5.0 Engine
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 190
Likes: 1
From: Marina del Rey CA
i have a 99 mustang gt and still enjoy it. it is nothing compared to the new vette, but it's still fun to run around in. i bought it new when i was giving up a vette and not in a position to buy another one at the time, so it was the best bang for the buck (and i had spent college in my dad's 70 mustang and had loved it). i wouldn't take a new mustang over a new vette, even considering the cost difference, they just aren't in the same league, but i still feel happy and excited that the mustang is getting a nice engine upgrade. if yer gonna bitch, go for the solid rear axle. unless they are finally fixing that in the gt...
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,331
Likes: 148
From: 1000 Islands Ontario
I'm not a Ford basher - but I am a Chevy lover. I would grab a new Z28 over the Mustang in a New York minute.
The horse has needed more cubes for a long time, and it finally got it.
I am not a fan of DOHC heavier and higher profile engines that border on the exotic. What I really do like about the new mill is the tubular exhaust manifolds that one of the engineers designed in his house. Love to see that and DI on the next gen LS3.
Notice how all the new Lincolns are 6 cylinders? Baaad move. And the new Caddies are headed in that direction too (except thankfully for the CTS).
IMHO the revised engine is a good move for Ford. Long live the performance cars.
M...
The horse has needed more cubes for a long time, and it finally got it.
I am not a fan of DOHC heavier and higher profile engines that border on the exotic. What I really do like about the new mill is the tubular exhaust manifolds that one of the engineers designed in his house. Love to see that and DI on the next gen LS3.
Notice how all the new Lincolns are 6 cylinders? Baaad move. And the new Caddies are headed in that direction too (except thankfully for the CTS).
IMHO the revised engine is a good move for Ford. Long live the performance cars.
M...
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,464
Likes: 1
From: Chicago
FUEL ECONOMY (city/hwy) 6-speed Automatic 6-speed Manual
5.0L 4V Ti-VCT V-8 17/25 (est.) 16/24 (est.)
BASE CURB WEIGHT (POUNDS)
Manual transmission 3,875 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Automatic transmission 4,000 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Weight distribution (f/r) 54/46 (est.) 54/46 (est.)
Specifications subject to change without prior notification
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...-liter-v8.html
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 1
From: Central Jersey, Union County N.J.
St. Jude Donor '10
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,823
Likes: 383
From: Bandon, OR
You are correct with the GT500. However, your trimming some pounds on the GT.
FUEL ECONOMY (city/hwy) 6-speed Automatic 6-speed Manual
5.0L 4V Ti-VCT V-8 17/25 (est.) 16/24 (est.)
BASE CURB WEIGHT (POUNDS)
Manual transmission 3,875 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Automatic transmission 4,000 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Weight distribution (f/r) 54/46 (est.) 54/46 (est.)
Specifications subject to change without prior notification
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...-liter-v8.html
FUEL ECONOMY (city/hwy) 6-speed Automatic 6-speed Manual
5.0L 4V Ti-VCT V-8 17/25 (est.) 16/24 (est.)
BASE CURB WEIGHT (POUNDS)
Manual transmission 3,875 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Automatic transmission 4,000 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Weight distribution (f/r) 54/46 (est.) 54/46 (est.)
Specifications subject to change without prior notification
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...-liter-v8.html
Last edited by millpond; Mar 2, 2010 at 03:19 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,464
Likes: 1
From: Chicago
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,464
Likes: 1
From: Chicago
I like some cars and, dislike others.
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Team Owner
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 32,074
Likes: 296
From: San Francisco CA
I just wish that on these new Mustangs they would bring the cost below 30,000 and price them accordinglybecause it is still a solid live rear axle (durable) but terrible ride. Also weight distribution is not 50/50 too heavy up front.
You pay more for this car that is at a high tech car price range when it actually isn't really anything new.
At some point you get into Corvette pricing terrority with some of these Mustangs as they have too many different versions of them.
You pay more for this car that is at a high tech car price range when it actually isn't really anything new.
At some point you get into Corvette pricing terrority with some of these Mustangs as they have too many different versions of them.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 1
From: Central Jersey, Union County N.J.
St. Jude Donor '10
No manual needed. There are cars i like and dislike as well. I wasn't actually referring to you and i'm not now. Some of us just see things differently then others. The way i see it only fools complain, condemn and criticize, i prefer to speak positive things.
Last edited by chazc6; Mar 2, 2010 at 12:01 AM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,246
Likes: 5
From: West Coast
4 CAMS = Headaches & $$$$$
I've owned cars with exotic DOHC and upkeep and repairs were a nightmare. Have you ever seen the chain/belt setup on a DOHC engine?
I don't know if the 5.0 Ford version will be a belt or chain setup. If it is a belt, good luck replacing that belt every 60k.
KISS = Keep It Simple Stupid
GM's V8 with a single cam and push rod design that makes 430HP and gets 20MPG+ is a bullet-proof design.
I've owned cars with exotic DOHC and upkeep and repairs were a nightmare. Have you ever seen the chain/belt setup on a DOHC engine?
I don't know if the 5.0 Ford version will be a belt or chain setup. If it is a belt, good luck replacing that belt every 60k.
KISS = Keep It Simple Stupid
GM's V8 with a single cam and push rod design that makes 430HP and gets 20MPG+ is a bullet-proof design.
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 190
Likes: 1
From: Marina del Rey CA
ok, i am officially way off topic. and i am sure we could all go on noodling body details forever.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 41,732
Likes: 1,718
From: Springfield MO
The oil burning on the early cars was a result of a stupid GM engineer spec'ing mild steel head gaskets. When GM finally caught on to what was happening, they changed over to Stainless Steel head gaskets and the problem was solved, but too late to help the Vega's sales. The American public was scared silly of the engine, thus the car didn't sell. The Pontiac version of the Vega, came with the Iron Duke cast iron engine in an effort to gain back the lost Vega sales. The Iron Duke engine was the original 4 banger offered in the 1962 Chevy II that was a sales disaster. GM dropped the engine from the Chevy II, but moved the machining equipment to South America where the engine was used in some cars built in South America for the South American market. Later, when GM introduced the FWD "X" body cars in 1980, the Iron Duke was the base 2.5L engine used for years and years.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,464
Likes: 1
From: Chicago
I have just seen threads from car guys complaining about guys that do not like the cars they like. I just find that odd. Nobody likes all cars unless you sell them.
Racer
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 262
Likes: 3
From: Des Moines WA
Racer
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 262
Likes: 3
From: Des Moines WA
You are correct with the GT500. However, your trimming some pounds on the GT.
FUEL ECONOMY (city/hwy) 6-speed Automatic 6-speed Manual
5.0L 4V Ti-VCT V-8 17/25 (est.) 16/24 (est.)
BASE CURB WEIGHT (POUNDS)
Manual transmission 3,875 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Automatic transmission 4,000 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Weight distribution (f/r) 54/46 (est.) 54/46 (est.)
Specifications subject to change without prior notification
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...-liter-v8.html
FUEL ECONOMY (city/hwy) 6-speed Automatic 6-speed Manual
5.0L 4V Ti-VCT V-8 17/25 (est.) 16/24 (est.)
BASE CURB WEIGHT (POUNDS)
Manual transmission 3,875 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Automatic transmission 4,000 (est.) 4,000 (est.)
Weight distribution (f/r) 54/46 (est.) 54/46 (est.)
Specifications subject to change without prior notification
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...-liter-v8.html
Racer
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 262
Likes: 3
From: Des Moines WA
This is a common mis-conception. The Ford engine has 4 valves per cylinder and dual overhead cams. That sounds great sitting around the service center with one's tweed cap on and chatting with the guys. However, from an engineering standpoint, there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING superior about a DOHC engine that weighs more, takes up more room under the hood and has an inferior BSFC (admittedly, I do not know the numbers, but I'm betting the LS3 has a superior BSFC).
In addition, since:
HP = RPM x TQ / 5252, and the smaller displacement motor has to rev higher to achieve HP (which is the reason for the 4 valve heads - they do breath better), the smaller engine has less TQ on the bottom end.
TQ on the bottom end is what pleases the soul.
HOWEVER, I still like Ford. If they didn't make Chevy's - I'd buy a Ford. I do like the way the new mustangs look. The problem is, Ford went the wrong way when they developed the modular engine, now they're stuck with it. The only way to get big HP out of it is to put 4 valve heads or a blower on it.
In addition, since:
HP = RPM x TQ / 5252, and the smaller displacement motor has to rev higher to achieve HP (which is the reason for the 4 valve heads - they do breath better), the smaller engine has less TQ on the bottom end.
TQ on the bottom end is what pleases the soul.
HOWEVER, I still like Ford. If they didn't make Chevy's - I'd buy a Ford. I do like the way the new mustangs look. The problem is, Ford went the wrong way when they developed the modular engine, now they're stuck with it. The only way to get big HP out of it is to put 4 valve heads or a blower on it.
Different means to an end. Not one better than the other.
Racer
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 262
Likes: 3
From: Des Moines WA
I'd assume current Camaro owners are the ones who would feel threatened by the 5.0 upgrade. Car mags have already been claiming the current stang GT outdoes the current camaro just imagine what they will say with that much more power on tap. And yes I know car mags aren't the final word on how things are but when they all outrank the camaro with the gt it says something. Somebody mentioned the Z28 against the new GT but isnt the Z28 basically the GT500's competitor?
A final note, it is nice to see power still on the increase in different models. it seemed we were about to be done and headed for a pathetic period like the 80's.
A final note, it is nice to see power still on the increase in different models. it seemed we were about to be done and headed for a pathetic period like the 80's.
The Z28 and GT500 will be a good match 556hp(est) vs. 550hp and similar weight. That is, if GM ever builds the darn thing.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,464
Likes: 1
From: Chicago
And yes, a little lighter and, smaller then the Camaro which is a huge reason so many women prefer the Mustang.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,892
Likes: 1,200
From: Ft. Myers FL
Amazing.... I like cars...especially American muscle type cars. So to me a Mustang's a pretty nice car & I'd consider buying one. I also like Camaro's & Challengers too. Now, that being said, they're are not Corvettes. But, what is? I'm glad they came out with a new engine. However, the main reason is competition forces everyone to get better. The next Vette will probably have a 5.5 liter 450 HP small block in it. It just goes on & on...and that's actually a good thing. 
If the Fords cost more (like the C4 ZR1's & the Northstars did) then they won't survive. I think Ford learned & profited from GM on that as well.
PS as far as GM & Ford sharing!? Here's a trivia tid bit for you. I owned a 64 GTO with an all syncro 3 speed manual on the floor tranny. Blew the gears one day back then when hit an ice patch. Had a heck of a time getting another 3 speed. Why? Because it was a Ford trans. Pontiac used them a the standard GTO 3 speed in the 64,65 & 66 GTO's.
If the Fords cost more (like the C4 ZR1's & the Northstars did) then they won't survive. I think Ford learned & profited from GM on that as well.
PS as far as GM & Ford sharing!? Here's a trivia tid bit for you. I owned a 64 GTO with an all syncro 3 speed manual on the floor tranny. Blew the gears one day back then when hit an ice patch. Had a heck of a time getting another 3 speed. Why? Because it was a Ford trans. Pontiac used them a the standard GTO 3 speed in the 64,65 & 66 GTO's.
Last edited by Mike Campbell; Mar 2, 2010 at 10:37 AM.