Another SPAL controller craps out!!!!
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
I had a 'stock' '87 vette fan all sealed in with pipe wrap from HD, nice neat sealed into the stock shroud....it was sealed in by several attempts over the last ten years down here, and it really never could keep up with ALL situations...worst being a 80+ criuse on the freeway and into stop/go traffic with road temps being 140f or so....hotter then hell with no wind.....
SO FAR, these Spals do the job great.....and another thing...since they are only 11" diamter, and not 16" single blade set....methinks the starting torque demand on the individual Spal motor is not nearly as great....so the motors should individually draw much less power and be happier....they appear very similar capabilities from the physical size of them/vs the stock '87 motor....
surely there are two of them...and they really raise hell under there....
highly recommended install....finally byte the bullett and quit being a cheeeeep bastard like I wuz all these years....
SO FAR, these Spals do the job great.....and another thing...since they are only 11" diamter, and not 16" single blade set....methinks the starting torque demand on the individual Spal motor is not nearly as great....so the motors should individually draw much less power and be happier....they appear very similar capabilities from the physical size of them/vs the stock '87 motor....
surely there are two of them...and they really raise hell under there....
highly recommended install....finally byte the bullett and quit being a cheeeeep bastard like I wuz all these years....
Team Owner
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 23,375
Likes: 1,067
From: Virginia USA
That is the kind of knee jerk reaction that I was warning about. If you don't want electric fans, that's fine, most people don't really need them. I don't have them on my 80!
But for those people that really want/need them the relays are a great way to go and they are so simple. The switch is a normally open contact, when it hits high temp (195) the contact closes and grounds out, then the fans come on. The beauty of this simplicity is that you can also tie off this switch with a little manual switch inside the car, should you ever want to manually override the system.
HOW ABOUT TROUBLE SHOOTING?
This is the best part. Say the system stops working....Then all you do is manually ground the wire leading to the switch, if the fans come on, then the switch is dead. If they don't, you have a dead relay.
In the fancy controller systems the feedback is an analog device. If something goes wrong you'll have to get out the volt meter and start doing resistance checks. If it's not the sender, then it's likely the controller and time to get a new one regardless of what the problem is.
But for those people that really want/need them the relays are a great way to go and they are so simple. The switch is a normally open contact, when it hits high temp (195) the contact closes and grounds out, then the fans come on. The beauty of this simplicity is that you can also tie off this switch with a little manual switch inside the car, should you ever want to manually override the system.
HOW ABOUT TROUBLE SHOOTING?
This is the best part. Say the system stops working....Then all you do is manually ground the wire leading to the switch, if the fans come on, then the switch is dead. If they don't, you have a dead relay.
In the fancy controller systems the feedback is an analog device. If something goes wrong you'll have to get out the volt meter and start doing resistance checks. If it's not the sender, then it's likely the controller and time to get a new one regardless of what the problem is.
I appreciate your comments but this decision is far from a knee-jerk reaction. I've been contemplating this for some time now and I just don't want the headaches that I have when I decided to put a monospring on my car. I went around and around with that decision and it bit me. My spring cracked within a year. Luckily there are vendors like yourself and Van Steel that stand by your products and are willing to do whatever it takes to make a bad experience right. Van Steel replaced my spring no questions asked and even paid for shipping both ways. I know from posts I've read of yours and even the replies in this thread that you are of the same caliber. If you know my luck you would understand. I know that Spall probably makes a very good set of fans but I just can't force myself to take the plunge again.
I like working on my car but I LOVE driving it. Any downtime is like water torture to me and any unnecessary downtime is no good in my book.
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,142
Likes: 54
From: Taylor Michigan
Electric fans appear to be merely a bandage for sick cooling systems on early model Vettes. There exists false sence of security that they are a cure all because newer ones do have fans. However the late model Vettes are loaded with emission controls, sensors and computers not needed in the early ones. Another factor to consider is that fans were designed into the cars as they use one lone serpentine accessoty drive belt to go around as many as 6 or 7 pulleys all in a line. Plus my early models dont overheat with stock OEM systems and i`m sure that I dont have a lock on stock systems that work as new and really cool. There has to be others that share my good luck not using electric fans... 
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
Electric fans appear to be merely a bandage for sick cooling systems on early model Vettes. There exists false sence of security that they are a cure all because newer ones do have fans. However the late model Vettes are loaded with emission controls, sensors and computers not needed in the early ones. Another factor to consider is that fans were designed into the cars as they use one lone serpentine accessoty drive belt to go around as many as 6 or 7 pulleys all in a line. Plus my early models dont overheat with stock OEM systems and i`m sure that I dont have a lock on stock systems that work as new and really cool. There has to be others that share my good luck not using electric fans...
IronC, I note your location, Michigan, may I well like your summers better than ours, you don't have the driving conditions on 30+++ years old cars we shark guys face in the lands down south....and our driving times are much longer than most 'garage queens'.....no offense, really, I can understand, and have driven my vettes in snow conditions many a time...hopefully NEVER AGAIN....
then there are us hotrodders...you have a pristine stock NCRS car, well that's all fine and such, BUT with all the replacement parts and upkeep and variations, and so forth, I can't see how under extreme condtions certain mods are not necessary to keep the car on the road...among them are cooling systems, shocks, springs, engines, trannies, suspensions, BRAKES, the rest....part of olde tyme car ownership....it's a hobby...Modifications Unlimited....
SO I look at various upgrades to a timeless automotive ICON as being progressive, and interesting....
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,752
Likes: 4
From: Austin Texas
Well, Ironcross, you don't live in Texas. If you read the owners manual in the early C-3 'Vettes, it states "If you experience overheating while driving with the air conditioner on, turn it off until the temperature returns to normal". 
Even Chevy knew they had problem. I bet if today's electric cooling fan technology was available back then, G.M. would have taken advantage of the benefits they can provide.
Even Chevy knew they had problem. I bet if today's electric cooling fan technology was available back then, G.M. would have taken advantage of the benefits they can provide.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
Well, Ironcross, you don't live in Texas. If you read the owners manual in the early C-3 'Vettes, it states "If you experience overheating while driving with the air conditioner on, turn it off until the temperature returns to normal". Even Chevy knew they had problem. I bet if today's electric cooling fan technology was available back then, G.M. would have taken advantage of the benefits they can provide.
Even Chevy knew they had problem. I bet if today's electric cooling fan technology was available back then, G.M. would have taken advantage of the benefits they can provide.BG, you gotta be kidding me....I gotta old owner's manuel' around here for my '72 L48 4 speed vert.....somewhere....is that seriously IN there??
pretty funny stuff....
Friend Request Magnet
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 50,242
Likes: 149
From: ♫ ♪ ♫♫ ♪ ♫ ♪♪ ♫
Well, Ironcross, you don't live in Texas. If you read the owners manual in the early C-3 'Vettes, it states "If you experience overheating while driving with the air conditioner on, turn it off until the temperature returns to normal". Even Chevy knew they had problem. I bet if today's electric cooling fan technology was available back then, G.M. would have taken advantage of the benefits they can provide.
Even Chevy knew they had problem. I bet if today's electric cooling fan technology was available back then, G.M. would have taken advantage of the benefits they can provide.
And...another reason GM later added electric along with a clutch fan.
My 79 owners manual came with a "Louisiana Clause".
Merely stating:
"If your car is black, its 101deg. ambient in August, 101% humidity, engine temp. is 340deg., you have your A/C on and you're smoldering hot inside the cockpit...its normal.
Park your Vette and drive the boat."
Dual electic needed down here (well; unless Katrina is blowing
). Jim
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,142
Likes: 54
From: Taylor Michigan
IronC, I note your location, Michigan, may I well like your summers better than ours, you don't have the driving conditions on 30+++ years old cars we shark guys face in the lands down south....and our driving times are much longer than most 'garage queens'.....no offense, really, I can understand, and have driven my vettes in snow conditions many a time...hopefully NEVER AGAIN....
then there are us hotrodders...you have a pristine stock NCRS car, well that's all fine and such, BUT with all the replacement parts and upkeep and variations, and so forth, I can't see how under extreme condtions certain mods are not necessary to keep the car on the road...among them are cooling systems, shocks, springs, engines, trannies, suspensions, BRAKES, the rest....part of olde tyme car ownership....it's a hobby...Modifications Unlimited....
SO I look at various upgrades to a timeless automotive ICON as being progressive, and interesting....
then there are us hotrodders...you have a pristine stock NCRS car, well that's all fine and such, BUT with all the replacement parts and upkeep and variations, and so forth, I can't see how under extreme condtions certain mods are not necessary to keep the car on the road...among them are cooling systems, shocks, springs, engines, trannies, suspensions, BRAKES, the rest....part of olde tyme car ownership....it's a hobby...Modifications Unlimited....
SO I look at various upgrades to a timeless automotive ICON as being progressive, and interesting....
Suprise!
Kappa Sigma, University of Miami,....BE, JD Esq.I have owned Vettes all my life and to me they are not a hobby as they are the fastest cars available. But not for that fact, I would be driving something else. I invite you to please check out my web site below and the Vette pictures to your left
No offense taken on the trailer queens, I use mine to haul trailers not ride on them. Hauls my race cars and drag boats.
And my new Texas friend the Yellow 68 coupe is a L88 powered Vette.
Somewhere in here is that cooling subject.
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Drifting
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 1,542
Likes: 43
From: Plano TX
I tried to use electric fans 15 years ago and had 2 controllers go bad (not from DeWitts or the Spal units) plus at the time the fans weren't able to move enough air.
I now have the DeWitts radiator and it is a far superior unit in my opinion in regards to fit and build quality. The Spal fans are great and no one should be afraid to use them (they work period!).
In regards to the Spal controller it's a 3rd party item and in my business I deal with 3rd parties and it's not a good thing when they don't deliver or the product is not up to quality. If DeWitts has a solution and are standing behind their business it would be nice it Spal stepped forward to help them out.
I now have the DeWitts radiator and it is a far superior unit in my opinion in regards to fit and build quality. The Spal fans are great and no one should be afraid to use them (they work period!).
In regards to the Spal controller it's a 3rd party item and in my business I deal with 3rd parties and it's not a good thing when they don't deliver or the product is not up to quality. If DeWitts has a solution and are standing behind their business it would be nice it Spal stepped forward to help them out.
Team Owner
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 23,375
Likes: 1,067
From: Virginia USA
For all those who say "well you don't live in the south etc" Guess where I was living when I bought my car???? AUSTIN, TEXAS. I have the same setup as now, stock execpt for the flex fan, and I never had an overheating problem there. I drive to North Carolina every summer and I never had a overheating problem there either. Oh yah, it gets just as hot here in Northern Virginia and NC as it did in Austin during the summer there are just not as many days with that stifling heat.
Racer
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 439
Likes: 0
From: Mukilteo Washington
anyone have any experience with this controller:
http://www.centechwire.com/catalog/cooling/fc2p.shtml
http://www.centechwire.com/catalog/cooling/fc2p.shtml
Racer
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 439
Likes: 0
From: Mukilteo Washington
This was my experience with the Spal controller. After I ordered it from Tom and receive the 2 relay system by mistake, I shipped it back to Tom and he sent me the controller with a new heat sensor ( maybe I should have stopped there). I hooked it up per the instructions and It failed, I contacted Tom and Spal and found that the free heat sensor was faulty, I got a substitute part number from spal for the sensor with a NAPA part number and bought two of them for like $10.00 (part number TWS4015SB) and It works great, IMHO the sensors coming from Tom/Spal are crap but I could be wrong as my system might fail at any time 
maybe I should have stopped there). I hooked it up per the instructions and It failed, I contacted Tom and Spal and found that the free heat sensor was faulty, I got a substitute part number from spal for the sensor with a NAPA part number and bought two of them for like $10.00 (part number TWS4015SB) and It works great, IMHO the sensors coming from Tom/Spal are crap but I could be wrong as my system might fail at any time
Pro
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 582
Likes: 3
From: Glen Allen (Richmond) Virginia
We do support our customers and we continue to warranty any of these controllers, dispite the fact Spal usually stiffs us with the bill. Anyone that wants to convert to the simple "tried & true" relay harness can do so and it won't cost you a dime. If you send back the controller we will replace it with the relay harness package at no charge. If you want this sent out first, then we will charge for the kit, and credit you when (if) we get the bad controller back. Please do not do a "chargeback" without first trying to resolve the problem with us. Those are a pain in the *** for everyone.
Keep in mind, Spal made these controllers, not me. Their superior reputation on making excellent fans lead me to believe the controllers would work well too. When they didn't, we switched back to the relays.
The main reason we when to the controller in the first place was the fact they were sapposed to be able to tap off the stock gauge sending unit for feedback. This was important to us because almost every person that purchased a fan called and asked where to install the sender because they had no extra hole in the engine. This feature didn't work as advertised and then we started giving away the Spal senders at no charge.
Remember this controller problem has nothing to do with our radiators or the quality of Spals' fans. It's a controller issue only. Spal claims the problem is ten times higher with Corvette customers than any others, don't ask me why. The corvette shops we sell them to still love them and were really bummed out when we said we wouldn't sell them any more. In the end, I always prefered the relay/switch system better any way. This system worked 100% of the time and it offers simplicity if and when trouble shooting was required. The switch was a simple on/off device instead of a variable resistor.
Keep in mind, Spal made these controllers, not me. Their superior reputation on making excellent fans lead me to believe the controllers would work well too. When they didn't, we switched back to the relays.
The main reason we when to the controller in the first place was the fact they were sapposed to be able to tap off the stock gauge sending unit for feedback. This was important to us because almost every person that purchased a fan called and asked where to install the sender because they had no extra hole in the engine. This feature didn't work as advertised and then we started giving away the Spal senders at no charge.
Remember this controller problem has nothing to do with our radiators or the quality of Spals' fans. It's a controller issue only. Spal claims the problem is ten times higher with Corvette customers than any others, don't ask me why. The corvette shops we sell them to still love them and were really bummed out when we said we wouldn't sell them any more. In the end, I always prefered the relay/switch system better any way. This system worked 100% of the time and it offers simplicity if and when trouble shooting was required. The switch was a simple on/off device instead of a variable resistor.
Thanks again.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,282
Likes: 172
From: Lake Wylie, South Carolina
Here is an update. The over heating issues seem to be resolved. I got the 195 spal harness from Dewitt's and wired it in Saturday. Drove around for about 3 hours off and on and the temp never got above 200 and when it did get between 195 and 200 the circuit in the sensor closed and the fans kicked on as they were supposed to everytime.
I am sending the SPAL controller back this week.
Wade
I am sending the SPAL controller back this week. Wade
Pro
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 725
Likes: 1
From: FL.
Here is an update. The over heating issues seem to be resolved. I got the 195 spal harness from Dewitt's and wired it in Saturday. Drove around for about 3 hours off and on and the temp never got above 200 and when it did get between 195 and 200 the circuit in the sensor closed and the fans kicked on as they were supposed to everytime. I am sending the SPAL controller back this week.
Wade
I am sending the SPAL controller back this week. Wade
Thats the way I do it too, and havent got paranoid once during the last 200miles of hot weather hard driving 383 breakin.Congrats,