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I have a 72 Convertible. All original. I rebuilt the engine, front end and rear suspension about 20 years ago. Everything still running strong.
2 years ago a JJ delivery driver backed into the front end. I have that repaired and decided it is time for the paint job.
I stripped the entire body and removed the interior and front windshield. I am now thinking should I lift the body or not. I need to install a new clutch. Second one since 84 when I bought it. I have never rebuilt the trans so I will do that this time. Also the rear diff is starting to leak at the front so I need to pull that.
The frame is great. No rust but of course needs cleaned. I have some rust at the #3 body mount. Not sure if it is the mount or what. It is inside the access panel for the door ajar switch. I have the original aluminum body mounts. Even was able to free all the bolts up for the mounts.
What are the advantages to remove it since I do not think replacing the mounts do anything? I have been searching the forum on removing the body but not having very clear results on how to do it. Saw some good photos of carriers to hold the body once removed but haven't been able to find any real plans to build one. I saw some of the strap kits available to lift the body which
Sounds like you have the wrench experience to do it and the gonna guess the room or you wouldn't even consider it. For the work you are planning, it would seem easier to me to take off the body. I have the strap kit and it worked very well. I would be prepared to find more things wrong once you got the body off and as long as you can handle the "while I am here" bug - and you will find lots of that - I would say go ahead and lift it. It will take additional work realigning everything when it goes back together as well. Just go in with your eyes wide open. Good luck, be sure and start a thread and take lots of pictures to keep us posted if you go through with lifting it!
Pulling the body off the frame gives you great time to paint it and put new brake and fuel lines from front to back. That is if you have the space for that.
My 69 didn't come with a passenger door paper towel holder
In my case the rust I could see wasn't all that bad many people would have worked with the body on but my wife wanted the car as good or better than new so off the body came, good things too, the # 3 passenger said bird cage mount fell apart and a new part from willcox had to be welded in, there were some other small holes in the rail under the body that could only be seen and fixed with body off,
in my case I was a very sound like new ish build so the body off was a must.
Hi pR72,
It's not likely that you'll be this close to being able to lift the body again any time soon.
The advantage to lifting the body is it gives you access to EVERYTHING!
The disadvantage to lifting the body is it gives you access to EVERYTHING.
I started out thinking I wouldn't lift the body, but after seeing how I was being limited in what I could do by having the body still in place, I decided to remove the body.
Here's a plan for an inexpensive, easy to build body dolly that a few people have found useful.
You have to be sure that you understand what you're undertaking and that it's what you want to do.
Good Luck!
Regards,
Alan
The passenger paper towel holder was a very rare option for 72.
Alan thanks for the diagram for the dolly. I will try to download it to study it a little more to see what I need.
Besides the body mounts what else do I need to remove? I started looking for ground straps. Steering column, clutch linkage, brake lines. Looks like brackets on the front need to come off also.
Hi pR72,
Here are some things that need to be unhooked:
All bumper brackets.
Fuel supply and return connections, plus vapor line connection, at fuel tank.
Electrical connection for fuel sender.
Ground strap for antenna.
Alarm switch wire.
Clips on rear frame rail for rear lighting harness.
Parking brake cable.
Center seat belt mounting reinforcing cable.
Shifter ****.
Battery cable to starter.
Battery ground cable.
Small ground wire to starter mounting bolt.
Fuel lines to fuel pump.
Tachometer and speedometer cables.
Oil gauge line.
Temperature gauge sensor wire. Left side head.
Alternator electrical connection.
Temperature sensor wire for TCS. Right side head.
Vacuum hoses running from engine.
Hoses at vapor canister.
Radiator hoses.
Clutch linkage.
Steering rag joint.
Brake lines at master cylinder.
I'm sure there are more and other folks will post them.
Regards,
Alan
From the amount of body work evident in your pictures it appears that although some of the paint may have been the original it's had quite a bit of paint work done since it left St.Louis.
I used Alan's body dolly plans and very pleased with the final product. Made the uprights a little taller so I could crawl under easily. See mylift off post for a pic (unfortunately out of town and don't have the pics with me)
Do a search for the body removal checklist. It was pretty helpful on what to do to prepare for the lift. Once you start, go a few inches at a time to check if you missed any connections. I recall the checklist missing a few items... seat belt retaining cable on the under body near parking brake comes to mind.
If the frame or mounting pad areas need rebuilt, that might justify taking the body off. Otherwise, it's a 'can of worms'; there are so many detials and things that can get damaged, just because you are removing the body, that it doesn't make sense to do so.
You can steam clean the underside...or pressure wash it...to remove the 'nasty' stuff. Then, you can pretty-up the bottom side if you wish.
If the car is a driver vehicle, you will just mess up all the detailed work you do by driving it after completing a body-off restoration. If you want to go for NCRS judging, maybe you want to go that route. Otherwise, save the grief.
Alan71 Thanks for the checklist items prior to removal. I have been trying to copy your diagram but no luck. Can you message me with it or is it somewhere else I can get it. Actually the only bodywork on the car was the front fenders. I had the left front replaced and rt front patch back in 84 shortly after I got the car. Slide out on a turn. Everything else is original, original paint. I found the stencil markings and even a sticker inside the rear clip under the alarm switch showing what dealer it was sent to new. Fox Chevrolet in Timonium, MD.
Some of the bonding strips seems a little rough and some of that may be from me stripping the paint.
Still weighing the options of removing the body. I have the lift and the room to do it. 7T1Vette I am not planning for the car to be NCRS. I understand where you are coming from. I am going to talk to the shop that will be dong the paint work to have them look at it.
I am the furthest thing from a NCRS builder but in the case of my 69 body off was the only option,
I didn't really want to spend that extra time and money, in this case my wife insisted this time I hire the body off part,
I wish all my car needed was to be prettied up,
like I said before there was rust that to be repaired correctly the body had to come off and there was rust that could only be seen by taking the body off,
And the tech who did my body off was careless and did do some damage that there was no excuse for because I have seen people do their first body off with no real damage, and I could have done it without that damage.
In my case I wanted a car that was as nice as the day it left the factory and better with upgrades, a sound car that I can have the rest of my life with no excuses,
I have seen many threads on here of people doing their fist body off some with very little experience wrenching and they have great results,
Pulling the body IS a costly time consuming job that for some cars is the only way to get them right, take your time making up your mind if your car needs it for what you desire the car to be but do not let fear of the job play any part in your decision.
It is up to you if you want to remove it or not....BUT...I will write this.
All I know is that if your Corvette were in my shop. I would have to move the placement of the safety stands. I prefer...at all costs to keep the car on the ground and on good aired up tires. And it is raised ONLY when I absolutely have to.
When I raise and support a Corvette...where it is going to be up for a long time. I remove the wheels and place my jack stands under the wide section of the brake rotors so the car 'thinks' that is is still being held up by the tires/wheels. So if I get it up a foot or higher...the car is still using the suspension as it would when it is on the ground.
If you are not careful...due to the placement of the jack stands currently...the weight of the engine hanging out past the jack stand contact point can cause for an issue at the gusset that is pop riveted to your cowl....and your rear quarters and rear clip can sag down...and you may notice how the gap at the back of the door and quarter can get wide.
YES...in understand that if the frame is good and solid and so on...why does it matter??? Well for me..it does matter...because I have seen FIRST HAND what can happen if this allowed to stay like that for a long time....because I do not want to have anything go wrong when I am working on a customers Corvette and what is the big deal in relocation the placement of the jack stands that honestly makes prefect sense if a person stops and looks at the forces in play.
Just a few thoughts... If you are only wanting to clean the frame and replace the body mounts this can be done with body on. if you are going to do a full body off remember one thing leads to another. My 1-2 year frame off is now on the 4th year. and about 10K above what I thought I was going to spend.
Lifting straps can be purchased from most of the suppliers. You will need to shorten them unless you and a 14' ceiling and crane that will go that high. I purchased mine from Ecklers and cut them and put a ratchet on them so I could shorten them.
FWIW: I took the body off to gain access to areas which were impossible to get at with the body on, deal with everything once. Just because some rust or other problems aren't visible with the body on doesn't mean it's not there. I found it easier to work on some parts without the body in the way, replacing brake lines and fuel lines, allowed me to inspect areas I couldn't see before. It gave me access to the rocker channels which I cleaned up and painted with a tough rust inhibiting paint. I wanted to be proactive, rebuild the chassis, take care of what ever else I found rather than continually dealing with small repairs.
If I were to do it again, I'd pay more attention to details such as number of shims on each body mount. Wish I had resurfaced the flywheel while it was easy to get to rather than from under the car years later. Made a few mistakes but overall I feel it's in much better shape than when I bought it.
As mentioned by several people, removing the body from the frame requires additional space and will probably require a greater investment in time to finish a project, but it sure makes life easier when doing the chassis and driveline.
Be really honest with your intentions though... Especially with regard to time and motivation. If you keep the body on the frame, the car may still be driven and that alone will keep most people interested in the car. If it is off the frame, it almost certainly can't be driven and will certainly test your resolve at finishing a large project.
Guess I have been lucky with my 74 Vert. Kind of went against most of the thought process in this thread. And not implying that what most have posted is not correct.
I have....
1-decided not to do a body off on mime
2-has been on jackstands for the last 7 1/2 years with the hardtop on, also used 2x4's as support in place of the radiator being removed
3-was very fortunate that there was only surface rust on the frame, nothing serious
4-everything and I mean everything was removed from the car, basically the shell sitting on the frame.
5-gave me access to everything I needed to do
6-did not and don't plan to replace fuel or brake lines, in my case no need too
7-gutted the entire interior, didn't have to, but did.
8-etc., etc., etc....
I know my thinking has changed over the last almost 8 years of ownership. I did think about removing the body at one time, but with my work schedule, it was only a thought. Now that I'm retired, and I have the time, I am more anxious to get the car back together (which I am doing now) to get the opportunity to drive and enjoy my BB. I also am very fortunate that I have not experience any body problems that have been mentioned with the car on stands for so many years. I don't have any gaps or sags, doors open and close solid, etc. Again, very lucky that it is still the same after all this time.
And yes at one time I also wanted to replace every nut and bolt and say that I did a body off, and I can only imagine the feeling that one gets from that accomplishment. And I have the utmost admiration for those who have completed this task.
And I still have the 454 to put back together.....
In the end, you have to do what you feel and follow that feeling. If you have the time and the space as mentioned above, then a body off is the thing to do. But if your anxious like me... a body on may be the way to go.....good luck, will be watching this thread for your progress
Reviving this old post.
I had the car painted and the guys who did it talked me out of not taking the body off. I am about 8 bolts from taking the body off. After they painted it they mentioned I should detail the engine compartment since the exterior was so nice, the engine bay and interior needed freshened up. I agreed and started into it. As many know it just mushrooms. Where do you stop
.
I have everything either out of or off the car except for the rear suspension. I have rebuilt, repainted or will replace everything that goes back on, i.e. suspension parts, A/C parts, wiring, etc.
This is an older picture but nothing is left in the engine bay except some wiring which will be replaced. Since I had it painted, I wrapped it in foam which is what was used by Harley for their painted parts when I was working there.
So now I am seriously looking at removing the body to completely finish it. Already painted the frame that I could reach with KBS coating. I have a new set of brake lines and getting new fuel lines.
I have searched on the forum about removing the body and I have the plans for the cart. Looking at the body lift straps from the suppliers but even have heavy duty rachet straps. I am going to put more cushions and protection on the body since it is painted. Doors are on and latched for extra stability. Most of what I have seen shows the radiator support still in the car. Like I mentioned everything is out of the engine bay. What extra support is needed on the front end and where do I hook it to?
07-23-2016, 09:41 PM
Remove the body or not
a body on may be the way to go.....good luck, will be watching this thread for your progress
