Good catch and questions.
Often it is too tiring to read every single post in a thread.
Especially when the problem is all over the place.


A lot of what was posted was for flat tappet hydraulic cam and lifters.....that was where I started from with my posts.
Often we assume some information and a certain level of ability. And we cue off of others posts.

 

So I have been trying to get the valve lash adjusted now for a while. 14 of valves seem to be set fine, but even when I set lash with the car running, I still have issues with #6 intake and #3 intake. These must be the valves that i over tightened when I first set the lash, and the cylinder wasn't getting any compression.
The rest of the valves are good.
I've set the last on all the valves probable 6 times now. 3 times with the engine running.
I loosen the rocker nut till I hear the tapping noise, tighten it just so much that there is no tapping noise, then 1/2 more turn.
#3 and #6 intake valves I do the same way, but when I go the extra 1/2 turn, the engine doesn't run as well and i can tell the cylinder has lost compression; it's too tight.
I would say I can only go about 1/8 turn after eliminating the tapping noise until I can tell the cylinder is loosing compression. It seems like the lifter is stuck compressed. Not sure if people would consider this "collasped." Right now I have these 2 valves set only about 1/16 past 0 lash.
Again, brand new roller lifters and cam.
Oil pressure is good, 60 psi when idling cold. 45 psi idoing hot.
The only thing I can think of is there is something wrong with the lifter. Probably some some small debris got in the lifter and/or I wasn't thorough enough cleaning it before installing.

Is there anything I can do to free up the lifter plunger?
Do I have any other options other than opening up the intake, removing the lifter, inspecting, and likely disassembling in an effort to remove any debris?

How much damage have I done running the engine with these 2 lifters so tight?
Is driving the car like this an absolute "no no?"

 

This youtube how-to adjust valves makes a lot of sense.

Method Requires you MUST begin with empty lifters ... No Oil. Pull all lifters, wash & dry all.


So long as motor did not reach coil bind, I doubt any damage.

Better safe than sorry; I'd try adjusting another time or two before driving it. Above Youtube's worth a shot.

 

One would think that if the lifter is clasped you would have to keep tightening the rocker nut to make the valve work. Have you driven it yet?

 

This has been going on for a while and you think you have it isolated to two lifters that may not be operating properly. Sounds like it is time to pull those two lifters, take them apart, clean em, dry em, and see if they work properly dry, on the bench. Then you can feel/see the small movement and determine if they are working properly. Full of oil it will be difficult to tell.

 

An L-82. With 64 cc heads being right at 10-1 compression would struggle to make 350h.p ? And they say comedy is dead😁

 

At this point I would open it up, pull the two lifters, check them and measure everything.
I would also check the springs and the pushrods for straightness.

 

I would have have done more examination of #6 before I did anything else.
Probably would have finally pulled intake and head. Something is wrong.

 

Replace the two questionable lifters.
Drain the coolant through the pipe-threaded plugs on the sides of the engine block just above the oil pan. That way a lot less coolant will run into the engine when you remove the intake.
Mark the position of the distributor housing relative to the intake manifold, and the position of the rotor relative to the distributor housing. That way, timing will be really close when you go to start the engine.
It’s not that hard to remove intake and the two rocker arms to access the lifters. Do not re-use the intake gaskets.
Coat bottoms of new lifters with cam assembly lube before installing them. And change the engine oil before restarting the engine.
Existing lifters may have been defective or damaged during assembly or valve adjustment.

 

Yes, I have driven it; probably about 30 miles. I have tightened #3 and #6 intake valves so they don't make the ticking noise. I'm just worried about the cam driving it like this.

 

How did it Run? Any noises? Just me but i would drive it if everything seems ok. Drive it another 30 miles and pull the valve cover and recheck #3 & #6 to see if you can get the half turn. I know in the past when adjusting lifters that when you back it off till it ticks then go that 1/2 turn the motor will bog for a bit till it recovers - Everything is new so it needs to get broke in. Again others may argue but this is only my opinion.

 

I've been driving the car for probably about 100 miles now, and the lifters still haven't freed up yet. I tried again to set the valve lash while the engine is running, and the lifters are either not filling with oil, or won't bleed down.
I even brought it to a shop down the street from me that has many older cars in there, and they said it should be fine even if it is tightened all the way down...
I don't know, it seems like most shops don't really want to touch a car that has had a hobbyist do a lot of work on it.
I'll probably just take the intake off and inspect the two lifters, and make sure they aren't damaged.

 

So are you saying now that you have the rocker nuts bottomed out ? If that is the case it's not right .

 

On a different subject:
I got my air/fuel ratio gauge set up to help tune the carb.
Right now I have a q-jet with the model number for a 1978 corvette, since the vortec intake didn't allow for the divorced choke on my stock quadrajet.
Rods: 40J
Primary Jets: 76 (sized up from 72 before the engine work was done)
I can't remember the secondary rod size, but I haven't really opened them up since I'm still in the break in period, so I'm not really worried about the secondaries as much right now.
The A/F ratio fluctuates quite a bit depending on the rpm range. It cruises at 13.5 at low rpm (less than 2000rpm), but on the freeway it cruises about 14.3-14.4.
Does this indicate anything special, or is this relatively normal for a carb?

I set my distributor somewhat conservatively, with around 30-31 degrees total mechanical advance (set for the vortec heads I have on the engine) all in around 3100-3200; this uses the silver springs in the Mr. Gasket kit and a mechanical advance stop on the HEI. I know I could bring in the advance a little sooner with the lighter black springs, but I set it set as safely as possible to avoid detonation during the break-in period.

Could this richer A/F ratio at lower rpm indicate the engine could benefit from a quicker timing advance?

A separate issue:
When I am cruising down the highway at a steady speed (lets just say 65 mph) I get about 14.0-14.4; this is probably about 1/10 throttle. (seems normal and I would think this is mainly still in the idle circuit)

If I let off the throttle completely, it goes a bit leaner, maybe even the occasional flash to 15.0, but normally 14.6-14.8. (seems normal and in idle circuit). Another thing to note, is there is a a lot of idle bypass. It idles at the specified 700 rpm, but the idle set screw isn't even touching the lever; i believe the butterflies are completely closed.

When I am cruising the city streets (lets just say 40 mph) I can use even less throttle opening, maybe about 1/12 throttle, but the gauge shows really rich, at 12.5. (this seems weird and i would think it would still be in the idle circuit)
What would cause this huge fluctuation in the idle circuit?

When I give it a TINY bit more gas, maybe 1/10 throttle, it goes back to a normal 14.0-14.4. (this seems normal and I would think it would still be in the idle circuit)

When I give the engine more throttle, maybe 1/3 throttle, I think I can feel the power piston lifting, and the gauge reads a bit richer at 12.7-13.0. (This seems rich, but somewhat normal. Smell of gas if shut down soon after)

When I really gas it, maybe 2/3 throttle, the gauge reads really rich at 12.0, maybe even a flash of 11.9. The secondaries aren't open yet. (This is definitely too rich and can smell gas)


Obviously, I need to change rods or jets to lean it out for WOT, but I'm not sure how to address the issue with the idle circuit.
Would this rich jet sizing cause this weird idle, slightly off idle fluctuations?

Once I change the jet sizes, should I turn the idle mixture screws out a turns or 2 compensate even before putting it back onto the engine?
(I don't want to run it lean to the point it pings)

 

Replace the lifters that will not pump up. Should not be doing that

 

No, not bottomed out. If I keep turning the rocker nut/polylock to get the normal 1/2 turn preload after stopping the ticking noise I can tell the cylinder looses compression. I left the valve like this for maybe 30-45 seconds to see if the oil would bleed down, but the engine just kept sounding rough, so I backed it off again. This makes me think the lifter is stuck 100% compressed.
It just seems like I can't get any preload to the lifter.

 

You could drain a quart of oil out and add a quart of automatic transmission oil in and drive it, that normally cleans out the lifters pretty fast. If that is indeed the problem. I would not recommend tightening down the rockers too much that's ridiculous.and I'd never let that clown touch my car.

 

[QUOTE=7t9l82;1599767582]You could drain a quart of oil out and add a quart of automatic transmission oil in and drive it, that normally cleans out the lifters pretty fast. If that is indeed the problem. I would not recommend tightening down the rockers too much that's ridiculous.and I'd never let that clown touch my car.[/QUOT


Agree. If you think it's ok then run it. All this carb nonsense. Do you have a litter problem or not? That is the question?

 

Well, just a bit of an update.

1st update: This was done at about 150 miles after the rebuild.
I replace the 2 sets of hydraulic roller lifters so that I could put the proper amount of preload on them. Before the lifter was collapsed; not sure how that happend, maybe when i bottomed out the preload?
When i took them out I the plunger was all the way down and they wouldnt return unless I pulled them back up with a little pick.
After doing all that work, I can't say the car is really working noticeably better, but my conscience feels better knowing the valve train has a bit more cushion on those 2 valves.

This is what a good lifter looks like

Collapsed lifter. Notice that little clip and how low the plunger is.

 

2nd update:
I finally completed the 500 mile break in period for the engine when I went down to Monterey for the weekend. I actually went down there to propose to my long time girlfriend, now fiance. So the ride down in the ol' vette made the weekend that much sweeter. life is great!

This put on about 200 of the 500 miles, and all seemed good. Good power, no noticeable smoke, or overheating. It seems this thing will sit at 180 degrees all day long no problem. Maybe it's the manual transmission guys who have the cooling issues with their smaller radiator.
My A/F gauge was still showing some wide swings in A/F from about 12.0 to 15.1, so I still have to figure all that out. You get a wiff of gas once in a while at super light throttle because it goes all the way down to 12.0, but no noticeable bogs or popping.

So I change the oil and life gets...not so great.
If you've been reading along, you'll remember that the oil after the 25 minute break-in period looked bad. I couldn't tell if it was just the white lithium break in lube mixed in with the oil, or emulsified water. So rather than taking the whole engine apart again I checked compression, changed the oil, and moved forward.
Well, after 500 miles, it looks quite a bit the same. So I'm thinking it was/is water in the oil.
This is the first time I've seen water in oil, so I was judging by pictures online that showed it looking almost brown and terrible, but mine just looks kind of milky when i blow at it in the pan. I couldn't really tell when I watched it empty from the engine.
What really validated this was when i poured it into a milk jug and bubbles were at the top of the jug.



I guess my fears of contamination on the head gasket when I was installing were true, despite best efforts to clean and apply copper coat. (maybe?)

What's weird is I would have thought a head gasket leak big enough to let water in would have reduced the compression test reading.
Has anyone else run into this?

I'm kind of hoping it is coming from the intake manifold gasket. Could the good compression test reading validate that it's coming from the intake manifold?