Need help picking topend . . .
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,246
Likes: 4
From: Bay Area CA
When i was parts scouring for my recent rebuild, similar you what your planning, i had a reason to call Brodix tech support about using stamped steel rockers with the IK180 heads, they said that you have to change the rocker studs out, that come on the heads to use stamped rockers because the rocker studs supplied with the heads are tapered, and you will have trouble getting the adjusting nuts low enough for that type of rocker arm, not to mention the problems you might have with having them hold tight. FYI. C.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 403
From: Nashville TN
St. Jude Donor '09
When i was parts scouring for my recent rebuild, similar you what your planning, i had a reason to call Brodix tech support about using stamped steel rockers with the IK180 heads, they said that you have to change the rocker studs out, that come on the heads to use stamped rockers because the rocker studs supplied with the heads are tapered, and you will have trouble getting the adjusting nuts low enough for that type of rocker arm, not to mention the problems you might have with having them hold tight. FYI. C.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 403
From: Nashville TN
St. Jude Donor '09
If I were doing it I would pick up eight 1.6 rockers for the intake valves but this will for sure cost you some extra for different length pushrods, you can buy a full set of hardened push rods for the guide plates that come on the brodix head for around $40.00 that will more then do the job for hydraulic flat tappit valve springs you won't need any fancy $80.00, .080 wall chrome moly pushrods for what your doing.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 2,010
Likes: 3
From: Moon Twp. PA USA
I am using TF 23* heads with a 195cc runner on my 383. Bought them when I still had the 350 and did not have any problems with the 350. I did have a cam, Performer RPM Q-Jet intake and headers on the 350. '76 4 speed car.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 403
From: Nashville TN
St. Jude Donor '09
Sounds like there is hope for me . . . what cam did you run and what gears did you have in the rear?
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,246
Likes: 4
From: Bay Area CA
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
I called brodix just to make sure on valve springs the BRO-1021000 with the 1.250 springs is what your going to need to run with a hydraulic flat tappit the BRO-1021001 has 375 open pressure ment for hydraulic roller if you want to run a hydraulic roller in the future you can switch to a beehive style spring or if needed cut the valve pockets to a bigger size. Brodix makes the IK200 with as big as 1.55dia. springs.
Last edited by Little Mouse; Jul 30, 2009 at 06:11 PM.
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Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 403
From: Nashville TN
St. Jude Donor '09
That helped answer some of my questions and gave me some things to think about.I called brodix just to make sure on valve springs the BRO-1021000 with the 1.250 springs is what your going to need to run with a hydraulic flat tappit the BRO-1021001 has 375 open pressure ment for hydraulic roller if you want to run a hydraulic roller in the future you can switch to a beehive style spring or if needed cut the valve pockets to a bigger size. Brodix makes the IK200 with as big as 1.55dia. springs.
Will these rockers work for what I'm doing?
Manley 1.5 Rockers
Manley 1.6 Rockers
The Lunati 256 cam looks good. Close duration to the Summit 1103, but more lift as you said. I'll start putting together a parts list so we can start filling in some of the blanks. Thanks for everyone's help so far.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
After reading your build, I'm really getting excited . . . good write up. That helped answer some of my questions and gave me some things to think about.
Thanks for checking. I'll call them tomorrow to find out if they use the tapered studs on the IK200 that may cause issues with the stamped steel rockers.
Will these rockers work for what I'm doing?
Manley 1.5 Rockers
Manley 1.6 Rockers
The Lunati 256 cam looks good. Close duration to the Summit 1103, but more lift as you said. I'll start putting together a parts list so we can start filling in some of the blanks. Thanks for everyone's help so far.
That helped answer some of my questions and gave me some things to think about.Thanks for checking. I'll call them tomorrow to find out if they use the tapered studs on the IK200 that may cause issues with the stamped steel rockers.
Will these rockers work for what I'm doing?
Manley 1.5 Rockers
Manley 1.6 Rockers
The Lunati 256 cam looks good. Close duration to the Summit 1103, but more lift as you said. I'll start putting together a parts list so we can start filling in some of the blanks. Thanks for everyone's help so far.
The manley rockers will work they are long slot.
Before you buy parts consider giving vettesbydesign a shot he is a small business trying to compete in a big time summit, jegs world.
I'm a small business person know what thats like.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,246
Likes: 4
From: Bay Area CA
I went with Lunati voodoo roller rockers, they are kick azz. Proform (GM endorsed) has some tall valve covers (ones i got) for 55. Good quality stamping with baffles and grommets installed. Not sure if your going for a stock look and want to reuse your covers or not. Talk it over with Brodix, as far as their studs go. I'm not even sure the studs will work with a standard roller rocker. If not, you'll have to add the cost of a stud set, but pretty sure they won't work with stamped steel rockers. Your links are also for sets of 8, not 16. Brodixes look like great heads though, hard to beat Brodix on anything. Rollers might add 200 to the cost of the build, less if you can use the Brodix studs with them, and they can be reused on the 383 build later. I'd be interested in what the experts here think about the options. I would give Vettesbydesign a shot at the entire build sourceing, once you get your list together.
Intermediate
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 32
Likes: 1
From: Lunenburg MA
I used the felpro 1094 gasket on a stock short block with Brodix IK180's, puts compression at about 9.5:1 with 64cc chambers. Ive been running it for about a year with no problems yet (knock on wood).
By the way I used stock rockers and stock length pushrods with a lunati 262 voodoo cam (60102). Runs really good with only a little lope at idle, no lack of low end at all and pulls right up to 5800 rpms hard.
By the way I used stock rockers and stock length pushrods with a lunati 262 voodoo cam (60102). Runs really good with only a little lope at idle, no lack of low end at all and pulls right up to 5800 rpms hard.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 2,010
Likes: 3
From: Moon Twp. PA USA
The 383 runs a CC XE274H cam. With a '0' decked block and the 64cc chamber head, static CR is 10.3 dynamic CR is 8.3. I have been running 89 octane pump gas on this set up for about 3 years. Ignition timing is 35* all in by 2600 RPM + 16* vacuum advance. Had to change the vacuum can to one that would pull maximum advance @ about 10", since this cam only gives about 13" vacuum.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
I used the felpro 1094 gasket on a stock short block with Brodix IK180's, puts compression at about 9.5:1 with 64cc chambers. Ive been running it for about a year with no problems yet (knock on wood).
By the way I used stock rockers and stock length pushrods with a lunati 262 voodoo cam (60102). Runs really good with only a little lope at idle, no lack of low end at all and pulls right up to 5800 rpms hard.
By the way I used stock rockers and stock length pushrods with a lunati 262 voodoo cam (60102). Runs really good with only a little lope at idle, no lack of low end at all and pulls right up to 5800 rpms hard.
with the 60102 cam do you happen to have 3.08 turbo 350 trans ?
Last edited by Little Mouse; Jul 31, 2009 at 02:25 AM.
Intermediate
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 32
Likes: 1
From: Lunenburg MA
Little Mouse, I have a 4 speed trans with 3.36 gears. The cam is exactly what I was looking for performance wise. I didnt lose the bottom end torque I had before running stock heads with a 204/214 cam, but I gained in the mid range and up top where I was looking for more power with out having to over rev the stock bottom end. Now my Corvette goes like a Corvette.
Good luck on the project redman its alot of fun to do it yourself.
Good luck on the project redman its alot of fun to do it yourself.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 403
From: Nashville TN
St. Jude Donor '09
I went with Lunati voodoo roller rockers, they are kick azz. Proform (GM endorsed) has some tall valve covers (ones i got) for 55. Good quality stamping with baffles and grommets installed. Not sure if your going for a stock look and want to reuse your covers or not. Talk it over with Brodix, as far as their studs go. I'm not even sure the studs will work with a standard roller rocker. If not, you'll have to add the cost of a stud set, but pretty sure they won't work with stamped steel rockers. Your links are also for sets of 8, not 16. Brodixes look like great heads though, hard to beat Brodix on anything. Rollers might add 200 to the cost of the build, less if you can use the Brodix studs with them, and they can be reused on the 383 build later. I'd be interested in what the experts here think about the options. I would give Vettesbydesign a shot at the entire build sourceing, once you get your list together.
The plan right now is to put 1.5 rockers on the exhaust and 1.6 on the intake -- that's why I was looking at the sets of 8. I used the felpro 1094 gasket on a stock short block with Brodix IK180's, puts compression at about 9.5:1 with 64cc chambers. Ive been running it for about a year with no problems yet (knock on wood).
By the way I used stock rockers and stock length pushrods with a lunati 262 voodoo cam (60102). Runs really good with only a little lope at idle, no lack of low end at all and pulls right up to 5800 rpms hard.
By the way I used stock rockers and stock length pushrods with a lunati 262 voodoo cam (60102). Runs really good with only a little lope at idle, no lack of low end at all and pulls right up to 5800 rpms hard.
Hmmmm . . . 262???? I'll take a look at. From Lunati's website:
Hydraulic. Mid-level performance street cam with excellent drivability. Exceptional replacement for muscle car type cams with automatic transmissions. Works well with stock type exhaust manifolds and dual plane intake with mild 4 bbl carb. This is an Awesome 4X4 and performance marine cam.
Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 262/268
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 219/227
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .468/.489
LSA/ICL: 112/108
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 1400-5800
Includes: Cam Kit
Part Number: 60102LK
Last edited by redman76; Jul 31, 2009 at 11:00 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
I'm sticking with the stamped steel rockers for this build, they're cool but trying to save where I can until I build the bottom-end. I have some cheap tall valve covers that I'm going to reuse, but hopefully for Christmas, Santa will bring me some tall cast aluminum covers. The plan right now is to put 1.5 rockers on the exhaust and 1.6 on the intake -- that's why I was looking at the sets of 8.
Hmmmm . . . 262???? I'll take a look at. From Lunati's website:
Hydraulic. Mid-level performance street cam with excellent drivability. Exceptional replacement for muscle car type cams with automatic transmissions. Works well with stock type exhaust manifolds and dual plane intake with mild 4 bbl carb. This is an Awesome 4X4 and performance marine cam.
Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 262/268
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 219/227
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .468/.489
LSA/ICL: 112/108
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 1400-5800
Includes: Cam Kit
Part Number: 60102LK
The plan right now is to put 1.5 rockers on the exhaust and 1.6 on the intake -- that's why I was looking at the sets of 8. Hmmmm . . . 262???? I'll take a look at. From Lunati's website:
Hydraulic. Mid-level performance street cam with excellent drivability. Exceptional replacement for muscle car type cams with automatic transmissions. Works well with stock type exhaust manifolds and dual plane intake with mild 4 bbl carb. This is an Awesome 4X4 and performance marine cam.
Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 262/268
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 219/227
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .468/.489
LSA/ICL: 112/108
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 1400-5800
Includes: Cam Kit
Part Number: 60102LK
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 403
From: Nashville TN
St. Jude Donor '09
Yes, they use ARP rocker studs that require a full fulcrum rocker, so the stamped steel will not work without swapping studs. Hmmm . . . by the time I spend the money for new studs, I'm getting pretty close to roller rockers. That's not necessarily a bad thing . . . I'll have to look at some choices.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
Yes, they use ARP rocker studs that require a full fulcrum rocker, so the stamped steel will not work without swapping studs. Hmmm . . . by the time I spend the money for new studs, I'm getting pretty close to roller rockers. That's not necessarily a bad thing . . . I'll have to look at some choices.
heres a parts list for you out of my 2006 catalog to my knowledge nothing has changed on the Ik180, IK200 only the IK210 has showed up as a new head.
Parts in the IK200
intake valves 2.02 X 4.920 O.A.L. part # BR 6170DI
exhaust valves 1.60 X 4.920 O.A.L. Part # BR 6169DI
valve springs on BR-1021000 head = 1.250 DIA.
closed pressure 100 lb open pressure 300 installed height 1.850
maximum lift .525, part # CC981
reatainers 7 degree steel part # CC742
rocker studs 3/8 part # BR318S
guide plates 5/16 part # CC4808
valve seals 11/32 part # US-VS529V
intake gasket (IK200 head) fel pro 1206
or cometic C5403
head bolts ARP 134-3601 or manley 42313
head bolt washers manley 42102
spark plugs champion RN12YC or autolite 3924
if your block is stock never been decked you would want to use the
1094 fel pro gakets there aluminum head compatible .015 compressed 3.2cc volume, the factory steel shim gaskets were .018 compressed, your block has to have never been decked to use them.
Last edited by Little Mouse; Jul 31, 2009 at 11:41 PM.
Intermediate
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 32
Likes: 1
From: Lunenburg MA
Yes, they use ARP rocker studs that require a full fulcrum rocker, so the stamped steel will not work without swapping studs. Hmmm . . . by the time I spend the money for new studs, I'm getting pretty close to roller rockers. That's not necessarily a bad thing . . . I'll have to look at some choices.