Forum Guru's..need some help here.

Details:
1981 - original 350, Auto, 85k Miles
Original Q-Jet (E4ME) - Fresh rebuild ** Details below ** (Casting #: 17081218)
ECM - original, no codes are active, scan tool validates (OTC Monitor 85)
New Plugs, wires, cap, rotor, coil
New guts to the Dizzy (Factory original ECM controlled)
New fuel pump w/ new rubber lines and hard line to carb
Only Ethanol Free GAS has been run with the newly rebuilt carb

When I purchased the car the PO has the original Q-jet in the shop for a full rebuild, part of the deal was I got the Q-jet from the shop. The shop is a well known, very reputable one here in north east Florida, All American Carburetors. As they promised when I brought it home, all I had to do was hook it up and turn the key...and it fired right up.

Now the fun...drove it about 10 miles, parked it, smelled a strong gas odor so I took off the air cleaner and found that the top gasket was saturated !...I took it back next day...they blamed it on crud in the filter...so..i took it home and repeated...Guess what..Leaking even worse now...took it back...Now I just got it back this morning, the tech was very through in explaining to me that the Float was lowered a 16th, he replaced the jet to a factory jet (previous one was a performance jet?!?)....I bolted her back on and Dammit..its still leaking....fuel looks to even be making it into the throttle position sensor.

Now I'm looking for help...am I getting the run around, it is my car/ECM doing/causing this leak, is the carb not set correctly...Id really like to drive my car but I cant with the leak, fumes into the garage, etc....


here are the images and you can clearly see the leak...
Help - suggestions on what to chat about with the carb shop, etc?
** Let me also add the shop has a lifetime service warranty on their work - I have not had to pay for any work after the original pickup **

** You can see a strong concentration around the electrical area




** The rear this time does not seem to be getting wet




Note from the tech and the old Fuel Filter

 

Brian,
I'm far from a expert, but would like to share what I had going on with my professional rebuilt carb.
The first few miles it performed fine until one day I tried to start the car and fuel was going everywhere. (See picture, fuel puddle on intake and air horn gasket soaked)
So I ordered a complete kit opened it up and replaced needle and seat with hanger on the correct location, reset the float and replaced the the air horn gasket. A couple of issues I saw where 1)ripped air horn gasket 2)no needle clip on float 3)float slightly too high 4)possibly dried out thread lock in seat and on the seat thread.
Payed attention to everything when re assembling and especially the air horn fixation sequence and carb to manifold torque. So far so good, except for the air horn gasket getting wet again. This was due to the air horn screws where slightly loose, maybe because the gasket set itself so those where retightened and up to now it's dry.
Maybe they mixed up parts and used a main body and air horn from different carbs?
Nick

 

You might check Lars on a problem similar to yours.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c3-t...the-weird.html

Donnie

 

Lars doesn't rebuild E4ME carbs

 

Seems like maybe the float is set just a bit to high?

 

David....I talked to the tech and he said he lowered it 1/16th, and he said in carbs terms that's a lot...I'm not well versed in carbs so all I said was Ok, I check with my forum buddies. Think it's still too high? I called the shop and got the tech on the phone...sent him these same images...he said I'm sorry you have to drive out here again but bring it in(the shop is 25 miles away -1 way)...so I'll take it in on my way to work tomorrow but I'd love to have a series of questions to ask, or ask for certain measurements to be taken?? He also said they engine test everythjng but the electronic qjets for the lack if a ECM and the needed inputs

 

all american has a good reputation, it may just take a few tweaks. at least you don't have to ship it..

 

Yea this time when I drop it off tomorrow , I'm gonna bring my 81 shop manual that has a whole section on the E4ME...maybe the missing link is in there ?!?!? Could be that the guy is missing one small step

 

The fuel level systems on an E4ME are identical to those on any other QuadraJet.

Occasionally, the needles simply do not seal. It could be this, float level, improperly hung needle (side loading causing it to not seat correctly), fuel pressure is way too high, etc.

 

The only reason that the airhorn gasket will be wetted (or to have fuel coming out of the accel pump hole or any other place around the airhorn) is improper fuel level control. This can be caused by a variety of issues - here are some common ones I see:

High float
Bad float
Wrong float
Jammed (swollen) float
Float arms binding on power piston tower casting
Float needle clip installed wrong
Bad needle/seat
Dirt in needle/seat
Stripped seat threads
Missing seat gasket
Seat double-gasketed
High fuel pressure
Float hinge pin collapsed (no pre-load)
Porous casting
Warped airhorn

Lowering the float 1/16" is not likely to make any change: A Q-Jet will run without wetting the gasket at a float level anywhere from 1/2" low to 3/16" from the top of the bowl if everything else is working right.

Lars

 

Thanks for the feedback Lars, I will discuss these in depth with the tech in the AM when I drop it off. Keep you guys posted

 

Seeing fuel in the TPS connector is not a good thing! Hopefully it is just the float level or needle valve and not a crack in the air horn casting.

Wonder if the wrong pump plunger assembly was installed or there is a crack in the plunger well?

Be sure to let us know what they tell you...curious on this one. And if you need a replacement carb, I have one sitting on a shelf that I rebuilt a couple of years ago, just got it as a spare, but probably will never need it, so could sell it to you if you need it. Just offering it.

 

Lanny81,
Thank you for the offer..I'll keep you in mind if this goes south.
As far as updates I'll also update to this thread, I'd like them to really take their time and chase this one out. I have big plans for a top end and this Q-jet is essential to it.

 

Brian, when you get down here, give me a call and stop by if you want. It’d be good to meet!

 

David,
Im using my lunch break today to get out to All American - I'm swampped with Conference calls and face to face meetings so time this week not so good, but Im thinking maybe when I go to pick it up (for the 4th time...) we could meet up. Ill send you a PM when that gets closer.

 

Ok gents I have an update.....

I just picked up the carb from the shop. Spoke to the tech for almost 30 min and here's the skinny of that conversation.
• Tore the carb completely down
• Bottom end looked great
• inspected the casting's, nooks and crannies, etc - no flaws, no cracks, no pin holes
• all new gaskets
• new needle and seat, new electronics

he then placed fuel pressure (6-7 lbs) for 10 min. He did see the top gasket begin to soak. 1st thought he said was the wicking of the fuel from an empty float/bowl, and said this was expected, however he did see an amount that was not normal. He then took a different freshly rebuilt q-jet (Non Electronic) and applied same fuel pressure.....he did see the initial wicking of the gasket but no excess...other words a normal operating gasket as far as fuel ‘wetness” from an initial fire up/empty fuel bowl.

He told me he decided to get a silicon based spray, took a fresh top gasket and he said he saturated it. placed it on my q-jet and performed the same fuel pressure test - no leaks, no seepage, no nothing

So…thoughts on this – seem ok? The gentlemen is very well versed and has a great deal of experience and I do not feel he’s scamming me at all…so I’m ok with what he told me

 

i know several guys locally that swear by their product, i say your good to go. the only thing i will say is they put it back to stock, nothing to improve performance.

 

Well minus the new silicon layer on the gasket she's back to factory specs

 

Well I just tried to fire it up for first time and the battery was low...I flooded it in the process..... Charging battery now but is this normal from me flooding it ? This center "tower" (the small one next to blue plug) has a brass circle and fuel seeping from it ....

 

The small tower is access for the mixture control solenoid travel adjustment and no there should be no fuel coming from it. If fuel level is that high then the float is not working and the fuel bowl is overflowing. Almost sounds like there is no float needle valve even in the carb or the float is not connected to the needle valve.

I have never had any wetness on the top gasket...ever....even after I have had the carb off and then back onto the engine, fuel bowl empty and after several seconds of cranking to fill the fuel bowl before the engine starts.

Something with that carb is just flat not right.
My offer is still good. In fact if you want to just try my carb, that would work as well. Send me a PM if you want to go that route and we can work out the details.