The shop uses Dupont. And when I was getting prices from the place they get their paint from, I was told it would be around $800-$1K for Dupont paint. I wasn't really interested in paying that much for paint.

So, I think the best thing would be to ask the shop teacher if I could bring my own paint in. I would also bring some instructions that also tells what tip to use and the drying times, etc. to help them out. And I'll go from there.

 

you may be better off going to maco and getting their deluxe job . you bring inferior materials into their shop they may refuse to use it. i would . good luck with it .

 

Ok. Though if I brought in SPI products to the school to shoot, then those should be good materials, right? The only non-SPI would be the color. And for that, I've been looking at the Motostorm ss black.

 

if they will use it. just stick with good quality . many painters have not heard of spi .

 

As soon as I get all the fluids changed, then I'll talk to the shop teacher. I wanted to do that before it gets painted.

What brand/type ss black do you normally shoot?

 

the epoxy is easy to apply it is the sanding that is harder (harder than sanding 2k primer or HB but not that hard) to fill small imperfections from the body work (if your body work is perfect then NP) just do not expect to fix the small inperfections such as improper glazing putty application etc at the primer level.

I always apply epoxy as sealer before base.

the first time I applyed epoxy I thought that I could deal with some verrrrrry small minor rock chips with just epoxy like I would with HB, well 4 coats later it worked but was not fun. it just does not build up like 2k or hb2k and is a lot harder to sand than 2k. but it is tuffer than heck and does not srink back at all.

More Than Zero

 

Does body work mean when you fix things? Like cracks or dings in the plastic?
And when you apply epoxy as a sealer before base, do you reduce it any?

I'm just wondering if the shop would be able to sand the epoxy smooth enought to paint ss black on.

 

Does body work mean when you fix things? Like cracks or dings in the plastic?

Yes

And when you apply epoxy as a sealer before base, do you reduce it any?

Yes


I'm just wondering if the shop would be able to sand the epoxy smooth enought to paint ss black on?

Yes but it will not be in the plan unless you tell them first. most shops will skimp on the sanding before base coat anyway.

with black any and I mean ANY inperfection in the texture of the finnish that you cannot level out in the color sanding operation will stick out like a neon light. epoxy is great from the standpoint that once you get it perfect it does not srink and is verrrrry durable. on the down side it takes longer to get it right than putting HB on and block sanding it to perfection and most shops are all about getting the work out the door and the money back in the door.

keep in mind that I'm a perfectionist when it comes to my vette's paint and some of this would not bother the average person.

More Than Zero

 

have you visited the SPI website and looked at there write up on the perfect paint job?

 

I'm no paint expert here at all, I have recieved manytimes help here from great people. But you keep asking things to get what appears you want to hear. You don't listen to the people here. Cool, so your having someone else do this work, so they will do it how they need to, and if you don't like it that way you need to go somewhere else!! Sounds like your just being cheap having this school do the job anyway. You want it done different go to the best out there and get it done the way you want. You can't have the best and get it for free from people who are in school learning! Ok lets hear the Flamming.

 

no flamming but i do disagree, it is a fact that you get what you pay for, but it is also true that many people get much less than what they pay for.

being informed about the products and processes is the first step to getting the most for your money. it is also helpfull to understand your internal goals and thru discussion I often find that I have come to understand my own goals better.

if I put myself into the position of the students (assuming that they are there because they like cars and painting) I would love it if someone brought in a corvette for me to learn on (provided that the person is not a jerk) and I'm going to be doing the work ayway.

IMO

More Than Zero

 

I think I skimmed through that. I'm signed up on their board. I've been busy. I'm getting all the fluids changed right now. Over the weekend, I drained the coolant and removed the top shroud on the radiator to clean out the leaves, and I noticed there was oil in the coolant. So, I'm looking at figuring out what that is. I'm getting the coolant system pressure checked with the oil filter off to see if there is any coolant leaking from inside the oil cooler. I hope that is the problem, if not, then it is probably headgaskets. I believe the shop at the school do tear into engines and do things like headgaskets. That would save me $1k.

By the way, I got a new rear hatch weatherstrip from Willcox. The hatch weatherstrip on there now is seperating from the plastic piece that snaps onto the car. Would you recommend that I go ahead and replace the hatch weatherstripping, or wait till after it gets painted?

 

I'm just trying to get some ideas of what to do from people who paint Vettes. That way, I can get a better understanding of what is involved before I discuss it with the paint shop teacher to figure out what limitations they have i.e. if he feels they can get it straight enough to paint ss on epoxy vs. having to use HB.

He may paint it how he wants to. Or he may be willing to paint it with some recommendations in mind i.e. use this size tip, put so many coats of epoxy, let sit for a day, sand with so and so grit. Put so many coats of ss with so and so flash time inbetween coats etc.

Yes, I understand it would be best to take it to a regular paint shop to get painted. But I plan on selling it within a year and I don't feel like loosing $3k on a paint job that may or may not be a good paint job. Look at the original poster, Georgia1974. He painted his Vette himself and it looks very good.

The shop teacher told me they use Dupont from so and so paint store. I stopped by the paint store to get some prices on paint. The guy who has been there 5 years told me that the schools paint jobs he's seen look really good.

 

Porchdog..... can you define these statements? I have to learn the new lingo:
Die Back
Glamor Coat
2 Coats of Peel or Trash
No 2k - what is 2k ???

Also - can you clarify:
1. that you do like using ONLY epoxy primer with no high build primers (like Z-chrome?)
2. that you allow each coat of epoxy primer dry thoroughly (can you define various dry time scenarios and whether forced heat is necessary). I was going to rent a downdraft heated booth for $600 and decided against it.
3. that although allowing epoxy primer to cure longer makes it harder, this would also enable it to stay 'flat' and serve as a more stable and rigid sub surface.
4. I was planning PPG, you stated you're PO'd at DuPont. Why and are they better? Cost of paint (in my opinion) is insignificant at this stage when you consider the time and effort invested.
5. Do you have a thorough write-up on your paint technique.
6. Thank you

I am going with black and was absolutely decided on a BB/CC.... but now you got me thinking. ???? I know what you are talking about when clear is sanded and turning white.

FYI - when I painted my 72 Monte Carlo back in 1996 I let it cure for 18 months before I color sanded and buffed it.I just sold it a few months ago, it was NOT garage kept (in extreme Houston sun) and the black paint w/ BB/CC that would still poke your eyes out.... still flatter than flat and hard hard paint! In fact I took it to a shop a few years ago to have them buff out the hood for me (I got lazy) and they said it was the hardest paint they had ever encountered. It was PPG. I will try to post a pic.

 

i use only spi epoxy / ppg concept / spi uv clear on a job. i like things simple and only 3 products on a car lessens the chance of failure. epoxy does not shrink or react to temp once cured. i can adjust the effort of sanding with the cure time of each coat before sanding . sometimes i want it to cut slower then in the final stage with 600 i want it to cut a little faster.

i use concept ss for color . i just prefer it over base . the last coat of color is a glamor coat. car is sanded and the last coat is done slowly to get the best finish before clear.

i clear twice . 3 coat then block with 600 then 2 final coats . this way i end up with only 2 coats with any urethane wave or trash .

if given enough flash time i have no problem with die back. which is solvents coming through your top coat or shrinkage of any kind.

everyone has their own system or products. this is just what i prefer .

i'm the porchdog and i approved this messge ................

 

Hi Josh,

If you want to sell at a good price, you should get the car painted with the original color (using the color code). Second, I agree with others who tell you that you are going to get the instructor angry. The instructor has too many things to worry about and he would rather deal directly with the paint jobber than you. I am guessing they must like you somehow since they are painting another car for you. Around here, they will only take one or two cars for tens or hundred people. Please let me know your secret.-)

If you cannot afford Dupont, ask the instructor for Nason, Dupont's cheaper line. For my Honda, the instructor told me that Nason will be good enough, last six years rather than 10 years with Dupont. T


For my current car in another and better vocational school with an established program, the instructor would not accept their cheap line of paint (Crossfire) and decided the top of the line BC/CC Martin Senour paint. And my car was originally painted using acrylic enamel!!! Good quality paint will cost about $1000 in materials alone and you will have to pay for it.

The school work will be better than Maaco but not much, especially since students need to graduate whether they finish your car or not.-) Count your self lucky if they do a half decent job. The good thing is that they use good quality materials so should last a long time.

For C4, all paint was clear coated. This means you should go for base/clear to have an original look.

I think you will lose money to sell the car in this market after getting it painted. Therefore, get the job done right not like your Firebird which faded in a few years. I hope you do not tell the shop that you will be sellling the car. This will ensure the worst quality job since they would assume you would not care for the quality of the work because you have a buyer lined up.

C4ZF6nut

 

Although learning more will get you more respect, I find that you need to respect the instructor and defer to him. In my case, the NAPA store says the school uses mostly Crossfire (inexpensive line) of Martin Senour paints but the instructor will not accept that for my car. The instructor jokes with me that he knows I could pay for the more expensive line. I showed him the quote from NAPA store for Cross Fire and Tec lines, and he looked briefly at the numbers and told me not to worry.-)

I read a book on automotive paint by German authors recently and think that the paint technology is pretty involved. I know would rather pay for the premium line of paint rather than do an experiment by mixing different paint lines. The school likely has experience with a line of products because that may be what the instructor uses or the trade in an area uses. Around here, it is Martin Senour so I will not push any other paint on them including Sherwin Williams (makers of Martin Senour) which has a shop right by NAPA.

C4ZF6nut

 

My dad is on some board with the school. He talked to the head administrator years ago and he said I could have my Firebird worked on and painted there. I had wrecked it and needed a new windshield, hood, fender front bumper, etc. $3k just in parts. That was in 2002 so they were probably still spraying enamel.

Yes, I see what you are saying and I'm not gonna push that they use the paint I want to supply them. I'll ask him to see if he would be okay with it. I've been waiting 3 months now. It is cold out so I'll just get it painted when it warms up. That is probably when my name will reach the top of the list anyways. I've got all the lights pulled and molding off except the front bumper molding and fog lights which I'm not pulling the nose off just for that. I still need to pull the 3rd brake light, side mirrors, the outer door window seals, and maybe the door handles. If I don't, then they'll just tape everything up.

I don't think the paint job will look any worse that it already is. I can tell it had a cheapo tape-off paint job by the PO. It looks nice and shiny, but has lots of rock chips, crows feet on driver door, a small crack under the corner part of the hatch behind the driver door, and millions of micro white specs on the nose.

I see what you are saying by sticking with the original color code and bc/cc. Though, I doubt most buyers would even notice it isn't the correct black. When I bought it, I didn't even know it was a repaint till I felt behind the outside mirror and it felt ruff from not being sanded as it was painted still on the door.

Do you think it would be easier on the students to spray ss or bc/cc? I think I'm still going for ss. That is if I can use the paint I want. If not, bc/cc Nason may be better than ss Nason.

Got any tips on painting around the hatch weatherstripping without leaving a "tape line"? Mine is in good shape, but the stripping is seperating from the base. I have a new one here, but am debating about installing it after it gets painted, or before.

"I think you will lose money to sell the car in this market after getting it painted."

I'm guessing you are meaning that I won't get my money back from paint materials? That I pretty much figured. I already knew when I bought it that when I sold it I would be loosing a few thousands. But figured you live once, what the hell. Plus gas prices are real low now, so I hope it stays that way when I put it up for sale.

 

Hi Josh,

The very old alkyd, acrylic, acrylic urethane ss, acrylic urethane bc/cc are all enamel!!! If there are trim parts you want to put on, I think you can tell the school to pull them off and paint, and then put the new trim in. That is what I am doing. I gave them a complete set of seals for my current car including windshield, door, trunk etc.

Your car may have been painted acrylic urethane single stage six years ago and may be fading. The red is particularly prone to that. Now, some claim the Nason black is brownish. It is probably the effect of the Nason clear being a little yellow. My Honda was painted dark gray metallic and it does not look yellow. The paint looks a little darker than what is in the door jambs and it has not faded in the last year. The instructor had my car nearly the whole year from October to June and he was barely able to finish the spray job. In all fairness, part of the problem was that when he needed body parts, I could not supply some in time and he had his students fabricate the parts on the right quarter panel. Guess where the paint is bubling now....I am not so worried about it since bubling area can be fixed and painted in any shop.

The CC is a litle rough to the feel meaning it was not color sanded, but the paint job is pretty good otherwise. I have not sanded it yet in a year.-) Nason CC is a high quality product. I had bird poo caked on the car over two weeks, which I was able to wash off with no marks.

For my Honda, the paint code was matched by Finishmasters which sells the product to the school. The paint jobber is a veteran of the trade, and worked with the instructor long before and had a good relation. He was very polite and very knowledgable. I find the BC/CC paint to be very well sprayed even with taping. The paint cost for me was around $400, but my car had rusted in the rockers, quarter panels, bumper support etc. so I think I spent around $1000 total. It does not make sense for a car which is maybe worth that much, but I did not bother selling the car and am still driving it.

For my other car, I bought primed rocker panels and gave it to the instructor since I knew this was the first area they would work on. The instructor decided to fix holes in the steel with fiberglass rather use the parts I bought.-) Although I do not like fiberglass on a steel body repair, it is something he wants to do in his class. The priority for the instructor is teaching the kids, not your car. I do not want to stand in the way of his teaching. This instructor is very cool, he offered to show me how to do body work, including fiber glass etc. Check with the instructor if he will let you work on the car, it is like getting a free education.


C4ZF6nut