Funny you should mention that.

The B-52's and KC-135's at the base I was stationed at used canisters of gun powder(the size of coffee cans) to kick start their engines when a klaxon was sounded.

 

....it is the stupidest thing to ever be added to a SPORTS car.

 

I'm far from a greeny! My street rod get's ~10 mpg with modest throttle. Heck at WOT can watch the gas gauge move with its 850 CFH Holley Double pumper sucking sound though 14" diameter X 5" high K&N and long tube headers.
Granted some are not good. Have rented a few BUT on our 3rd BMW X5 SUV and it's seamless. So well done, don't know the engine is off or starting if you have the sound system on. Foot off the brake and engine running before your foot is on the gas pedal.

But I chuckle at all the "Hate Start Stop" won't use it folks. They are being lead like sheep to the slaughter into only EV's no choice all that can be sold (CA now and Europe in 2035 but will be the US, just watch January 2025.)

I far prefer hybrids, stop/start and whatever it takes to get double the mpg and cut CO2 in half than the foolish Only Zero fossil fuels, no gas stoves etc. If you missed the statement about cows in the "We're going to build 500+ foot wind tower power 10 miles from East, West and gulf Coast speech, it was said Cows are 20 times worse greenhouse gas CO2. It was said we're going to tackle that as well Yep recently crunched some numbers:

Yep you're going to enjoy those veggie burgers when you pull up to that fast food joint in your EV!

Yep my 8.2 Liter BB gets ~10 mpg when cursing. At WOT can watch the gas gauge move! I'll take stop/start and the 160 extra hp in my E-Ray hybrid before I'm forced into an EV!

 

I just received a letter from Honda (for my 2020 Pilot) that they have been having premature starter failures and as such they are extending the warranty for the starter and any related starter parts to be covered for 10 years (no mileage limit). The feature obviously puts added stress on the starter system and is annoying as hell. I too purchased and installed an autostart eliminator so that I don't have to worry about pushing the disable button every time I drive the car. I'll do the same on any car that I may purchase down the road that uses this feature.

 

^^^
I've asked the BMW service rep and he says they have not had an issue with BMW starters. German Engineering versus Japan! 

As I said don't even hear mine, perhaps they are using the shut engine off after an ignition occurs with that cylinder just after TDC. Then that retained pressure does most of the work cracking the engine. Uur 3 BMW SUV's have started BEFORE you can get you foot from brake to gas pedal!

BTW all 4 of the LT2 cylinders that shut down in V4 Mode close the valves in a sequence that keeps pressure in all 4 cylinders.

 

After you use in across various platforms you either disable it or ignore... I have yet to get a rental car in Europe that does not have it. No big deal - MILLIONS of cars on the road with it...

 

When has a manufacture's service rep EVER admitted to a problem? My son took his Equinox in for a KNOWN timing chain issue. The service rep told him it would be an expensive repair (knowing Chevy had extended the warranty on the timing chain) and suggested he buy a new car. My son bought a new car before he talked to me. I had read about the extended warranty.

 

Perhaps but we have had 3, currently she has a 2021 and daughter in OH who travels 5o miles to work has the 2018 with zero issues. Not statistically very significant but in this case great service tech. His wife is a BMW sales person, usually chat with her when I wait for the wife's car to be serviced. As I said BMW of the many year old straight 6 may be using what some do versus the starter or to help the starter. Stop the engine right after a combustion event just after TDC and use that retained pressure to turn the crack.

SIDEBAR
Of interest when the LT2 goes into V4 they close the valves in a sequence to retain pressure in all 4 shut down cylinders. Quoting:

• Although both intake and exhaust valve lifters are controlled by the same solenoid in the valve lifter oil manifold assembly, the intake and exhaust valves do not become deactivated at the same time. Cylinder deactivation is timed so that the cylinder is on an intake event. During an intake event, the intake cam lobe is pushing the valve lifter upwards to open the intake valve against the force of the valve spring. The force exerted by the valve spring is acting on the side of the lifter locking pins, preventing them from moving until the intake valve has closed.
• When the intake valve lifter reaches the base circle of the camshaft lobe, the valve spring force is reduced, allowing the locking pins to move, deactivating the intake valve. However, when cylinder deactivation is commanded ON, the exhaust valve for the deactivated cylinder is in the closed position, allowing the locking pins on the valve lifter to move immediately, and deactivate the exhaust valve.
• By deactivating the exhaust valve first, this allows the capture of a burnt air/fuel charge, or exhaust gas charge, in the combustion chamber. The capture of exhaust gases in the combustion chamber will contribute to a reduction in oil consumption, noise and vibration levels, and exhaust emissions when operating in V4 mode cylinder deactivation mode.

IT'S EASIER IF JUST TRYING TO USE CAPTURED COMBUSTION GASSES TO START THE ENGINE. JUST HAVE TO STOP THE ENGINE SLIGHTLY AFTER TDC WHEN IGNITION OF ANY OF 6 CYLINDERS IN THE CASE OF OUR BMW OCCURS.
Not sure they are doing that but seldom hear the starter. Only if at a red light very long on a hot summer day when the engine restarts IF the cabin temp can not be maintained. Typically if only our normal one light stop the AC Evaporator blower continues to put cold air from the very cold coils into the cab. Even on 95F days.

 

My 2022 doesn’t have this feature, but my 2023 Buick does and has a “Start/Stop” feature “Disable” button and I would expect Chevrolet to have the same if, and when, this annoying operation is added to the Corvette.

 

Don't have this on my 2023, but typically it's not a big deal to defeat as long as there is a physical button. If they bury it in the infotainment it's going to likely require a trickier solution or possibly ECU tuning. Typically with any digital physical button you can just install (make or buy) a small circuit between the button and it's harness. The circuit remembers the state you left the button in when you turn it on/off. If you had stop/start off then when the car starts the circuit will send a short 12V signal as if you pushed the button. I had this on my audi and my denali until it was able to be tuned out. The only sucky part is how bad taking the dash apart is on the particular vehicle, the audi was stupid simple, the button area just unhooks and pulls out with a little tool. The Denali ('19 ultimate) had a more involved process of taking it all apart. Not bad just people do get skittish about taking dashboards apart on new vehicles, though that's the best time to do it before the plastic gets old and brittle.

 

Hate it and call it stupid all you want. Without it on a large percentage of the ICE passenger vehicle fleet, manufacturers would not be able to offer cars like C8s. On that basis alone, you should applaud it as incredibly smart, especially since it can be turned off with a button press.

Rest assured that it is "on" during EPA fuel economy testing, and the default must be on at start-up.

It's the fleet average that determines whether a manufacturer meets CAFE regulations or not. Thus far GM has been able to meet CAFE requirements without having to include start/stop on C8, because it represents a very small percentage of the GM passenger vehicle fleet. That could be coming to an end as the requirements get more stringent. The feds can levy large civil penalties on manufacturers out of compliance.

Fortunately, ICE Corvettes will continue to survive for perhaps 6-10 more years because the GM fleet will become increasingly electric, and that will keep GM's CAFE numbers within spec.

 

So you 've become VEGAN?

 

I wonder what the "cow equivalent" is to drilling, collecting, transporting, and refining all the oil produced on the planet? I wonder if Jerry has a chart for that.

 

I usually have my left foot on the brake and my right on the accelerator. The feet are not necessarily coordinated so I may push on the accelerator before releasing the brake. What does S/S do in that situation?

 

My f80 M3 had auto stop/start. It was totally unobtrusive. I wouldn't mind having it on any car. If it can increase fuel economy or reduce emissions, why the hell not?

 

The cost of one starter and installation labor will more than offset any perceived fuel savings for the life of the car.

 

lewislgZ06 - thanks for posting the link for the disable module. Interested in one for my Lincoln Corsair.

 

 

I think if you enjoy the feature then it may be working well for you in your particular use case and on that platform. I find that it's a hit or miss depending on how/where you drive and the implementation of the technology. For example I live in the Houston suburbs. It's very hot here much of the year, these systems won't always shut down to keep the AC going. Also there isn't a ton of traffic in the burbs, all our lights around me are smart lights and tend to change pretty optimally. I also work from home so I rarely go into the city proper and sit in huge lines of traffic. What happens for me is I will stop at a light and 15 seconds later the engine will turn off once its decided my cabin doesn't need AC anymore. Then the light will then turn green in another few seconds and I'm left wondering what the point was. Too many times it will do it right as I'm about to lift my foot off the brake. Some implementations also suck where you may not be able to easily toggle the feature (i.e. buried in infotainment) or when cheaper cars do it but their insulation sucks and in our heat it turns the engine off for a whopping 10 seconds. I really prefer to install a defeat with memory or a default to off defeat if that's the only option (often with ECU tunes).

I still use the feature in my cars in heavy traffic if I do make it into the city. Where it makes sense I can understand toggling it on and not wasting fuel in say our very short winter when you're in a 7 mile long traffic jam or sitting at old dumb lights.

As far as fuel consumption I don't know how it averages out, it must help something, but I think it will be again implementation, user and environment limited. Anecdotally a Subaru I got as a rental had a start/stop lifetime fuel saving counter in the infotainment and in it's like 20k miles the thing saved like 14 gallons according to its computer. So a whopping $42 here in Texas. I doubt the computer is very far off, because the math on fuel usage at idle load is pretty straight forward. The car knows how much fuel it's injecting (i.e. fuel pressure, pulse width, etc...) so it's as simple as seeing how many seconds it was off for and how much fuel it would have injected to maintain idle. That Subi also had the toggle in the infotainment, so you know most people weren't finding it to turn off for every drive cycle. Maybe a 6.2L could show bigger savings than a hamster sized 4 cylinder, but I'm not convinced they're that great for those not spending their entire drives in traffic.

 

My 21' 911 tts has that annoying option, that I was able to get programmed out with the tune, it also cancels out if you switch into sport or sport plus mode