. There's no real downside, but to think it doesn't present a danger on the street w/o a helmet is kidding yourself. You seem knowledgeable so I assume you know how much a body/steat can flop around in a crash. There's a reason we put rollbar padding on the main hoop behind/over us.
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That car apparently drove up under something... it wasn't flipped. A rollbar is not necessary for HPDEing the car. There's no real downside, but to think it doesn't present a danger on the street w/o a helmet is kidding yourself. You seem knowledgeable so I assume you know how much a body/steat can flop around in a crash. There's a reason we put rollbar padding on the main hoop behind/over us.
I'm certainly not thinking modifications to the car bring no consequences -- it's a compromise and yes the whole hoop will be padded with certified impact foam.
http://www.safetydevices.com/motorsp...mpact-padding/
The optimist in me hopes it was just cut during rescue by "jaws of life" and then folded back into the cabin for towing. Otherwise, I can only hope it was very high speed (130mph+) ... I'd hate to think that amount of compression and intrusion into the cabin could occur under any "normal" collision conditions with another 3500lb vehicle.
Safety Car
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From: Chesapeake VA
FYI rollbar padding is designed for impact with a helmet, not your skull. It's still very high density stuff. I use SFI low profile stuff. Wouldn't want my unhelmeted head hitting it in a crash.
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C7 of Year Finalist (track prepared) 2019
Here are some roll cages we've done. Doing one on an aluminum chassis is not impossible. You just need to make plates to bolt to the frame that you can weld onto.
Racer
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From: Boca Raton Florida
nice cage work, there in those pics.
Until you rely on one you don't appreciate the attention to detail on weld, mounting points, load transfer, and sheer points.
I do agree with Flat Crank, a well designed , rollbar- harness combo is the way to go on a steet-non comp drag, hpde, track,autox car,etc. Till you get to club racing. Once you go to that level it makes no sense to have a half cage/ roll bar set up. But I have seen many porsche gt3 with beautiful bolt in roll bar setups that can be removed if desired and are perfect for what most people will do with the c7.
Plus no issues with the rear bar setup, but once you extend the cage into the fwd passanger area , a helmet,hans,belts, 5/6 pt seat, is all part of the system. Speaking of this stuff, has anyone heard of what happened with the 911 cupcar that crashed and the instructor pasted in the incident and the driver lived. It was a top driver who was instructing, and from what I heard a full on cup car with factory designed cage. THe initial reports in the general press said fire, but then I heard the driver lived after a team removed him from the car with jaws of life.
I do agree with Flat Crank, a well designed , rollbar- harness combo is the way to go on a steet-non comp drag, hpde, track,autox car,etc. Till you get to club racing. Once you go to that level it makes no sense to have a half cage/ roll bar set up. But I have seen many porsche gt3 with beautiful bolt in roll bar setups that can be removed if desired and are perfect for what most people will do with the c7.
Plus no issues with the rear bar setup, but once you extend the cage into the fwd passanger area , a helmet,hans,belts, 5/6 pt seat, is all part of the system. Speaking of this stuff, has anyone heard of what happened with the 911 cupcar that crashed and the instructor pasted in the incident and the driver lived. It was a top driver who was instructing, and from what I heard a full on cup car with factory designed cage. THe initial reports in the general press said fire, but then I heard the driver lived after a team removed him from the car with jaws of life.
Tech Contributor
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I agree the car drove under something or the roof hoop was cut off by emergency workers. I witnessed a C6Z roll over at the Glen. Car went up the tire wall in Turn 6 and came to a stop about 4 to 5 ft off the ground. Then it dropped onto its roof. The roof hoop held up very well. Other than some damage to the paint and fiberglass from spinning around on its top. The rear hatch functioned properly but the A Pillar on the passenger side collapsed. That is why I don't believe roll bars provide any added protection since the roof hoop won't collapse far enough to need the added reinforcement of the bar.
Bill
Bill
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I agree the car drove under something or the roof hoop was cut off by emergency workers. I witnessed a C6Z roll over at the Glen. Car went up the tire wall in Turn 6 and came to a stop about 4 to 5 ft off the ground. Then it dropped onto its roof. The roof hoop held up very well. Other than some damage to the paint and fiberglass from spinning around on its top. The rear hatch functioned properly but the A Pillar on the passenger side collapsed. That is why I don't believe roll bars provide any added protection since the roof hoop won't collapse far enough to need the added reinforcement of the bar.
Bill
Bill
