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The T5 is finally here. It is a -196 out of a 1991 5.0 Camaro with the gears that I was looking for. The seller said there was 70k on it and it ran and shifter perfectly.
... ...
I am working on an L31 swap. I plan to take my time during the build. In the meantime, I plan to splice in this T5 as my confidence in my skills to pull the project off grew.
Clutch
My biggest concern now is ordering the right clutch disc. I have a 168 tooth flywheel and a Zoom MU series clutch kit. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/pft-mu5505-1
My current disc is an 11-inch, 10-spline, 1.125 input shaft diameter. The T5 has 26-splines same diameter. I should get a clutch disc that is 11-inch in diameter ??? Such as: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ctf-381017 I would prefer a clutch disc with more of a positive engagement; I have a tough time feeling it grab.
Clutch linkage
I plan to use my bell housing and linkage. Here it would be wise to purchase an adjustable pivot ball and a new throw out bearing. I have read that there are different sizes (corvette only) TO bearings and I should be careful. The rest of the linkage and lever should be fine.
Cross member
The cross member needs to be made removable. Here is the bit where I was originally intimidated but my self-confidence grew . I found a place here that supplies metal plates in 2 - 4 and 6mm thicknesses. My neighbor is a welder for offshore rigs and is confident he can help.
In a nutshell, the plan is to buy four square plates, 4mm thick. Then cut out the cross member in a slight \ / . Once out, I will clearance both ends to 8mm and weld the plates in.
Many people have also recommended opening the exhaust holes.
Transmission bracket.
That should be easy enough to fab up something like the below. The important bit will be to make it "shimmable" to maintain the 2 degree drop. The bracket will be made out of 4mm plates as well
To fit here
Driveshaft
I found a company here that can balance... I am sure they can shorten and fabricate too. I'll need to measure the distance from the Muncie output to the carrier yoke and compare to T5-to-yoke.
Shifter
The stock one feels ok, but I am not going through all this hassle just to have a vague shifter feel. There are a lot of quality shifters out there such as the Pro 5.0. I plan to make a bracket to adapt my Corvette shift stick and make it come out in the right place. That probably is tougher than is sounds. Ideally with the reverse lockout made functional, I have no idea how to do that yet.
Pilot bearing
Mine is new and should work just fine.
Trans tunnel
I asked the T5 seller to cut out his trans tunnel for me. I should be able to fab something up.
Reverse light
A simple connector on the case
Speedo
I should be able to transplant the speedo gears from my Muncie. It probably will need tweaking but should work.
Oil
Let's not forget to check the Dexron III level
Misc.
Bell house bolts, trans mount bolts, tunnel clearance, etc. All minor things... but can be a pain in Belgium.
Last edited by DorianC3; May 20, 2020 at 05:04 AM.
Hope all goes well with the install, you're going to love it.
I plan to post my progress here. I am really looking FW to this conversion. I just need to grow a pair of gnarlies and start by cutting that crossmember. I think, once I get over that bit, it will be downhill from there. My biggest issue is I don't know how to weld worth a damn and part of it is not owning my own rig.
Originally Posted by derekderek
Contact David. Allvettesforme. He makes the plates to convert crossmember. Also you want clutch the match size to the pressure plate.
Aaaah, this is helpful ! Thanks !!!!!! I will PM him.
I will use same size disc that came with the clutch kit
what clutch kit? this job is going to take several R&R of the tranny. i think first install should be with no disc or pressure plate. bolt it to the bell and measure-compare with the crossmember. you might decide the xmember should be back or forward a small amount to make mount go easier. it is time to buy a welder. decent small mig. not the cheap harbor freight type. i think in europe they are called Due Mig. get a real mig welder that a welder is selling because he needs to upgrade. preferrably with tank and regulator, but flux wire will work for the crossmember. any birdcage work and you need the gas hooked up. between the crossmember, mount and shifter redesign, the welder will cost less than the parts. and when done, you still have a welder and know how to weld. now, back to the clutch disc.
Last edited by derekderek; May 23, 2020 at 09:38 AM.
153 tooth flywheel that came with my 176 tag T5. you can see the 10-1/2 inch disc, pressure plate surface, and wear pattern on flywheel. so you check current flywheel wear pattern and pressure plate face size and get a 26 tooth disc of that size. you do have a 168 tooth flywheel on the car now? this stuff is going into the scrap except the black flywheel. it may be going to belgium. Pic of 26 tooth hub.
Last edited by derekderek; May 23, 2020 at 11:44 AM.
Well my vibration woes are compelling me to move forward. I am increasingly suspicious of my M21. Having thrown everything I could to figure it out, I am running out of ideas.
I would have preferred solving this prior to the T5 swap... but so be it.
Next weekend I plan to break out a sawzall... or whatever saw that I can scrounge that’ll work.
HT to @67-427ci I will be using his design for the removable crossmember.
His pics... not mine.
I like the way it is away from asphalt and that little welding is required under the car. I am not sure I will recess the bottom to clear the exhaust.
Last edited by DorianC3; May 24, 2020 at 10:13 AM.
i was going to mention that design. you can do it with no welding. get the C channel that is a good fit. drill 4 holes each side for thru bolts. 2 on outboard edge 2 on inboard side of cut. bolt it up. then unbolt and cut crossmember. bolt it together with new trans in. be sure fit is good. this way if you are too high you can see where to adjust before welding. then weld one side of the adapter to the crossmember. or wait untl you have a welder. but this heavy stuff that the weld doesn't show is a good place to practice. opening the top instead of bottom of exhaust cutout makes more sense. drop crossmember with 4 bolts and e-brake cable. now everything is accessible and no finessing exhausts...
I'm not trying to throw a 'thorn' into your plan, but I feel obligated to pass on a concern I have about your cross-member design. If I am looking at it correctly it appears that you install that unit by lifting it up into position, then inserting the 4 bolts. If that is the case, then when the trans is installed, only those 4 bolts will be holding all the weight of the transmission and the back portion of the engine.
It would seem to me that a better design would be to have the end portions of the cross-member with a continuous TOP plate and the back-side face only (along with the 4 thru-bolts. That would allow your to install the new member by sliding it over the existing members, then bolting it thru both sets of side pieces to prevent it from moving fore or aft. The TOP plates would then be holding all the weight and distributing it thru the remaining parts of the original cross-member.
Just thought I should share my concern with you.... Hope all goes well, however your build it.
I did a Muncie to WCT-5 in my ‘65 Chevelle. A few things I remember:
1 The drive shaft needs to be 3” shorter
2 The T-5 shifter will need to be cut, bent slightly over, and welded back together. Angle is trial and error. Makes up for the “twist” of the T-5 with respect to your Muncie bellhousing. Bolt pattern is the same
3 The yoke is same spline as small, fine spline Muncie, 350 TH. But if you have the 32(?) spline, 400 TH yoke you’ll need to change
Well, I ordered online some steel that I hope will fit. This weekend the plan is to cut the crossmember. Mmm. This is a big step for me; I’ve never cut into a frame before.
I guess I can already start disassembling the console. That shifter is going to have to come out as well. I’ll need to support the engine so it doesn’t tip
over.
Hm. Once the Muncie is out I can check for evidence that could be leading to my vibration issues. My guess is the tail housing is out of round. The bearing was so trashed it actually was cracked through.
Shifter
The stock one feels ok, but I am not going through all this hassle just to have a vague shifter feel. There are a lot of quality shifters out there such as the Pro 5.0. I plan to make a bracket to adapt my Corvette shift stick and make it come out in the right place. That probably is tougher than is sounds. Ideally with the reverse lockout made functional, I have no idea how to do that yet.
I will say I thought the stock shifter would be ok. Absolutely hated it. Could have been old. But I'll throw a vote for the Pro 5.0. The other nice thing about the Pro 5.0 is the shifter handle is actually bolted to a stub on the base of the shifter. This make is much easier fabricate a bracket to offset the shifter. He is a picture of what I did. Small piece of sheet steel, grind to shape, drill 4 holes, and a small bend to accommodate the 18° tilt.
The first cut is always the deepest. You can’t really see it but I made a 4 degree line. The cut was as good as I could do on my back and using a sawzall.
I probably will cut the exhaust holes from the top so I can drop the trans whole leaving exhaust in place. Another reason, in Belgium if the MOT sees this cut they might have issue. It’s best for it to be on the top side. It needs to looks as stock as possible.
Hmpf. I just realized that the exhaust pipe hangers will also be canted at 17 degrees. Since no one even raised this issue I’m assuming y’all solved it with a BFH - Ford screwdriver 9000
I cut the stock hanger, re-positioned the ends to match the tilt and had a bar welded across its length to keep it from bending. Keeps the pipes straight through the cross member holes.
I cut the stock hanger, re-positioned the ends to match the tilt and had a bar welded across its length to keep it from bending. Keeps the pipes straight through the cross member holes.
T5 Install PART 2
,
. I found a place here that supplies metal plates in 2 - 4 and 6mm thicknesses. My neighbor is a welder for offshore rigs and is confident he can help.
I think, once I get over that bit, it will be downhill from there. My biggest issue is I don't know how to weld worth a damn and part of it is not owning my own rig.
