449er

You never heard of a bb Chevy motor called a rat? Man, I am getting old or you are way young!

kenba

Exactly like I said. Street Hemi's are nothing like the HP ones. The factories over stated the HP of the lower performance engines & under stated the HP of its high performance ones. My 63 stock R code Ford was never beat by a 409 but I got my *** handed to me by the Hemi's. Don't see how anyone can say a factory HP SB could beat a factory HP BB.

GTOguy

I've known about the term'Porcupine Head' ever since the song came out when I was about 5 years old....56 now. I've heard the term 'Rat motor'about as long. My folks would get me second hand Hot Rod magazines in the early/mid '60's and I was addicted to the whole idea of big engines and hot- rodding. When I was 7, and dad came home with an almost-new '66 Mustang, the first thing I did was run around the back of the car to look at the louvered trumpet duals sticking out of the valence panel.....and they weren't there. Single exhaust, under the valence, and a 2bbl carb on the 289. What a disappointment. At least it had a RED interior, though!

68hemi

I sold the car a couple of weeks ago.
It is a street Hemi not a race Hemi but blueprinted to NHRA stock specs.

MikeM

From my post #14:

[SIZE="2"]Aside from that, they lost their advantage on the street due to restricted exhaust, skinny tires and greenhorn drivers. It wasn't hard to beat them in a drag race with a light car and a SBC engine.

In real life street trim, most if not all BB cars would not even break into the 13's. Even if an amatuer prep is done to the BB cars, it was a different story on the strip. Anywhere in the 12's was easily obtainable.

Street, different deal. I don't recall getting beat by any BB on the street for some distance of 1/4 mile or less. If you beat me, take two steps forward.

Powered by 327/375, L 84.

427 Galaxies in street trim were not very formidable around here. I assume that's what you mean by "R" code? But neither were the 409's in street trim either. It's all relative.

kenba

The R code Fords were 427/425 HP rated. Did you race any 427/425 Ford fairlanes? I would guess not. That would be apples to apples as far as weight goes. Love your Nova. Looks like you ran modified production.

DZAUTO

That is exactly correct.

That is even more correct.

DZAUTO

And again, that is exactly correct---------------------OR, he just ain't a real Chevy person.

MikeM

The Thunderbolts were race cars, not street cars. I never saw a ThunderBolt on the street nor did I see any race Hemi's. Let alone in street trim.

Saw lot's of 409's, lot's of Galaxie 427's, 440 Mopars and a couple of street Hemi's in street trim.

Anyone with half a mind knows that sooner or later, the cubic inches will turn you around, sooner or later.

B/MP with 2 X 4's

B/FX with the Rochester injector.

One added comment since someone (you?) mentioned 1966, the SS cars under discussion here were limited to 7 inch tires that year. That wasn't enough for a BB car back then and cost a lot of ET. Not nearly so bad on the SB and again, gave them an advantage in initial traction. I'm sure you know what happens in the first 50 feet has a lot to do with what happens at the finish line.

Stan's Customs

We had a similar addiction when we were young...other than Dad bringing home anything hot rod related...in fact he passed when I was 14, which forced me to become a mechanic if I wanted anything to drive.

I did Ed Roth T-shirts and sold then on the school bus, as they were hard to get in a sleepy little Texas farm town. To say I was a car nut would be an understatement....and I'm still quizzed about my early cars by classmates at class reunions. (what happened to them and so on)

Maybe I didn't ever hear the term Porcupine Head was because I was in the Army..about the time the song came out you mentioned when you were 5 years old (51 years ago). Draftees tended to have a gap in life that never existed mentally..especially in Nam. I dunno, I was big into music before and after the Army..always had an 8 track and a trunk full of tapes after the Army (and the radio constantly on before the Army).
What was the name porcupine song you mentioned? I'll google it.

Thanks...Stan

MikeM

Dated text from Mechanix Illustrated, April 1965 referring to the MK II BB as "porcupine head".

https://books.google.com/books?id=A-...engine&f=false

Stan's Customs

http://vintage-nitro.com/the-porcupi...ery-rat-motor/

Here's a link I googled that mentioned the porcupine term. I'm guessing that some "nick names" were known better in some parts of the USA than others....maybe that's why it's so strange to me.
Communication was far slower back in those days...sometimes it would take over a year for a "new" movie to come to rural movie theaters.

I sent a pal in Germany a " 8 hour reel to reel" tape of of local radio station tunes as I BS'ed to him about what was going on at home in between songs. I was in love then and was working all night on a portrait of my soon to be wife, while I ran the recorder and listened to the radio.

He said it played for weeks in his his company as he loaned it out to others...

Anyway..the last paragraph in the link above which mentioned several monikers says this:
........................................ ........................................ ........................................ .....................
"The Rat Motor, big brother to the Mouse.

For most rodders and racers, however, there was only one legitimate moniker for the new engine. If the small Chevy V-8 was a mouse motor, it’s bigger, more powerful, fiercer sibling could only be a RAT motor.
The name has stuck. Today, only old school hot rodders and nostalgia buffs still employ the terms mouse motor and elephant motor. The name rat motor, however, is still universally used to describe the big block Chevy V8. Far from being a derogatory term, the expression rat motor is much-loved by Chevy fans and is used as a title of respect even by those who build and race other brands.

And that is how the Chevy V-8 became known as a rat motor."
........................................ ........................................ ........................................ .....................
I suppose I could have heard the porcupine term way after it first came out (like the movies) but had heard the Rat Motor term way more...and just don't remember it now..? Seems like that happens pretty frequently these days...but I still have three Rat (err.. Porcupine) motors.

MikeM

The problem with your link is it was published in 2011.

Stan's Customs

The real problem was my location in '65. (..and I didn't have a subscription to Mechanic's Illustrated.}
I had hitched a ride to Jal, New Mexico...and taken a job on a pulling unit (oil field). Total isolation, but decent pay for a broke 17 year old. Hard times back then. Didn't think it could get any worse.
But I was "wrong again". I got drafted a few moths later....
I guess the porcupine motor just slipped thru the cracks somehow..lol.


........................................ ........................................ ........................................ ...............

GTOguy

Stan, the song is 'SS396' by Paul Revere and the Raiders. Thank you for your service!

rongold

Back in the late 50's and early 60's, when I was in my teens, the big block Chevys were the 348 & 409. In NY, we called them "Cow Blocks". Maybe it had something to do with the shape of the valve covers---I don't know.

johno504

my 66 427 with 2 X 4bbl got 6 mpg in town, 8 hwy. good thing gas was .25 gal.

RJ1

Don't see how anyone can say a factory HP SB could beat a factory HP BB.[/QUOTE]

Stan's Customs

Roger that, and thanks ...I'll look it up.
Stan..

68hemi

[/QUOTE]

Back in the day on street tires a 1970 LT1 would run right along side of a 1969 427/435 with the big block barely edging it out and if you had a little better tire than the factory ones on a 1965 FI car would run along side of it also.

The myths begins when you start building a small block up against a standard big block. You have to remember that fuel injection was an expensive option and when they started putting 396/425 in these cars in mid 65 it was less expensive that a FI 327/375 AND slightly faster. The biggest thing about the big block is that the torque fools you into thinking it is faster than it is. Also remember that the old rule of thumb is that a car length is about 1/10 of a second for those of you that have done any street racing. A street race is not as fast as at the strip as well.