Auto vs. M7
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 5,888
Likes: 1,559
From: Calgary Alberta
Maybe change your name to glass houses.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,328
Likes: 405
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 32,225
Likes: 4,624
I have a C7 M7 and will be ordering/purchasing a Z06 next year. (came out of a 2014 GT500 and I miss the HP). I was set on the M7 until I saw the demand for the auto. I am second guessing my decision and was wondering what the reasoning is behind the auto demand. I like the manual but have to admit I hate it in traffic, so much that I will take the DD at certain times. Please chime in and help me make a educated decision. My car will be a fare weather use DD, probably about 5000 miles per year with no track time.
Eric
Eric
Instructor
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 198
Likes: 17
From: Cape Coral FL
manual gives you more control and enjoyment (this part is personal preference), auto is going to give you faster and more consistent performance. I went manual as I enjoy driving manual and the auto has noticeable delay when using it manually (based off reviews and experience of users with the A8 on the standard C7). If they went with a DCT I would of went this route as I feel they compromised with the A8.
My 2 previous corvettes, a c2 and a c4 were manual.
I still have the fun of shifting my motorcycle at age 65.. and My ZO6 will have black wheels, they look good, and chrome along the coast does not hold up and I don't like to try and keep the clean, getting the car to drive.
Regards,
Viper
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,342
Likes: 604
You're cherry picking one data point to support your hypothesis when almost nobody will ever see top speed. On all other contests of speed, the C7 Z06 A8 will beat your ZR1 so yes, it is technically superior if that's how you want to determine technical superiority. BTW, have you seen the top speed for the A8? It's going to be higher than the M7, I can promise you that...the gearing is better matched for top speed. Using your hypothesis above, that alone makes it technically superior.
Seriously, I don't understand how you can ignore the technology in the 8L90. It's also difficult for me to understand why any "real enthusiast" wouldn't want to go faster but I accept their preference of the M7 because it's "more fun" to them. You've made your choice, now go enjoy it.
Seriously, I don't understand how you can ignore the technology in the 8L90. It's also difficult for me to understand why any "real enthusiast" wouldn't want to go faster but I accept their preference of the M7 because it's "more fun" to them. You've made your choice, now go enjoy it.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,328
Likes: 405
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,342
Likes: 604
You don't even know what you're arguing about...the essence of which is obviously over your head. Don't look now, but bong water is dribbling out of your bedazzled glass slipper.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 20,933
Likes: 905
From: salem OR
Well, it's been great the past 13 years with my `01 Torch Red ZO6 shifting to my delight...what a joy!
Pumping my left leg and shoving my right arm has had great benefits. I swear my left leg is twice the size of my right, and my right arm well you guessed it is twice the size of my left.
But what fun!
I like to think that as I have gotten older, I am a little smarter from all my life's experiences, and my ZO6 has certainly helped in that way.
When my new `15 Black ZO6 shows up it will come equipped with the new dual mode 8-speed automatic. No more pumping my left leg or shoving my right arm as this transmission will not only shift for me, I can shift it myself in manual mode. By pumping my thumbs on the paddle shifters located on the steering wheel I can make my baby climb up and down that rev meter as I desire.
Only problem I can think of now, is that in a few years my left and right thumbs are going to be about the size of my big toes from all the thumb pumping.
Oh my.....I guess that's the sacrifice of having all that fun pumping my thumbs.
Boring paddles shifters are not it!
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 969
Likes: 20
From: Salida, Colorado
This issue is larger than just auto vs manual..
With 80%+ of C7's going auto for whatever lame excuse, maybe GM will go "screw it" and not even make a manual option for the C8...
Those of us that enjoy manuals would be so screwed by all the lazy bastards. Ok maybe that is strong terminology, there are real reasons to get the auto like: knee/leg problems, being real old, driving a Z06 everyday in bad traffic (not sure why anyone would buy a Z06 to do that), but by far the majority of auto buyers don't fit into those above categories.
I don't know, having more fun in my sports car is a little bit more important to me than a .2 second advantage on a 1/4 mile run.
With 80%+ of C7's going auto for whatever lame excuse, maybe GM will go "screw it" and not even make a manual option for the C8...
Those of us that enjoy manuals would be so screwed by all the lazy bastards. Ok maybe that is strong terminology, there are real reasons to get the auto like: knee/leg problems, being real old, driving a Z06 everyday in bad traffic (not sure why anyone would buy a Z06 to do that), but by far the majority of auto buyers don't fit into those above categories.
I don't know, having more fun in my sports car is a little bit more important to me than a .2 second advantage on a 1/4 mile run.
Last edited by Callsign_Vega; Dec 1, 2014 at 04:55 AM.
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 4,737
Likes: 551
From: North California
Driving pleasure is about rowing through gears and putting power down through the rear wheels. Everything else is far detached.
Automatics/dct ruin the driving experience. I like manual when I coast, park, drive through traffic, etc. I always like it more.
Automatics/dct ruin the driving experience. I like manual when I coast, park, drive through traffic, etc. I always like it more.
Advanced
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
From: Burke, VA
I've seen DCTs referred to as automatics in literature but never automated manuals, they are no where close to the same. You could just as easily say the DCT is an evolution of torque converter automatics.
You need to get a book about the details of the 8L90 and DCTs, they do shift gears the same exact way. The 8L90 has one clutch releasing and one clutch applying on each shift just like the DCT, that's why it's called clutch to clutch architecture.
You need to get a book about the details of the 8L90 and DCTs, they do shift gears the same exact way. The 8L90 has one clutch releasing and one clutch applying on each shift just like the DCT, that's why it's called clutch to clutch architecture.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 450
Likes: 4
From: Springfield PA
I do not daily drive my car but most of my seat time is measuring jobs for work. Many times having a conversation on the Bluetooth and speaking with my employees. If my car was a weekend cruiser I am sure I would opt for the manual, however it does not see much weekend duty as I have nowhere to go other than down the shore and that is where the traffic comes in. If I did not drive the car for work I would have 350 miles on it and that is a waste of a car to me anymore.
I am not old and do not have bad knees yet, just thinking to try something different for a change.
Eric
I am not old and do not have bad knees yet, just thinking to try something different for a change.
Eric
Pro
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 576
Likes: 3
I just cannot make myself give up the joy and thrill of shifting gears on my own coupled with that loud engine noise. Z06 is an extremely loud car. It's not your C300 or 328. It's a different type of a car.
Then again, I dont ever see myself daily driving this car to and from work. A) It wouldnt survive the pot holes and low clearance areas, B) if it did survive those, it woudnt survive vandalizers, thieves, and other annoying kids who'll be all over the car and C) I honestly think it would be a bit too much to deal with in terms of the noise.
This is a car you drive at the weekend in mountains or country roads or take it to track, and for that, manual is the perfect answer. I mean watch the Carlos Logos video and the noises the car makes and reaching that shift lever and pressing the clutch, that entire experience is just priceless.
Automatic just ruins it.
EDIT : I have owned dual clutch M cars (4 of them to be exact) for the past 6 years. So this is coming from an automatic/dual clutch owner.
Then again, I dont ever see myself daily driving this car to and from work. A) It wouldnt survive the pot holes and low clearance areas, B) if it did survive those, it woudnt survive vandalizers, thieves, and other annoying kids who'll be all over the car and C) I honestly think it would be a bit too much to deal with in terms of the noise.
This is a car you drive at the weekend in mountains or country roads or take it to track, and for that, manual is the perfect answer. I mean watch the Carlos Logos video and the noises the car makes and reaching that shift lever and pressing the clutch, that entire experience is just priceless.
Automatic just ruins it.
EDIT : I have owned dual clutch M cars (4 of them to be exact) for the past 6 years. So this is coming from an automatic/dual clutch owner.
Last edited by DerStig; Dec 1, 2014 at 08:59 AM.
Heel & Toe
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
I've seen DCTs referred to as automatics in literature but never automated manuals, they are no where close to the same. You could just as easily say the DCT is an evolution of torque converter automatics.
You need to get a book about the details of the 8L90 and DCTs, they do shift gears the same exact way. The 8L90 has one clutch releasing and one clutch applying on each shift just like the DCT, that's why it's called clutch to clutch architecture.
You need to get a book about the details of the 8L90 and DCTs, they do shift gears the same exact way. The 8L90 has one clutch releasing and one clutch applying on each shift just like the DCT, that's why it's called clutch to clutch architecture.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/201...n/#more-805018
This does not look identical to DCT's, since DCT's do not have brake clutches.
In terms of DCT's being called Automated Manual Transmissions (AMT's), there are hundreds of such articles. Here is one of the earlier ones from 2003. I will not post hundreds of such links, as easy searches on Google will pull up all kinds of articles and websites.
http://www.unofficialbmw.com/images/SHIFT1.pdf
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 840
Likes: 22
From: Dade City Florida
Change
I'll be happy to do that as soon as he (or you) can provide links to corvette engineers specifying that the A8 is "technically superior" to the M7. If speed is the only criteria, then my ZR1 is technically superior to my M7 Z07 due in this week. Would you agree?
I've got no hate toward anyone with an auto...as I have many myself. However, like others here who prefer hi po cars with manuals, I'm tired of a few here who boast that their auto is somehow superior.
I've got no hate toward anyone with an auto...as I have many myself. However, like others here who prefer hi po cars with manuals, I'm tired of a few here who boast that their auto is somehow superior.
Scraping the splitter.
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,111
Likes: 1,029
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
Some of you ITT are embarrassing yourselves by casting aspersions and labeling people based on what transmission selection they have or will make. Pro tip: it's none of your damn business why they choose an A8 or an M7. Buy what you want and spend more time worrying about your own choices.
S.
S.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,342
Likes: 604
You see I have earned in blood what I am telling you and all that argue this mute point of top end, auto vs stick as I spent 3mo in ICU and lost my L leg by an individual attempting to demonstrate his driving abilities with his new M3 in a parking lot, knowing my race prepared vehicle was being set up for a mountain run. I've loved sticks also all my driving life, unfortunately because of an idiot have no way to feel the clutch. A8 for me in my ZO6 and nothing near top end! Above all be safe as the results can be life long.
As for the tranny issue, I really couldn't care less what someone else chooses. The part that got me about this thread was JerriVette claiming that cars with an A8 are technically superior. I do agree that it's a fact of life that the manual's as we know them today, will soon become a thing of the past. Because I'm not a racer, I just prefer the manual experience when driving a hi po car. I've really tried to like the paddles in my other cars, but eventually become bored and end up leaving them in auto.
Again, sorry for the hand you've been dealt. Were you able to sue the guy, and/or did he go to jail?
Last edited by Glenn Quagmire; Dec 1, 2014 at 12:04 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,509
Likes: 107
Change is something very difficult to do and unfortunately as we age it becomes more difficult. Not saying only "old" find it difficult as there are many "old" young adults and young old people. Times are changing like it or not, adapt or get left behind. Enjoy what you have as it's current life span is limited. With all those who talk about top end, even track use etc., I venture to say almost none of you will attain it or even get close. Hopefully all who attempt will do so on a track of sorts as otherwise there are going to be a lot of dead or maimed people out there. You see I have earned in blood what I am telling you and all that argue this mute point of top end, auto vs stick as I spent 3mo in ICU and lost my L leg by an individual attempting to demonstrate his driving abilities with his new M3 in a parking lot, knowing my race prepared vehicle was being set up for a mountain run. I've loved sticks also all my driving life, unfortunately because of an idiot have no way to feel the clutch. A8 for me in my ZO6 and nothing near top end! Above all be safe as the results can be life long.