*WARNING* to ALL BOOSTED C7s
Advanced
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
OK we have found the culprit regarding this issue guys.
The check valve, which actually is a plastic ball in the breather lines, are sticking on some vehicles. This would have started happening with stick cars too in time, but they hit higher vacuum numbers then the auto's do which pull them open again.
The slightest amount of crap on the ball and it will stick, I checked a stock car today that had one working and one stuck.
This is not a "boosted" problem, but a GM problem in my eyes, but we will probably provide a new clipped end without the check valve to eliminate the issue.
Those that are already supercharged, I suggest you just remove the check valve from the hose end, it's pretty simple to do.
You may have had this issue when you were stock, but you would not have created enough crank case pressure to see it's negative effects.
Problem solved!
The check valve, which actually is a plastic ball in the breather lines, are sticking on some vehicles. This would have started happening with stick cars too in time, but they hit higher vacuum numbers then the auto's do which pull them open again.
The slightest amount of crap on the ball and it will stick, I checked a stock car today that had one working and one stuck.
This is not a "boosted" problem, but a GM problem in my eyes, but we will probably provide a new clipped end without the check valve to eliminate the issue.
Those that are already supercharged, I suggest you just remove the check valve from the hose end, it's pretty simple to do.
You may have had this issue when you were stock, but you would not have created enough crank case pressure to see it's negative effects.
Problem solved!
Pro
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 556
Likes: 1
From: Hollywood , Atlanta Fl
As I said above, I don't anyone would disagree that you should use at least a catch can on these motors (especially with FI). Elite has a very nice can (the E2), but I decided to go with the LMR to eliminate any worries with pressure.
As power scales, you'll eventually overpower the stock PCV, but that takes more than a blower kit. They originally made the breather for their twin turbo system, so it's kind of overkill.
Either way, several of us would recommend having something to catch that oil.
As power scales, you'll eventually overpower the stock PCV, but that takes more than a blower kit. They originally made the breather for their twin turbo system, so it's kind of overkill.
Either way, several of us would recommend having something to catch that oil.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,761
Likes: 240
From: Saint Louis MO
St. Jude Donor '14-'15
Unfortunately, this looks like a bad design with the metal-on-plastic construction. As soon as there's any friction, a lack of continuous lubrication will wind up making the ball 'stick' as we're seeing here.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,761
Likes: 240
From: Saint Louis MO
St. Jude Donor '14-'15
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,761
Likes: 240
From: Saint Louis MO
St. Jude Donor '14-'15
Pro
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 556
Likes: 1
From: Hollywood , Atlanta Fl
Yep love working on my cars and it helps when you have a lift. Checked mine tonight and the valves were working fine on my car. Just need a supercharger. Looks like nobody wants my $5k plus.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: Haymarket Virginia
Former Vendor
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,050
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From: Cumming Georgia
I'll have him call you tomorrow to get you an update.Only hold up was head units from Novi, but that has been taken care of
Former Vendor
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,095
Likes: 70
Some customers want to run catch cans, some done, some vent their cars to the exhaust, some into the fenders, some to the front of the blower. It seems everyone, and every shop has their own opinion, which is totally fine. We just chose to vent them to the front of the blower.
Once CARB testing starts, things may change, can't say for sure since thats in the future at this point. Just answering your current question thought.
Thanks!
ATI ProCharger
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,690
Likes: 116
From: Richmond area Va
not familiar at all but is boost or maybe even a bypass puls 'jamming' this ball?
is this gm's new version of a pcv valve to get out of the 'fixed orifice' drawbacks?
i figure the long term fix will show up on the c7z eh?
and LIKE!
is this gm's new version of a pcv valve to get out of the 'fixed orifice' drawbacks?
i figure the long term fix will show up on the c7z eh?
and LIKE!
I would say (and again, I could be wrong here) that it would be an excellent idea for anyone considering a supercharger kit, or has already had one installed, to invest in some sort of a breather.
I just saw MightyMouse today, and it looks like an excellent solution versus the far more expensive LMR box like I have. I believe those types are also legal, unlike mine...
It's a small price to pay for additional peace of mind. In the long run, this might be a fluke, or it may be the real deal. In the mean time, why not have some insurance after buying a kit that costs (at the very minimum) $5000 + install?
I just saw MightyMouse today, and it looks like an excellent solution versus the far more expensive LMR box like I have. I believe those types are also legal, unlike mine...
It's a small price to pay for additional peace of mind. In the long run, this might be a fluke, or it may be the real deal. In the mean time, why not have some insurance after buying a kit that costs (at the very minimum) $5000 + install?
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,761
Likes: 240
From: Saint Louis MO
St. Jude Donor '14-'15
It's much better to have it collect in a box/can than into the bay or out to the pavement.
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 204
Likes: 10
Shouldn't be any - you're just turning it into a breather system at that point by removing the check valve. It all depends where you dump the lines after that, as you'll get oil discharge.
It's much better to have it collect in a box/can than into the bay or out to the pavement.
It's much better to have it collect in a box/can than into the bay or out to the pavement.
Premium Supporting Vendor
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 23,599
Likes: 1,225
From: Providing the most proven supercharger kits for your C5/6/7 609-752-0321
In regards to the catch can, you need to remember that the PCV system does not go back into the intake manifold like previous years did. In those cases the vacuum supplied from being there would pull a great deal of oil into the engine, thus needing the catch can.
I have yet to see any oil on any of the vehicles we have built in the air box, or in the port that goes from the valley to the intake on the drivers side.
Until I do, which we may once these start getting road raced with superchargers etc, then I'm going to say it is not needed. They only serve one purpose, catch oil coming from the breathers, if there isn't any, then it's not doing anything.
The C7 has pretty good baffles inside the valve cover and valley cover, which have made a big improvement on oil consumption threw the PCV system.
This being discussed is for a stock car with a charger, not a 1000+rwhp build which would need more venting most likely, or if the dry sump tank was overfilled.
I have yet to see any oil on any of the vehicles we have built in the air box, or in the port that goes from the valley to the intake on the drivers side.
Until I do, which we may once these start getting road raced with superchargers etc, then I'm going to say it is not needed. They only serve one purpose, catch oil coming from the breathers, if there isn't any, then it's not doing anything.
The C7 has pretty good baffles inside the valve cover and valley cover, which have made a big improvement on oil consumption threw the PCV system.
This being discussed is for a stock car with a charger, not a 1000+rwhp build which would need more venting most likely, or if the dry sump tank was overfilled.
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,906
Likes: 51
From: Tampa Florida
In regards to the catch can, you need to remember that the PCV system does not go back into the intake manifold like previous years did. In those cases the vacuum supplied from being there would pull a great deal of oil into the engine, thus needing the catch can.
I have yet to see any oil on any of the vehicles we have built in the air box, or in the port that goes from the valley to the intake on the drivers side.
Until I do, which we may once these start getting road raced with superchargers etc, then I'm going to say it is not needed. They only serve one purpose, catch oil coming from the breathers, if there isn't any, then it's not doing anything.
The C7 has pretty good baffles inside the valve cover and valley cover, which have made a big improvement on oil consumption threw the PCV system.
This being discussed is for a stock car with a charger, not a 1000+rwhp build which would need more venting most likely, or if the dry sump tank was overfilled.
I have yet to see any oil on any of the vehicles we have built in the air box, or in the port that goes from the valley to the intake on the drivers side.
Until I do, which we may once these start getting road raced with superchargers etc, then I'm going to say it is not needed. They only serve one purpose, catch oil coming from the breathers, if there isn't any, then it's not doing anything.
The C7 has pretty good baffles inside the valve cover and valley cover, which have made a big improvement on oil consumption threw the PCV system.
This being discussed is for a stock car with a charger, not a 1000+rwhp build which would need more venting most likely, or if the dry sump tank was overfilled.
When I had my catch can installed shortly after my sc was installed, I had some oil in the intake and also on the filter where the hose went into the air box.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,761
Likes: 240
From: Saint Louis MO
St. Jude Donor '14-'15
I do have to disagree, though (and you know I don't do that often with you, Doug
). There have been nearly a dozen cases of non-overfilled oil buildup issues (two severe) taken care of in the service department in the last 2 months, and this was from a dealer that caught the 9.8 in PDI.Driving habit? Tolerances? Something else unknown? Who knows. It's pretty cheap insurance for some sort of a can or breather though.
That being said, you just saved GM from a hell of a lot of repair costs if that's all it was with the valve.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,761
Likes: 240
From: Saint Louis MO
St. Jude Donor '14-'15
Premium Supporting Vendor
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 23,599
Likes: 1,225
From: Providing the most proven supercharger kits for your C5/6/7 609-752-0321
I do have to disagree, though (and you know I don't do that often with you, Doug
). There have been nearly a dozen cases of non-overfilled oil buildup issues (two severe) taken care of in the service department in the last 2 months, and this was from a dealer that caught the 9.8 in PDI.Just to comment on this specifically, I have spoken to multiple dealers that have already had cars in for breather issue problems. Thus resulting in oil being forced out the breather lines. They were all stock vehicles, naturally a supercharger will compound those issues.
Once this is corrected the way it has been described in this thread, it is no longer an issue, so I am sticking with my statement of a catch can is not necessary at this point on an ECS SC equipped vehicle.
For one, if there is oil pushed, it will onto go into the air box on our kit, not the intake/engine itself but the vapor is so you do not get any oil smell in the car. Also I have looked at every car here including the one that made 750rwhp, and all are dry as can be.
If for any reason this opinion changes, I will be the first one to post it up!.