Whatever is cost effective to maximize profits?

 

I replace suspension bushings with rubber....IF the owner wants MORE...then I skip right over polyurethane and I install the Delrin control arm bushings from Global West that are re-greaseable....and no matter what.....UNLESS it is a car that is being judged....I replace the strut rods with the greaseable heim jointed style ends.

I used to use poly and had for a very long time....BUT for whatever reason that has caused this problem with it..I have encountered too many Corvettes that where the polyurethane is falling apart.

DUB

 

So you like the helm strut rods, so do i,
The reason my car is down is a good looking stock rod just opened up on the diff end, looked like it was cut with a knife,
So that lead to a chassis swap,

So helm strut rods, i had a fellow insist
to me on here they are not for the street and can break if i hit a pot hole,

This was disheartening as a broken strut is why my car is down, i thought they would be stronger than stock not weaker,

I researched it, and people do street run them on the street,
Have you ever heard of one breaking from street use, and yes, mine are the top name brand.

 

IMO the question of one being better than the other is not a good question. They are different products for different purposes, and like Bats says, there are good and bad products of both.

While I have never had polly on my C3 I have had polly on my BMW M3 and M Roadster(s). I ended up going back to rubber in the M3 because the aspects I value (noise & ride quality) are provided by rubber and I am not driving outside the performance limits of rubber (I have car seats in the back, LOL).

Now, depending on the car, performance is actually better with rubber in certain areas which flex multiple ways as mentioned earlier.

If you have never driven a car with Polly I'd suggest you contact a member nearby and ask for a ride.

 

That's about the weirdest thing I've heard. I can't even imagine what kind of pot holes your friend has hit.

Anyway, I've had heim joint strut rods for years and never had any problems.

 

I was happy to have the helm ends i figured they just have to be better than stock, then i get that reply telling me they are basically junk on the street,
He didnt say he broke any just said street use could break them that they are made for smooth tracks not streets,
I cant recall which thread it was in or who said it, it was about helms in general i believe,
Yeah, it really took the wind out of my sails for a few, until i researched it a little, the manufacturer of the helms down right chuckled when i asked him about it, but as you see from my bringing it up in this thread i still need replies like yours to reassure me.

 

bats have seen the same thing

There was some kit being sold yrs ago for C4s;they got popular quick because they were cheap looked like a tinkertoy set. Sure enough members were posting threads about them snapping. Could it be quality perhaps?
Not sure which ones you used but could see where that would set you off.

 

I've found that more times than not, people who say some part or product is junk, have never used it or have any experience with it.

I'm running heim joint on my rear strut rod. My tie-rod ends are heim joints on my steeroids also.

Mike

 

Some people like to have their C3 handle like a "true" sports car.

Others like to have their C3 handle like a 1970s Cadillac.

The choice is that simple.

Period.

 

My helms turned out to be a top brand i believe aurora, sold through VBP
So since my car had the vbp transverse set ups and many of the poly bushing were cracked from just sitting, this didnt give me much faith until i called aurora,

 

OR they are trying to push another product and want to make SEEM BETTER.

One thing that I have found is that no matter how much information some people need to make a decision on purchasing part or whatever it is....they will do as they wish even though technology has proven to provide an improved product in many scenarios....and even with that...they still want to dispute/argue/analyze if the new technologically advanced part is actually better.

So it boils down to this quoted post below.

All depends on what they want.

KINDA LIKE how some people will still feel that using bias ply tires on their auto cross car is the BEST.

DUB

 

If you want to see how much 'slop' is in rubber rubber bushings watch some of the LG videos. Granted, its on high RWHP C6's and C7's and with a different suspension design but it clearly gets the point across....

 

When I contacted Van Steel they told me that both rubber and poly bushings are good and that it all depends on driver/owner preference. They said that poly allows the suspension components to react quicker to change which allows the driver to feel a quicker and more responsive suspension system. They told me that poly bushings will stiffen the ride which may not be what an owner wants. Van Steel said that replacing OEM rubber bushings with new rubber will improve ride quality, without softening it, and handling over what I have now with my 40 year old rubber.
I also asked them about any advantage to using helm joints on the smart struts and their response was that the helm joints on the struts will free up the components and allow the strut rods to react quicker to change and road conditions.They use high quality helm joints and have not see breakage issues.
They did suggest that if I went with poly bushings that I had them or someone with knowledge and experience install the bushings because if installed improperly there could be problems with the bushings and possible squeaking.

 

I agree for the most part....I have poly upper and lower control arm bushings in front for about 10 years now and the difference over the rubber bushings was remarkable...Steering response is much improved and quicker..I must say that I had read and had been told that the poly control arm bushings would make the car ride harder. I do not feel the car rides any harder..springs and shocks mostly effect the ride quality. The poly makes the front end feel more solid. Interestingly, the front feels smoother with the poly control arm bushings, Bilstein HD shocks with 550 springs and 255/45/17 ZR ultra high performance summer only tires...the ride is MUCH better than with the stock rubber control arm bushings, gymkhana OEM springs and AC Delco shocks with the 255/60/15 crap tires. My poly bushings look brand new after 10 years BTW today! I also have a front spreader bar that further tightens the front end. The car simply rides better than any other C3 I have been in with stock components and will outhandle them easily as well.

I also have competition adjustable strut heim jointed struts rods in the rear (on the car for about 12 years now with ZERO issues), along with a 360 composite spring, Bilstein Sports, and 255/50/17 ZR ultra high performance tires and again the car rides firm but NOT harsh at all. The suspension feels solid, connected and rides better than any base or gymkhana suspended C3 that I have ever been in...most base suspension cars are floaty/bouncy and do not inspire any type of driving confidence and the stock gymkhana cars ride like trucks.

I have literally transformed the steering response, handling AND RIDE with heim struts, Bilstein shocks, ultra high performance tires, composite spring, poly control arm bushings and the front spreader bar using the C3 basic suspension design..incredible! The car drives and rides like a modern sports car, not a 40 year old 60/70's sports car.

My 2008 Chrysler 300 with Bilstein Struts/shocks and 245/55/18 ZR tires along with a mopar front strut brace rides HARDER than my 78 as well as my 2012 Lexus IS350 F Sport...HARDER!

Due to the frame flex of the C3, anything you can do to eliminate unwanted suspension flex movement like poly control arm bushings or heim struts is a major win........!!

 

Thanks to everyone for the opinions and comments. Today I pulled the plug and ordered the front and rear rubber complete "Moog" suspension kit, smart strut, and tubular upper control arms. Once again, thanks to Dan and his team at Van Steel. Now its time to start purchasing engine parts and researching upgrades to my steering components.

 

This.

Rubber is the way to go on the street.

The extra edge Poly bushings give you is only useful on the track ie. lapping on a road course.