2014 A6 trans fluid?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 8,670
Likes: 2,725
From: Atlanta GA
IS that the metric? While the A6 transmission is not as affected as the A8, the old fluid is more hygroscopic so I wouldn't rely on smell or looks. Sure, nice that the pan is clean but that old fluid might be sucking more moisture in. If time degrades the additives in the fluid, does it change color?
The A6 fluid is a different spec from the A8 and was not
susceptible to absorbing water, its been around since 2006 in the vette and we have never heard of a problem with it .
I still don't completely believe the "hydroscopic " story GM tells ,
The A8 shudder is caused by the engagement of the lockup clutch in the converter during V4 mode . The clutch is never really locked up one to one as the TCM pulses the lockup action in the converter during this time , which they have done in the past with other transmissions that use a lockup converter , but in the past we NEVER had an issue with lockup converters and shudder !
It was this pulsing action during 4 cylinder mode that wears the A8 lockup clutch and the mating surface , 4 cylinder mode and a pulsing lockup was really hard on the converters, in my opinion the change in fluid was because they were trying to change the friction modifiers in the fluid to fix the issue, which we all know was not really successful in the early years , they did it a few times if u look at how many times they changed the recommended fluid type until they settled on the current spec which still does not fix the problem, it's just a bandaid . Then in 2017 they actually changed the programing in the TCM which changed the lock up algorithm ...
My 2015 ran the same old 1st generation "hydroscopic" fluid for over 55,000 miles until I had to drop the pan to replace the harness that ffails in the A8 , at that time I took the opportunity to change the filter and then drain and refill it 2 more times with the new fluid , did I have to ....no ....but I figured why not
The difference between my car and the others others is 4 cylinder mode was turned off and my transmission TCM was " tuned " very early in its life
I have other friends who did the same and NEVER experenced a problem with shift bang , shift flair ,harsh engagement, shudder and all the other A8 complaints .... take this for what it is worth but ......
Dave
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 28,369
Likes: 3,258
From: Hartford WI
While you really can't tell the whole story by looking the fluid , you can sure tell alot , is the fluid discolored? Does the magnet have a large amount of material stuck to it ? , whats the condition of the filter ,
The A6 fluid is a different spec from the A8 and was not
susceptible to absorbing water, its been around since 2006 in the vette and we have never heard of a problem with it .
I still don't completely believe the "hydroscopic " story GM tells ,
The A8 shudder is caused by the engagement of the lockup clutch in the converter during V4 mode . The clutch is never really locked up one to one as the TCM pulses the lockup action in the converter during this time , which they have done in the past with other transmissions that use a lockup converter , but in the past we NEVER had an issue with lockup converters and shudder !
It was this pulsing action during 4 cylinder mode that wears the A8 lockup clutch and the mating surface , 4 cylinder mode and a pulsing lockup was really hard on the converters, in my opinion the change in fluid was because they were trying to change the friction modifiers in the fluid to fix the issue, which we all know was not really successful in the early years , they did it a few times if u look at how many times they changed the recommended fluid type until they settled on the current spec which still does not fix the problem, it's just a bandaid . Then in 2017 they actually changed the programing in the TCM which changed the lock up algorithm ...
My 2015 ran the same old 1st generation "hydroscopic" fluid for over 55,000 miles until I had to drop the pan to replace the harness that ffails in the A8 , at that time I took the opportunity to change the filter and then drain and refill it 2 more times with the new fluid , did I have to ....no ....but I figured why not
The difference between my car and the others others is 4 cylinder mode was turned off and my transmission TCM was " tuned " very early in its life
I have other friends who did the same and NEVER experenced a problem with shift bang , shift flair ,harsh engagement, shudder and all the other A8 complaints .... take this for what it is worth but ......
Dave
The A6 fluid is a different spec from the A8 and was not
susceptible to absorbing water, its been around since 2006 in the vette and we have never heard of a problem with it .
I still don't completely believe the "hydroscopic " story GM tells ,
The A8 shudder is caused by the engagement of the lockup clutch in the converter during V4 mode . The clutch is never really locked up one to one as the TCM pulses the lockup action in the converter during this time , which they have done in the past with other transmissions that use a lockup converter , but in the past we NEVER had an issue with lockup converters and shudder !
It was this pulsing action during 4 cylinder mode that wears the A8 lockup clutch and the mating surface , 4 cylinder mode and a pulsing lockup was really hard on the converters, in my opinion the change in fluid was because they were trying to change the friction modifiers in the fluid to fix the issue, which we all know was not really successful in the early years , they did it a few times if u look at how many times they changed the recommended fluid type until they settled on the current spec which still does not fix the problem, it's just a bandaid . Then in 2017 they actually changed the programing in the TCM which changed the lock up algorithm ...
My 2015 ran the same old 1st generation "hydroscopic" fluid for over 55,000 miles until I had to drop the pan to replace the harness that ffails in the A8 , at that time I took the opportunity to change the filter and then drain and refill it 2 more times with the new fluid , did I have to ....no ....but I figured why not
The difference between my car and the others others is 4 cylinder mode was turned off and my transmission TCM was " tuned " very early in its life
I have other friends who did the same and NEVER experenced a problem with shift bang , shift flair ,harsh engagement, shudder and all the other A8 complaints .... take this for what it is worth but ......
Dave
Here is my problem. I actually believe GM. Why? Because I think that they would want to use similar fluids and hope for the best. Just like Ford did in the 2000s with the Powerstroke coolant. Instead of specifying the ELC that was more robust, they specified the old IAT and YOU had to add coolant additive. It did save the dealership from stocking the right coolant that International, the maker of the engine, would prefer you use. Instead, I get shafted with an inferior coolant and I have to, at my expense, use additive to barely get it up to spec. If Ford can do that, I don't see why GM couldn't.
If you believe that the TCM tune could have been the better fix, why do you think that wasn't recommended? Also, why is it some have the transmission issue and some don't and many of those that did opt for the triple flush say that it was cured immediately? Personally, I have a 16. Would you suggest I bring it to GM for a TCM reflash?
Say I prevent the car from going into V4 mode via the program route, is that fixing the issue or masking it?
Not trying to discredit you but honestly curious since I might spring for a TCM program while I am doing an update for the seat memory which seems to not work as well as I like it to.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 8,670
Likes: 2,725
From: Atlanta GA
Akim you can believe what you want to ...those that know me ( I have been around here a while first in the C6 and now C7 forums) know that I don't guess , regurgitate what others say or BS my answers when trying to help somebody
I do all my own work on my car and have personally built ( and blown up) my fair share of fast cars and boats
After this I am done answering your assumptions.... as we already hijacked this guys post to long lol
1 - The A6 fluid was different than A8......
2- Aftermarket recognized right away what the problem was with the A8 , Google " Lube Guard Instant Shudder Fix"
3- GM certified the car with V4 mode , they cant turn it it off , with a auto it just is not a good idea with the way the TCM has to Pulse the lockup clutch , a lockup converter adds many problems when engine goes into V4 , this tech was a miserable failure in the 80's , a total failure in the 90's , they tried again in the 2000's and here we go again ...
4- Because the V4 mode is what is certified and tested ... they cant turn it off , they came up with a fluid with different friction modifiers, the first did not work at , the second works with varing degrees of success, it just depends on how much damage has already occurred with the lockup clutch and its mating surface . There are plenty of posts about getting the flush only to have the shudder return
5- GM dealer will not put the new programing in your 16 . They use a website for all updates , input your serial number and it displays all updates avalable . I was able to use my GM GDS2 , use a 17 serial number and some hocus pocus to get the update. I can assure you that no dealer will do this . At first I used a range device to disable V4 , then I used a Diablo and since I added the blower we used HP Tuners . My guy who tuned the blower also provided me with my latest TCM tune
6 As far as why do some have the problem and others dont .. I have no clue ... but alot more have it than we think as it's the same transmission that is in trucks and SUV's . The same can be said about the C8 Vette's DTC transmission, some only make it to 300 miles , others to 5000 miles and then others have no issue
Dave
I do all my own work on my car and have personally built ( and blown up) my fair share of fast cars and boats
After this I am done answering your assumptions.... as we already hijacked this guys post to long lol
1 - The A6 fluid was different than A8......
2- Aftermarket recognized right away what the problem was with the A8 , Google " Lube Guard Instant Shudder Fix"
3- GM certified the car with V4 mode , they cant turn it it off , with a auto it just is not a good idea with the way the TCM has to Pulse the lockup clutch , a lockup converter adds many problems when engine goes into V4 , this tech was a miserable failure in the 80's , a total failure in the 90's , they tried again in the 2000's and here we go again ...
4- Because the V4 mode is what is certified and tested ... they cant turn it off , they came up with a fluid with different friction modifiers, the first did not work at , the second works with varing degrees of success, it just depends on how much damage has already occurred with the lockup clutch and its mating surface . There are plenty of posts about getting the flush only to have the shudder return
5- GM dealer will not put the new programing in your 16 . They use a website for all updates , input your serial number and it displays all updates avalable . I was able to use my GM GDS2 , use a 17 serial number and some hocus pocus to get the update. I can assure you that no dealer will do this . At first I used a range device to disable V4 , then I used a Diablo and since I added the blower we used HP Tuners . My guy who tuned the blower also provided me with my latest TCM tune
6 As far as why do some have the problem and others dont .. I have no clue ... but alot more have it than we think as it's the same transmission that is in trucks and SUV's . The same can be said about the C8 Vette's DTC transmission, some only make it to 300 miles , others to 5000 miles and then others have no issue
Dave
