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Bracket racing strategy...

 
Old 05-24-2006, 10:07 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by Red96Coupe
Glen... Again... Your On The Money Great advice... Another thing I do...if there is time for an "extra" time shot & I'm lined up vs a slower car.. I will fender race him...and see just how close I can get at the stripe (MOV)

I think it was 2 years ago E Town was having "American Iron" vs "Imports" and they had 4 different ET brackets.. I entered the 14.00 to 15.99 .. Thus was the FASTEST car/cars in the class I was holding about 1.5 sec I made it to the semi finals.. However you have to realize my opponents were FWD Hondas.. & to be "polite" none of em really "Killed the Tree"

Point being is learn how close you can judge the MOV. Ralph and some of the others have a piece of tape on each side window .. they just line it up with the other cars point of reference (Great Idea)... I tried but just cant get it down...
Who you kidding John - -If you could have the window down at the 1000' you'd be like my LAB going down the highway
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Old 05-24-2006, 10:16 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Red96Coupe

Point being is learn how close you can judge the MOV. Ralph and some of the others have a piece of tape on each side window .. they just line it up with the other cars point of reference (Great Idea)... I tried but just cant get it down...
'tape-on-the-window', or 'bulls-eyes', are a useful tool, but since your head can move-around in the cockpit, your 'angle' may change, like a bowler lining-up a few boards to either side of his normal starting-point, yet throwing over the same arrow down-lane:
back-when NHRA Heavy was 'just' 12.00-13.99, trap-speeds didn't vary nearly as-much as a 13.50-car versus a 10-flat car (maybe 100 MPH to 114 MPH ? ), and 'fender-racing' was done more-frequently (and I sucked at-THAT, too! ).

Since the finish-line beams are 6" off the ground (I believe? ), it isn't our tires that trip the timers, especially in the tighter-sprung C4/C5/C6 cars that most Corvette-guys race, but more-likely, it is the nose or chin-spoiler that stops the clocks:
my Z28, on the other-hand, has plenty of front-end travel, and under-power, even the air dam may pass above the beams, and it is quite-possible that the '82 Corvette I hope to race maybe the same-way, so it is equally important to know 'WHAT' to look-for when judging your opponent at the stripe.


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Old 05-24-2006, 10:21 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Red96Coupe
Thats fine but remember your NOT a 9 sec car.. & I KNOW that...
Maybe or Maybe not. I plan on doing a little more work.

Last edited by Tsab; 05-24-2006 at 10:26 PM.
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Old 05-24-2006, 11:45 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by jd_v3tt3
Who you kidding John - -If you could have the window down at the 1000' you'd be like my LAB going down the highway
No I didn't mean getting the window down (open) I meant I cant master the way of lining up the other car with the tape on the window
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Old 05-25-2006, 08:46 AM
  #25  
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Glen, i have the seat marked so i can get it in the same position everytime. Push my helmet against the head rest and close one eye. However it only works when the top end speeds are fairly close. That air dam is a bigger problem. Under full power i think it clears the beams, but when i'm on the brakes the air dam and maybe even the bottom of the bumper hits the beems. So by nailing the brakes at the stripe, my car is about .02-.03 quicker. Makes things that much more difficult......for both drivers. Took me a while to figure out why i was breaking out with wider than expected margins until i realized what was happening. However, the other driver has a similar challenge. If the other driver is cutting it real close, he wont know which part of my car is taking the stripe.

Now if i could just make it past the tree without going red for a change
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Old 05-25-2006, 09:05 AM
  #26  
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ralph:

I had thought-about getting a NASCAR-type headrest, to 'lock' my head in-place, but never acted on it, and, as you say, it'll REALLY only work with similar trap-speeds.

The air-dam on my Z28 is likely to 'drop' INTO the beams if I try dumping directly AT the stripe, so I just run out-the-door:
I couldn't figure-out how I'd go-quicker by smacking the binders everytime, until we got a few pictures of the car at-speed.....


I figure if I ever got into the situation where a guy with similar MPH had half-a-fender on me at the stripe, I'd try 'DROPPING' into the beams to take the stripe, but can't recall doing it....


I've only run the car 3 times in 12+ years, but I am starting to get the 'itch' again.....
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Old 05-25-2006, 01:04 PM
  #27  
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Just ordered those 6 piston brakes.
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Old 05-25-2006, 02:54 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Fuzzy Dice
Maybe you'll forget what you found by the time you come back...
between the pain and the meds, I wouldn't count that out!

....what were we talking about?
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Old 05-25-2006, 08:06 PM
  #29  
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[QUOTE=Glensgages][B][FONT="Tahoma"][COLOR="DarkRed"]Generally-speaking, YES, but if you can't cut a light, chances-are you will be First Round Runner-UP more-often than not:

I've got my lights between .075 & .005, and a few red ones every now and then.

Attend as-many test-and-tune sessions as you can, and begin keeping as-detailed notes as you can about every run (was there a head/tail wind? was the sun shinning, or did the clouds hide it? ), in addition to the obvious temperature/humidity/barometric-pressure:
as crazy as it sounds, even us-guys in 14-second cars NEED to know how our cars react, especially if racing against much quicker/faster cars.

I try to run as many events that I can. Some times 3 events in a day,ex. 2 in the AM session & 1 in the evening session. Last year I made 158 passes down the 1/4 mile. And I have every pass recorded just as you suggest.

Thanks for all the info that you have posted so far. It really helps a lot.
I'm going to test some of this new "to me" info out tomorrow. There's a trophy marathon at Englishtown. That's a garanteed 7 runs, win or lose. Of course I plan on wining all of them.

Again thanks for the info.
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Old 05-25-2006, 09:25 PM
  #30  
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The luxury here, is that I can get a dozen or twenty runs in one night. 1/8th mile has to be good for something. I've done 120 runs in a little more than a year, and my car was under the knife for 5 months of that.

Working on staging consistently and keeping my lights under .050. I can pull good ones, just not all the time. I have A.D.D. at the tree.
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Old 05-25-2006, 10:14 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
The luxury here, is that I can get a dozen or twenty runs in one night. 1/8th mile has to be good for something.
You 'might' be better-off getting 6-8 GOOD-runs in, with good data-acquisition between each run, properly cool-off the car, get your thoughts together, even 'predict' a dial-in for the next run, and THEN make another run
(make a 'game' of it..... see if your RT is closer to perfect than your 'predicted' dial-in, and get your total-packages as-low-as you can, even during T&T-runs ):
hot-lapping the car may give incorrect ET data if the car isn't cooled-down enough, and beats-up your equipment, but may provide extra chances at hitting-the-tree.

1/8-mile racing is the BEST bracket-racing there-is:
it has the few basic components of bracket-racing.....
dialing-in, staging, cutting a light, making a few quick shifts, and judging the stripe.

Not-all 'good' 1/4-mile racers are good 1/8-milers, but ALL good 1/8-mile racers are EXCELLENT 1/4-mile racers:
1/8-mile bracket-racing just 'eliminates' 660' of 'useless' asphalt.


Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
Working on staging consistently and keeping my lights under .050. I can pull good ones, just not all the time.
CONSISTENT lights within .050 are better-than CONSISTENT lights within .060, but not-as-good as CONSISTENT lights within .040:
with-practice and good habits, you CAN get them within .030 of each-other on a CONSISTENT-basis (80%-plus ), but don't go 'trying' for ocassional .00/.01 lights.....

A racer who can cut .045, .055, .050 back-to-back-to-back is better-off than the guy who cuts .000, .100, then an .050 , yet they both have .050 averages:
let the killer-RTs come to YOU!


..... did I mention 'CONSISTENT' ?????


Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
I have A.D.D. at the tree.
Get yourself a practice-tree and practice, practice, practice:
Cruz Pedregon's website has an on-line 4-tenths Pro-tree which is better-than-nothing, but it can't replace a tree you can place in your car, with a pedal Velco'd to the floorboards, where you can 'practice-like-you-race', IN the car, hands ON the shifter and steering wheel, and feet ON the pedals.


One of the Biondo boys once said:
"We ONLY have to concentrate for a very-few seconds at a time:
if we can't do-that, we don't DESERVE to win!!!!!"

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Old 05-26-2006, 06:04 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Glensgages


1/8-mile racing is the BEST bracket-racing there-is:
it has the few basic components of bracket-racing.....
dialing-in, staging, cutting a light, making a few quick shifts, and judging the stripe.

Not-all 'good' 1/4-mile racers are good 1/8-milers, but ALL good 1/8-mile racers are EXCELLENT 1/4-mile racers:
1/8-mile bracket-racing just 'eliminates' 660' of 'useless' asphalt.[/COLOR]


I have to tell ya until last summer I didn't know a whole lot about 1/8 mile racing...I had raced a couple of events but just because of the purses...

The Lakeland Challenge was then started and I've been racing 1/8 mile a bunch and you could not be more correct...everything happens twice as fast so you better have serious driving skills...R/T's are incredibly important since there is no time to drive around anyone...if you are left at the tree you are on the trailer...everyone runs on or very near their number too...it's tough but I like it...

At Moroso last weekend (1/4 mile) I could not believe how much time I had (in my mind) on each run...it was like slow motion compared to 1/8 mile racing which is a good thing...I screwed it up but it sure was a nice feeling to have soooo much time to make decisions during a run....

Lastly, the payouts are so much better at 1/8 mile tracks down here...on any Saturday night the 1/4 mile pays $400 to win...the 1/8 mile tracks pay $1000 and there are a bunch of "special" events per year that pay $2 to 3 grand to the winner...btw, this is for foot brake/no electronics sportsman class...

I just realized that three of the racers at the 1/8 mile Lakeland Challenge also race at the 1/4 mile Bradenton Challenge and guess what....they are first, second and third in points at Bradenton...hmmmm..

Last edited by Fuzzy Dice; 05-26-2006 at 06:09 AM.
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Old 05-26-2006, 06:17 AM
  #33  
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Remember after all is said and done.You have to make one desission,
do you just let up on the gas a little and stay in the power band of the motor ?or do you stomp on the brake and lose all foward motion ?drop out of the power band and it is hard to recover.That is always going through the faster drivers mind also.
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Old 05-26-2006, 07:56 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Fuzzy Dice
At Moroso last weekend (1/4 mile) I could not believe how much time I had (in my mind) on each run...it was like slow motion compared to 1/8 mile racing which is a good thing...I screwed it up but it sure was a nice feeling to have soooo much time to make decisions during a run....
Because you HAVE-TO make better/quicker decisions 1/8-mile racing, going to a 'regualr' facility is like shooting fish in a barrel with a bazooka:
it is the equivalent of Tiger Woods, comparing the mental-pressure of competing in the Masters Tournament to playing a round of mini-golf....



1/8-mile racing is easier on your equipment, and sharpens the skills you need to become a better bracket-racer.
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Old 05-30-2006, 08:32 AM
  #35  
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Thanks Glen and everyone else who contributed to this thread! This wannabe bracket pilot is low on the learning curve and found the content here very useful. As soon as my IRS is back in action, I will be working on everything discussed to improve my performance. Say Glen, I'd like to see your Z-car in action and that's a mighty purdy color!
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Old 05-30-2006, 08:36 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Red 69
I'd like to see your Z-car in action and that's a mighty purdy color!
I'm as color-blind as can be, and when I bought the car new in '78, I tried to get some matching 'ORANGE' touch-up paint for the car from the dealer:
the parts-man looked at me like I was

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Old 06-03-2006, 04:23 AM
  #37  
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Update... the strategy worked, took home the trophy tonight.

Dial hard, pull a good light, let it all hang out, and let the cards fall where they may.

I'm on the left. I gave the guy .035 to work with, and he used up .033 of it running off his dial.



None of the guys there buy my, "I'm new at this" thing anymore. Loudmouth PA announcer keeps blowing my cover.
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Old 06-03-2006, 07:15 AM
  #38  
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Conrgats CC, great news
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Old 06-03-2006, 07:48 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
Update... the strategy worked, took home the trophy tonight.


Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
Dial hard, pull a good light, let it all hang out, and let the cards fall where they may.

I'm on the left. I gave the guy .035 to work with, and he used up .033 of it running off his dial.
If you dialed a .78, and it ran a .799, what had it run in previous rounds where you hadn't lifted?


Originally Posted by CentralCoaster
None of the guys there buy my, "I'm new at this" thing anymore.
Loudmouth PA announcer keeps blowing my cover.
"Screw" with your competitor's heads..... "tell" 'em that you dumped, because you had bagged a few hundredths on the dial-in, and you were lucky you didn't run-under..... make 'em 'think' about what YOU are doing, instead what they SHOULD-BE doing:
if you can convince them that you are/were sand-bagging a few hundredths (when you weren't ), and you run them next event, they may 'dial-soft', thinking that you are, too.

Let 'em believe that you were lucky and that you are stupid, and the next time, you can use their ill-gained over-confidence against them, too!
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Old 06-03-2006, 11:08 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Glensgages
You 'might' be better-off getting 6-8 GOOD-runs in, with good data-acquisition between each run, properly cool-off the car, get your thoughts together, even 'predict' a dial-in for the next run, and THEN make another run
(make a 'game' of it..... see if your RT is closer to perfect than your 'predicted' dial-in, and get your total-packages as-low-as you can, even during T&T-runs ):
hot-lapping the car may give incorrect ET data if the car isn't cooled-down enough, and beats-up your equipment, but may provide extra chances at hitting-the-tree.

1/8-mile racing is the BEST bracket-racing there-is:
it has the few basic components of bracket-racing.....
dialing-in, staging, cutting a light, making a few quick shifts, and judging the stripe.

Not-all 'good' 1/4-mile racers are good 1/8-milers, but ALL good 1/8-mile racers are EXCELLENT 1/4-mile racers:
1/8-mile bracket-racing just 'eliminates' 660' of 'useless' asphalt.



CONSISTENT lights within .050 are better-than CONSISTENT lights within .060, but not-as-good as CONSISTENT lights within .040:
with-practice and good habits, you CAN get them within .030 of each-other on a CONSISTENT-basis (80%-plus ), but don't go 'trying' for ocassional .00/.01 lights.....

A racer who can cut .045, .055, .050 back-to-back-to-back is better-off than the guy who cuts .000, .100, then an .050 , yet they both have .050 averages:
let the killer-RTs come to YOU!


..... did I mention 'CONSISTENT' ?????



Get yourself a practice-tree and practice, practice, practice:
Cruz Pedregon's website has an on-line 4-tenths Pro-tree which is better-than-nothing, but it can't replace a tree you can place in your car, with a pedal Velco'd to the floorboards, where you can 'practice-like-you-race', IN the car, hands ON the shifter and steering wheel, and feet ON the pedals.


One of the Biondo boys once said:
"We ONLY have to concentrate for a very-few seconds at a time:
if we can't do-that, we don't DESERVE to win!!!!!"



Glens knows what he's talking about. Following his advice, I went from winning only a few rounds one year, to finishing top 10 in 2 different Corvette Challenge series the following year, even though I missed 40% of the races due to mechanical failure, then injury. And THAT was with an inconsistent car!

Thanks Glen! Can't wait for you to get to FL to see what OTHER tricks you have up your sleeve!
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